HELP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claimour claim

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Jay-Bruce
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by Jay-Bruce »

Just gathering my thoughts here, but do you own the vehicle outright, or is it financed? As in did you pay for it all up front, or are you paying for it monthly? The reason I ask is not that I want to be nosy, but if you have it on finance, the finance company have an interest in the vehicle and some legal obligations, so they could be enlisted to lean on the warranty company?
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by Rp0thejester »

Jay, please add me to your friends list, never know when I'll need a lawyer.....
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Yes I ask the stupid questions, because normally it is that simple.
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

Jay-Bruce wrote: 24 May 2023, 19:59 Just gathering my thoughts here, but do you own the vehicle outright, or is it financed? As in did you pay for it all up front, or are you paying for it monthly? The reason I ask is not that I want to be nosy, but if you have it on finance, the finance company have an interest in the vehicle and some legal obligations, so they could be enlisted to lean on the warranty company?
hi sir, I don't have finance. I would rather pay the money to you than the main dealer, because they have really messed me up with the vehicle from day one. I don't think I can blame the dealer because the vehicle was bought with 16 months manufacture warranty left and I never thought it could lead me to this suffering...
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

Jay-Bruce wrote: 24 May 2023, 19:59 Just gathering my thoughts here, but do you own the vehicle outright, or is it financed? As in did you pay for it all up front, or are you paying for it monthly? The reason I ask is not that I want to be nosy, but if you have it on finance, the finance company have an interest in the vehicle and some legal obligations, so they could be enlisted to lean on the warranty company?
I can give you a timeline here, to have better idea of what I went through..

21 Aug 2019 - 21 Mar 2021 14500milles with first owner, had first service 21 Aug 2020 (I assumed but dont have record as dealer say stellantis and you will have record)
22 Mar 2021- now 39469miles I bought from private dealer outright , it has then 16 months manufacture warranty left
24 APr 2021 16436 miles first reported Adblue signal failure ( Emission fault code) at Stellantis you east London branch, they restart with computer and I paid out few hundred for other things irrelvant
27 Aug 2021 20227 miles second report Adblue signal failure ( Emission fault code) at east london branch again they just restart with computer

24 Feb 2022 - 13 Jul 2022 26130miles third report Ablue singal failure (Emission fault code) at west london branch, did new urea pump and dpf clean and regeneration, during this period the garage changed ad blue tank twice, I have to take to a private garage for diagnose and presented the video to garage that the ad blue emission pipe is all black and needs replace
19 APR 2022 customer care offered Service voucher which I then passed to service manager, I have kept checking with him in person, emails and phone calls but never got any respond. So when i visited the branch during the long repair, I double checked with him again and he said voucher has been received and will be used toward service once vehicle is repaired
08 Aug 202 28000miles extended warranty purchased through Citroen

23 Feb 2023 - 17 Mar 2023 39469 miles reported engine cut off and advised the admin that the vehicle needs to be towed, but when I arrived in west london branch they rejected and say they dont take disabled vehicle, sent to Brentford branch who also said no and first appointment booked for 17 APR 2023
20 APR 2023 39469 miles warranty engineer examined and declined the claim


15 MAY 2023 Citroen customer care advised that 80% repair cost of the engine replacement bill 6700pounds and rest can be claimed by citroen warranty team, but the warranty (CAR CARE PLAN LIMITED rejected because the agent said my vehicle is 18months and 4150miles overdue in service. I challenged and complained that the vehicle had been serviced in WEST LONDON as they have confirmed to customer care agent, so there is no way it is 18months overdue.
22 MAY 2023 dealer sernior customer adviser said they only hold record of a complete service, was done at London West in March 2023. but again they didnt provide any of the service receipt or proof they should send to warranty company. meanwhile the general manager says the delay has been from me authorising my contribution of 20 % , and there will be 25pounds parking charge from tomorrow

---Findings from warranty company –

The vehicle had been recovered to the dealership with a report of a non-start and the wheels locked up.

Inspection found the timing chain between the two camshafts had broken. The timing belt between the crank and the inlet camshaft was intact and ok.

