DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

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Uncle Tom Cobley
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by Uncle Tom Cobley »

My car is a 2016 so six and a half years old.
Granted I purchased it new from them in May 2016 but was out of warranty for three years and I have had it serviced and maintained independently for the past three years it has 72,000 miles on the clock.
I don’t think they would be too concerned about where and when you purchased your car as it isn’t them giving you the discount but Citroen UK.

It is worth remembering too that it isn’t just the C4 but their entire range of cars and vans with diesel engines effected by this urea problem. I chipped in here because your problem is almost a clone of my own.
Citroen are obviously aware of a problem otherwise they would not of paid for a huge chunk of the bill.

I wouldn’t buy the injector until you have had Citroen put the car on their “ proper “ diagnostics computer and they will then tell you exactly what is wrong and what your car needs, I didn’t even have to ask for any good will gesture.
What happens with the pump is, the computer because of the low pressure doesn’t think that there is any adblue in the tank so keeps pumping and of course flooding the exhaust with urea and then you get the inductant valve stuck open fault show up and hence why you would think to get a new injector.

Also even if you do buy the injector your car will still need to be reinitialised by Citroen to work properly , does your garage have the software that can do this ? Also be very cautious, whilst you may not have any countdown going on I was firmly assured that is definitely going on in the background.

BTW my Dealer is Yeomans in Exeter.
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by NotAnInterestingName »

Thanks for the info. That's pretty exceptional service for them to bother with a 6+ year old car. Perhaps they're angling for the next sale!
I haven't had the same sort of experience from our local Citroen dealer. For starters, it's not a Citroen. I know it is really, but it doesn't have any Citroen badges and the nearest posh DS dealer is lots of diesel away.
When the downloaded sat nav update broke my unit I asked for the Citroen dealer's support - it worked before, I followed their instructions and it no longer worked. Seemed like their problem to me, but even so they wanted £200 for their expert to turn up and look at it. In the end I worked it out for myself - turns out the USB stick was too high a capacity, I tried a smaller one and it updated and fixed itself. So not all Citroen dealers are super-helpful. I suspect that it being "one of theirs" probably was a factor in your case. Also I bought my Berlingo new from another branch of Yeomans and I did find them very good when I asked about issues, definitely better than average. But we live elsewhere in the country now.
I'm getting an injector and sensor fitted by the local indie garage. I've got a laptop and the usual unofficial Lexia/Diagbox installation so can clear errors, initialise the system and whatever. This produced all the reports I've included in this thread. If things point towards the pump then I'll be looking at options for reconditioning the existing one - I believe this can be possible but haven't looked into it in detail as I'm hoping it won't be necessary.
Meanwhile, the thing is currently running absolutely perfectly, the yellow light cleared itself and no bad smells or clouds. So whatever the cause, it's definitely intermittent. For all I know it might never happen again, but I've already ordered the parts so may as well get them changed.
One random guesswork theory is that it was fairly low on AdBlue - 6L of 16L, we've had a heatwave, the car is permanently parked in the sun and is black. It's possible that the AdBlue may have got highly concentrated, it's 68% water and the cap has an air vent. I brimmed it with 10L of new and it's been fine ever since. Perhaps there's no connection, or perhaps I fixed it by diluting it back down to sensible levels. All guesswork, there's no way of knowing.
I've got the £60 ebay injector now - no PSA/Stellantis box but looks completely identical to every official one I've seen online after comparing in great detail. I suspect it's come directly from PSA's manufacturer rather than from them. I think this would have been £150+ from a dealer, so hopefully that's a good starting saving. This is the listing for info, now out of stock but other listings available from the same seller...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/384992207403

A fairly new seller, doesn't have a business seller account. Reward usually requires some risk!
Uncle Tom Cobley
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by Uncle Tom Cobley »

AFAIK the pump is not serviceable and is built/ sealed into the urea tank hence why you have to have a new tank.
A new urea injector is actually £182 from Citroen but £120 with next day delivery from that parts dealer I gave you ( genuine part in PSA box )
The adblue tank was £820 incl next day delivery £1100 from Citroen but just a heads up there is a 2/3 week back order if getting it from a Citroen parts counter . So it’s well worth a call if you need genuine Citroen spares.

But best of luck with it all.
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Just bear in mind the tanks for your C4 GP and the DS5 are completely different, but the prices are similar.
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Marc
NotAnInterestingName
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by NotAnInterestingName »

That most recent computer report I posted previously points entirely at the sensor - not the injector. I'd already ordered the injector so may as well have it fitted anyway, but the sensor appears to be the cause. One is on the way, as soon as it arrives I'll phone our local very helpful local independent garage.

My best guess is that the first bunch of reports were nonsense random reports while it was misbehaving, the second report was when it had completely died, but now it appears to have come back to life. It may be as simple as a corroded contact but as I need to pay someone to fix it due to my drive being on a slope, it makes sense to just replace the sensor and injector, after which I'll do the initialisation procedure.

Time will tell, but I'm hopeful that a new tank won't be needed. I don't think that's misplaced hope, there are many potential causes of AdBlue issues and the tank is just one. I promise to update this thread a month or so down the line if all is still well. Of course I will also update if random urea issues re-emerge.