As a result of the inlet/exhaust camshaft timing chain breaking, further catastrophic damage has occurred.

The last service, which was due during the present owner’s ownership, was found to be some 9 months and 4150 miles overdue, reference the 25000 mile/24 months service schedule.

Given that the tensioner is oil fed with the timing chain assembly lubrication related, there is a direct link to the present failure.

-----------------
so I know it is very long but you can imagine just what I have been put through with Stellantis and You,,, the adblue signal problem could have easily been sorted because honestly the specilist garage spend just few mins to spot the problem. The engine cut off is mainly caused because of the missing service (which wouldnt have occured if they did the June 2022 service, I know it is confusing but I know they didnt do it even they confirmed to customer care and myself that it was carried out.

My question is now even I take up the 20% cost, it still damages me more without the service receipts for the future whether I keep it or sell. thanks for your patience and help a lot
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by Jay-Bruce »

Reading over the timeline, it is highly interesting that the car care limited warranty was purchased AFTER the date of the disputed service. It was also interesting to see the trust pilot reviews of this company, whereby 19% of the ~2,500 reviews were rated one star and lambast the company for shoddy practices. So it looks like ~500 have been through this rigmarole with them:
https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/carcar ... om?stars=1

Coming back to my quasi-legal commentary, it stands to reason that as a customer Ying Xue wouldn't have purchased a warranty they were ineligible for, eligibility for which would include being up to date with servicing. If they did not have the servicing up to date, they would be stupid to buy the warranty, or mis-sold the warranty. It is safe to say anyone who has sufficient wherewithal to be able to buy a fifteen to twenty thousand pound vehicle "cash" is unlikely to be a fool, ergo they would have known what they were getting into with the warranty, ergo it is a logical deduction that the service had indeed been done, ergo the warranty should be in effect. Another way of looking at this is that since the warranty was instigated after the date of the contested service, if the vehicle was not eligible for the warranty, yet Car Care Plan continued to take payments from Xing Yue purportedly for the provision of a warranty that they knew they would not be honouring, they are either taking money under false pretenses, misrepresenting a financial product, or undertaking one of many other illegal activities WRT consumer sales.

Which exact dealerships did you use? For example you mention the vehicle being serviced in WEST LONDON, but is that the dealer at PLough Lane in Wimbledon, or the dealer on Chiswick High Road, or the one on Burnt Oak Broadway in Edgware, or one I've not listed? I'm wondering if sorting this could be as simple as making sure Car Care Plan speak to the correct branch of Stellantis and You. For example, if you told Car Care Plan that the car was serviced in West London, meaning Edgware, but they contacted the Chiswick branch and were told "we don't know anything about that service" they would arrive at the conclusion the van hadn't been serviced.
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

Hi sir it is Chiswick branch that did the service, the warranty team admits that there is service done in June 2022 ( from email confirmation of customer care that verified with Chiswick branch, again no one at this point get to see the warranty receipt or proof due to admin error ). The warranty agent therefore said service is 3 months out of date ( which would be March 2022 but it wouldn’t be possible to do the service at that time with the fact that it has ad blue signal failure hence it was only done in June 2022).

The vehicle is now at brentford (as explained initially booked with Chiswick which I thought would be easier for things since service was done there). Interestingly the staff at brentford said instead of June 2022 service they have a complete record of service in Chiswick done in March 2023. ( it is highly likely a mistake she makes again as the vehicle has broken down in February already, so I would miss service in March 2023 again if it has to be done annually).

If you have checked the timeline I got in contact with Stellantis &you, anyone can see that it is a result mainly from Their lack of skill and care. I feel very bad that a vehicle so young and new has to come to this point when a break down can’t seems to be avoided at all.

So with this fact that it is now totally messed up by the dealer, it might be easier for me to just pay for the 20% and sell it. 🥲🥲🥲
Jay-Bruce wrote: 25 May 2023, 02:17 Reading over the timeline, it is highly interesting that the car care limited warranty was purchased AFTER the date of the disputed service. It was also interesting to see the trust pilot reviews of this company, whereby 19% of the ~2,500 reviews were rated one star and lambast the company for shoddy practices. So it looks like ~500 have been through this rigmarole with them:
https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/carcar ... om?stars=1

Coming back to my quasi-legal commentary, it stands to reason that as a customer Ying Xue wouldn't have purchased a warranty they were ineligible for, eligibility for which would include being up to date with servicing. If they did not have the servicing up to date, they would be stupid to buy the warranty, or mis-sold the warranty. It is safe to say anyone who has sufficient wherewithal to be able to buy a fifteen to twenty thousand pound vehicle "cash" is unlikely to be a fool, ergo they would have known what they were getting into with the warranty, ergo it is a logical deduction that the service had indeed been done, ergo the warranty should be in effect. Another way of looking at this is that since the warranty was instigated after the date of the contested service, if the vehicle was not eligible for the warranty, yet Car Care Plan continued to take payments from Xing Yue purportedly for the provision of a warranty that they knew they would not be honouring, they are either taking money under false pretenses, misrepresenting a financial product, or undertaking one of many other illegal activities WRT consumer sales.

Which exact dealerships did you use? For example you mention the vehicle being serviced in WEST LONDON, but is that the dealer at PLough Lane in Wimbledon, or the dealer on Chiswick High Road, or the one on Burnt Oak Broadway in Edgware, or one I've not listed? I'm wondering if sorting this could be as simple as making sure Car Care Plan speak to the correct branch of Stellantis and You. For example, if you told Car Care Plan that the car was serviced in West London, meaning Edgware, but they contacted the Chiswick branch and were told "we don't know anything about that service" they would arrive at the conclusion the van hadn't been serviced.
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

I am extremely confused now, if according to engineer report service is 9 months overdue which means it should be done August 2022 ( the service that dealer said they have done in June 2022 is the main changing point. I can only think that because they didn't service after all but I assumed they did because extended warranty has been taken out in August 2022, so when dealer didnt respond to my email or phone call requests I assumed Warranty has checked with June service history and is happy to allow me to take the policy out.

It is really impossible for me to carry out service other than in Main dealer (which I know is requirement for warranty) as it has been on diagnose or repair intermittently in the main dealer. Now no one wants to take responsibility but I know it didn't end up broken just by accident at this low milleague. It is a consequence of Stellantis &You lack of skill and care, they have also failed to look after the vehicle well even when it was within manufature warranty. I am all so confusing with relationships between the companies too, because customer care said Stellantis &You dealers are the franchised garage that Citroen doesn't have any power over and Car care plan limited is apprently an independent insurance company.....

any advise will be really helpful please....
GiveMeABreak wrote: 24 May 2023, 18:15
Jay-Bruce wrote: 24 May 2023, 17:01@GiveMeABreak (Marc) - can you do me a favour bud, can you hook me up with a copy of the service schedule for this vehicle? Cheers /Jay
Here's the official service schedule for this vehicle with vehicle and VIN shown:
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by GiveMeABreak »

yingxue2022 wrote: 25 May 2023, 14:58 It is really impossible for me to carry out service other than in Main dealer (which I know is requirement for warranty)
That's not the case. The vehicle does not need to be serviced by the main authorised dealer for warranty purposes. I've covered this earlier in this thread. It can be serviced elsewhere, as long as the garage follow the manufacturer's recommendations and specifications for the servicing for the vehicle.
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

Hi Sir, thank you for the information. The dealer is suggesting that I should have done the service in August 2021 or at 25000miles, the warranty team is suggesting that I should done the service in March 2022 instead of June 2022.

As explained earlier I have discovered an AdBlue siginal problem not long after I got the vehicle in Mar 2021, so it has been in and out of main dealer's garages intermittently. The milleague is 20000miles in August 2021 and 29150miles in March when I send it to chiswick branch. So I could have missed out the first service that I should do in 25K miles but then it is again difficult to do it as I was only concentrating on the ad blue signal failure and waiting for dealer to fix it first before service can be performed.