Does anyone know if I'm OK to drive home from the garage before doing the initialisation (probably 3 miles), or do I need to take the laptop etc there and do it in their car park?
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by GiveMeABreak »

As long as the prohibited engine restart issue is not preventing you from driving you will be ok to drive, but may get some warnings of course.
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Marc
wheeler
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by wheeler »

Uncle Tom Cobley wrote: 01 Nov 2022, 14:31 AFAIK the pump is not serviceable and is built/ sealed into the urea tank hence why you have to have a new tank.
You can actually remove all the bits from the tank no problem its just that PSA don't sell the individual parts.
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by NotAnInterestingName »

I've just received the £350 sensor that I got for £100 from ebay. Looks absolutely genuine and perfect, in hologrammed (but opened) box, definitely never fitted and looks totally genuine, so a great saving.

The only problem is that the car has been running absolutely perfectly for over a week. The crystallised AdBlue from around the exhaust has been washed away by the rain, the exhaust smells of approximately nothing and no yellow lights on the dash at all.

Perhaps a spider climbed up the exhaust and died on the NOx sensor, and I got a load of nonsense messages while its corpse burnt away, I've got absolutely no idea.

I now have to decide whether to fit the new parts onto a car that appears to be working absolutely perfectly. I probably will, I've already bought the bits so only fitting labour still to pay for.

I had the same with the directional headlights a few months ago - a riot of terrible warnings and lights, the sat nav directing me to the nearest dealer. I did nothing, it went away, never to be repeated again.

I'm discovering that ownership of an ageing techy spaceship can be a bit of a rollercoaster ride.
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by wheeler »

Not sure what kit you have but it's not unusual to have to heat these to get them out, some come out easy & some need Dr Thermal. If I have to use heat on them I normally need to chase the threads out to afterwards. I'd leave it alone just now unless it gives you any more problems.
NotAnInterestingName
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by NotAnInterestingName »

Thanks, will tell the garage that, just about to book it in. I think they're pretty capable there so hopefully not a problem for them.

I've seen mentioned on a YouTube video that these PSA cars have a concept of a "pending" fault, which doesn't light up the yellow light until a period of time or mileage. So it's possible that it is still happening now and then but would only become apparent on a long journey. All guesswork though, but it definitely was very poorly while it was misbehaving, evidenced by the mass of white residue around the exhaust, so I do feel the need to fix something. I don't want the combined DPF unit to get caked up with crystalised AdBlue, that could get expensive.
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by NotAnInterestingName »

I've booked it in at the garage in a few days' time.

And just to prove I made the right choice, today I got the full yellow light show together with the Urea light again, together with steam clouds that looked like a Top of the Pops stage when I was parking. I won't even bother plugging the PC in this time, will just leave it parked until the injector and sensor have been changed, then clear errors, reset the AbBlue system and hopefully this issue will never re-appear (fingers crossed).
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by NotAnInterestingName »

Update: Got the parts fitted today at the local garage, then used Diagbox to...
  • Clear all errors (mostly a list of various Nox issues)
  • Initialised the DeNox system
  • Ran a DPF regen
The DPF regen was recommended by the garage. Seemed like a sensible idea, they are separate issues but very closely related - in fact the AdBlue gets injected just upstream of the DPF so an overdose could have been causing issues and/or a regen may manage to burn away the excess AdBlue that had been squirted in. I've never done this before and don't know what a regen normally looks like, but I had some pretty thick clouds coming out. They looked like grey smoke rather than white steam but hard to tell. Then it gradually diminished, after which the regen procedure ended.

Followed this with a decent length test drive on an already warm engine, so presumably hot enough for the AdBlue to be getting injected. All seemed completely well.

Too early to count any chickens, but I'm hopeful it's fixed.

Total cost £100 sensor + £60 injector + £32 labour, so under £200. I'm guessing this job would have been multiples of this cost at the dealer, parts alone would have been £500-ish.
Uncle Tom Cobley
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by Uncle Tom Cobley »

Fingers crossed for you 🤞Like you I had a new injector fitted and mine went ten days without a hiccup then boom !! It all went South again.
As you know from my posts I had no choice but to take it to the main dealers.
Outcome was a New tank and touch wood all is good in the hood at the moment.
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by NotAnInterestingName »

I know, whatever the issue was it was intermittent anyway. So the fact it's running OK after clearing the errors proves nothing - I did just the same before fitting the new bits and it was fine for a few days, probably about 100 miles-ish. So definitely not whooping for joy just yet.

Definitely no clouds of steam or ammonia smell. But this was the case when it intermittently decided to work properly anyway, between bad spurts. What I can say is it's definitely had a good run while hot today, previous runs when it randomly behaved itself were all short journeys. I don't think the AdBlue does anything until it's warmed up, so it's possible that it was only appearing to be happy previously as it had never properly warmed up.

I'll note the mileage tomorrow and will update again in another 500 miles, if it manages that then I'll declare it fixed and engage smug mode. Until then it's definitely under observation, fingers remain crossed and I remain nervous!
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Re: DS5 AdBlue Issues P20EE00 P20F600 P2A0000 P16EA00

Post by NotAnInterestingName »

A follow-up as promised... after 600 miles all is absolutely perfectly well. So I'm confident it's fixed.

Including garage labour, my AdBlue issue cost under £200, and that included replacement of the injector that probably wasn't needed but was just changed as a precaution. So thankfully AdBlue issues don't always mean a four-figure sum to repair, especially not if you stay well away from main dealers.

I'm finding my hybrid-DIY approach works pretty well - parts from ebay, fitted by good local garage, I do the computer stuff.

Thanks very much to all who helped, this forum's proving extremely valuable and I just hope that my waffle is useful to someone else with similar issues one day.