The key point I think is still June 2022 service ( I am certain it wasn't carried out because there is no record or receipt can be obtained until this day), which I believe is the main trigger to the engine failure. I did request for the proof and receipt for service from dealer without any response. So when extended warranty approved my purchase I just assumed that they have obtained the service record from West london chiswick branch. I just feel it is unfair that I have to take up all consequenses and loss, and that dealer doesn't have to take any responbility for their dereliction of duty. The fact that the general manager threatened to charge 25pounds per day before things are put right and well addressed just make me feel more devastated.

I want to give it another fight, because the dealer has almost made me believe that what I had been through is normal and I should just pay what they ask and shut up... Same with warranty company because again I feel like they are just trying to exonerate themselves from paying the 20% repair cost. Now I know a lot of people tell me I should be grateful enough that I only pay 20% and not the full amount, general manager at dealer also suggested that it is a good deal I should take up or I should remove vehicle from them because I am disturbing their business. But no one understands the loss I had to suffer already...
GiveMeABreak wrote: 25 May 2023, 15:24
yingxue2022 wrote: 25 May 2023, 14:58 It is really impossible for me to carry out service other than in Main dealer (which I know is requirement for warranty)
That's not the case. The vehicle does not need to be serviced by the main authorised dealer for warranty purposes. I've covered this earlier in this thread. It can be serviced elsewhere, as long as the garage follow the manufacturer's recommendations and specifications for the servicing for the vehicle.
yingxue2022
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

Correct me if I understand this wrong, if the service was indeed carried out in June 2022, how could the engine failed? The warranty team claims I am 3 months behind for the scheduled service, however the vehicle was in repair at West London branch at the time ( Feb - Jul 2022 repair period for AdBlue Singal), how could I possibly can get it serviced before it is repaired...

If I stand no chance to win this, then perhaps I will have to pay the 20% and sell the vehicle to save future hassles :? . it really has been worse than nightmares with Stellantis &You, sigh.
GiveMeABreak wrote: 25 May 2023, 15:24
yingxue2022 wrote: 25 May 2023, 14:58 It is really impossible for me to carry out service other than in Main dealer (which I know is requirement for warranty)
That's not the case. The vehicle does not need to be serviced by the main authorised dealer for warranty purposes. I've covered this earlier in this thread. It can be serviced elsewhere, as long as the garage follow the manufacturer's recommendations and specifications for the servicing for the vehicle.
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

hi sir I have so far sent complaint emails to citroen managing director (as customer care wouldn't escalate the matter further) as well as stellantis &You, not sure if I can get response from either party yet...

I have contacted citizen advise who suggested I write a letter first to propose ADR scheme on ground of consumer right but to be honest I am not sure how to address this letter to Brentford branch... A friend suggested I inform the dealer of small claim court directly, but honestly I don't know how to go down that either. One thing I am worried with the dealer is if they can refuse the repair at ny stage? (still confused with relationship between citroen uk, stellantis & you and car care plan warranty company... are they all related in someway or just different companies collbrating together? does citroen has any power over dealership because I get an impression that there is not much citroen can do about dealer...

any thought please? or is it a waste of time in your eyes sir? maybe i should just surrender to the 20% repair cost, and bring back to sell :( :(
Jay-Bruce wrote: 25 May 2023, 02:17
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by Jay-Bruce »

I'm actually pulling data from this thread for those letters I said I'd write, when I seen a notification of you pinging me...

Image

That right there is game set and giro for the scumbags at Car Care Plan!

As I've said before, your moves are:

1. Send a weapons grade letter of complaint to Car Care Plan - I am m drafting this one just now...
2. When they reply, if they don't accept your claim even with the new evidence, go to The Motor Ombudsman
3. If the Motor Ombudsman rule in your favour you're sorted - but I still want to sue Car Care Plan for the hassle
4. If The Motor Ombudsman rule against you, we go back to Car Care Plan with threat of legal action, and spell it out to them that I am after blood, and I will make the process cost them more in legal fees than the claim itself is worth. It won't take much lawyer time to cost more than £1400 engine repair contribution.
4a Car Care Plan take the hint and settle the £1400 for your engine repair - we proceed with a small claims court action for stress, hassle, etc
4b Car Care Plan fight this to court, we will win, they pay the £1400
4c After winning the action for the £1400 repair contribution, we use that as a precedent to launch a separate small claims court action for damages (stress etc)

You'll get your engine fixed and these b@$stards are going to pay for faffing you around.
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

this is not a service receipt I think it is just an estimate invoice, because it reads that I owe such amount. But I think the one I posted earlier is actually an invoice sent to customer care maybe? ( I am guessing it might be the invoice service manager created when he realized he didn't do service for June 2022 when requested, as other staff member said March 2023 there is a complete service history, but all just my guess...

i think long story put short, I have basically been messed by the dealer with the repairs that take ever so dreadfully long so I might have missed the service at expected time (which I thought was very unlikely to carry out due to the fact that AdBlue signal problem not resolved and vehicle still in repair)... But the most important and crucial act missed I believe is the June service (which they definitely not done, first Car Care Plan said they need service proof from June now they confirmed there is service history in June but it is still 3 months overdue hence they still can't authorise...)
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Jay-Bruce wrote: 25 May 2023, 23:40
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by yingxue2022 »

The Ombudsman will take forever too probably 8 weeks :( :( , so I will allow a little more time for customer care hopefully they can do something.. If not maybe it is easier for me to just pay the 20% and sell the vehicle to save hassles from dealer and this warranty company... such a nightmare :oops: :cry:
Jay-Bruce wrote: 25 May 2023, 23:40
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Re: HELPPPPPPP, citroen extended warranty team rejected our claim

Post by Jay-Bruce »

Rp0thejester wrote: 24 May 2023, 20:11 Jay, please add me to your friends list, never know when I'll need a lawyer.....
Added - For the record, I'm not an actual lawyer, but I know enough to be useful in undertakings like this.

Xing Yue - your first letter:

Car Care Plan Ltd
Jubilee House
5 Mid Point Business Park
Thornbury
West Yorkshire
BD3 7AG

[Your Name and address on right hand side]

I am writing to express my dissatisfaction with the repeated denial of my valid warranty claim for the broken timing chain on my Citroen Berlingo Van [Registration number]. The vehicle is currently covered by [warranty policy number] with your company. Here's a brief summary of the situation:
  • I purchased the van in April 2021, still under the original manufacturer's warranty until August 2022.
  • In June 2022, I had the vehicle serviced in advance at Robins & Day / Stellantis Chiswick, using a voucher I had from a previous vehicle purchase.
  • The van broke down and is now immobilized at the Stellantis dealership in Brentford since February 2023. Investigations found the root cause of failure to be a snapped timing chain causing catastrophic engine damage.
  • My vehicle is at ~39,000 miles, the service schedule for the timing chain (timing kit) is 125,000 miles, ergo this is a seriously premature failure.
  • Citroen/Stellantis has agreed to cover 80% of the costs of supplying and fitting a replacement engine.
  • Your company is disputing the remaining 20% based on a perceived gap in the service history due to the lack of a conventional invoice due to an administrative error arising from the use of a voucher to pay for the service.
In addition to the numerous times staff at Stellantis have provided your agents with confirmation that the service has been done, I can provide internal documentation from the dealership stating that the next service is due in the future, contradicting the claim that the vehicle was not serviced. Additionally, Citroen/Stellantis' willingness to cover most of the repair costs undermines the argument that a negligent lack of maintenance precipitated the timing chain failure.

Given the minimal contribution required from your company and the potential storage charges I face, I request that you settle the claim within three business days. Failure to do so will result in the filing of a grievance with the Motor Ombudsman and potential legal action.

I urge you to consider the financial implications and the time-sensitive nature of this matter. Please take advantage of Citroen/Stellantis' offer before it is retracted. I anticipate your prompt response.

Yours sincerely, [Your Name]