AL4 software update

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Mr Micawber
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by Mr Micawber »

wheeler wrote:
01 Nov 2021, 23:23
With the old Lexia you can also update directly off the CD rom disc. If you have a late version you can do this too, again no dealer login required.
Thanks for your thoughts wheeler. My Lexia came installed on a laptop with no CD ROM. It lists various software updates but it's only a list with no facility to install anything!

I spoke to a once Peugeot-Citroen dealer, now independent. He said that connection to the company's servers is now required to do software updates. I therefore ended up with a booking (tomorrow) at an expensive main dealer. :(

Simon
wheeler
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by wheeler »

That’s correct if you want the latest updates, I imagine they stoped producing software updates for your car years ago.
If you have an old version of Lexia you can still do it directly off the cd rom. I have an old version with CD 41 installed & it has the update on it for the new style electrovalves. I checked when you originally made the post.
Did you go in & check the version & date you have?
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Mr Micawber
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by Mr Micawber »

wheeler wrote:
10 Nov 2021, 18:55
I have an old version with CD 41 installed & it has the update on it for the new style electrovalves ...
Did you go in & check the version & date you have?
Hi and thank you for your continued help which is much appreciated.

My Lexia is described as "Lexia - PP2000" on the Boot menu. Can you tell me how to find the version and date please?

I had a very unproductive experience at the main dealer yesterday. They said that they have done this update before on other cars but it's not being offered when they connect my car to their diagnostics. The frustrating thing is that it's listed on my Lexia but I cannot download it because I don't have any CD ROMs. In the meantime the gearbox keeps going into emergency mode, which I'm hoping is because the update isn't installed so the electrovalves aren't working properly.

Thanks again for your interest,

Simon
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Normally the dealer diagnostics will determine if an update is required or not. Updates may be provided to fix certain issues - but are not generally applied unless there is a known requirement to do so. Therefore, logically speaking, are you sure your ECU has not already been updated - hence why no update is being offered?
wheeler
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by wheeler »

Mr Micawber wrote:
12 Nov 2021, 12:01


My Lexia is described as "Lexia - PP2000" on the Boot menu. Can you tell me how to find the version and date please?
Im not sure if you mean The version of the gearbox ECU or the Version of Lexia?
To find the gearbox ECU version & date do a global test then go into gearbox, once in there select identification (this is usually the first option).
This should display the software info & the date it was installed, if its the original software on the ECU it sometimes displays either dashes or 00/00/0000.
You want to see the following numbers (or higher) to know if its the version you need.
Supp: 004
Sys: 092
App: 008
Ver: 037
Version: 1001
And a date thats newer when the car was made.

To see the Lexia version just go to the main menu & scroll down, you should see a menu “whats new in CDxx then when you select it you can see main new features that have been added. This one was for the release of the X7 C5.
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Mr Micawber
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by Mr Micawber »

GiveMeABreak wrote:
12 Nov 2021, 12:41
... are you sure your ECU has not already been updated ...
Hello Marc. Thanks for your post. To answer your question:
  • We've owned the car from new. Apart from free services and fault rectification during the warranty period, the car has never been to a main dealer.
  • I've looked at the gearbox data on my Lexia. It says: Number of downloads = 1. Downloading date = 06.06.03. This is when the car was built.
  • The Citroen software update is listed on my Lexia as necessary only when the electrovalves have been changed to Borg Warner. This is confirmed by Citroen's technical documentation which I have. It follows that the update is not an automatic process, it has to be specifically chosen, downloaded and installed. Why would anybody do that when the BW electrovalves were not yet fitted?
  • If the update had already been done, it would have been incorrect for the existing Acutex electrovalves so a malfunction would be expected. This fault only occurred a year ago.
  • If the update had already been done, why am I still getting the pressure fault code (06) and why is the gearbox selecting emergency mode?
What do you think Marc? If my reasoning is incorrect please let me know!
GiveMeABreak wrote:
12 Nov 2021, 12:41
Updates ... are not generally applied unless there is a known requirement to do so.
I agree. :) There is a known requirement to do so; the Borg Warner electrovalves have been fitted. However, Citroen doesn't know that because I fitted them. Nevertheless, I would expect the update to be available to the dealer for download. I have asked the dealer to refer the problem to Citroen UK but I am not at all optimistic, hence appealing for assistance from this forum.

Thanks for your interest and suggestions.

Simon
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Mr Micawber
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by Mr Micawber »

wheeler wrote:
12 Nov 2021, 14:35
You want to see the following numbers (or higher) to know if its the version you need.
Supp: 004
Sys: 092
App: 008
Ver: 037
Version: 1001
And a date thats newer when the car was made.
Hi there,

I misunderstood your last question, my apologies.
This is the gearbox ECU data I could find:

AL4 (Siemens)
System: 92
Application code: 08
Software versions: 37 and 1001
No. of downloads: 1
Downloading date: 06.06.03
Software ref. 965 001 0680

In the list of downloadable files I have this:

Vehicle: Citroen C3
Type: AL4
Engine: TU3JP
Plate: -
ECU: -
Supp: 004
Sys: 092
App: 008
Ver: 037
Version: 1001
Incidents: IMPERATIVE: to be downloaded when fitting Borg Warner electrovalves.

The numbers above are the same as you have quoted.
There is no facility for me to select this file for download. In any case, I have no CD ROMs and my Lexia is not connected to the internet.
When I select downloading to the AL4 ECU I see "Please wait" followed by "Your software is up to date".
This is what the dealer reported as well.
To see the Lexia version just go to the main menu & scroll down, you should see a menu “whats new in CDxx ...
Sorry, my Lexia doesn't have the menu you mention.

I hope that this is useful and please let me know if you need to know anything else.

Simon
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by GiveMeABreak »

So what you have written above indicates the same version to me as the update you are trying to apply and why I originally mentioned that the software may already have been updated. If you car was serviced by Citroen, it's possible they may have already updated it - this is normal practice when they service the cars to check whether there are any updates to apply.

It should also be noted that the software applied as a result of replacement of electrovalves to the BW variant is designed to be compatible with both the BW and the original ACUTEX electrovalves. I quote from the official document:
The automatic gearbox ECU software evolves to be compatible with both types of electrovalve.
So that would make sense if the update was indeed already applied early on as a matter of routine checking during service.
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by wheeler »

Mr Micawber wrote:
12 Nov 2021, 14:46
It follows that the update is not an automatic process, it has to be specifically chosen, downloaded and installed.
With Lexia there is no way to do this, when you do an online update it will just update it to the latest version available for that particular ECU, there is no way to pick & choose a particular update. If doing it from CD again if you have the Lexia disc in the drive it will just update to the latest available for that ECU, you cant select specific files. You can however insert specific CD’s with specific updates. This would be very rare & normally used for test/beta purposes.
As marc has said I believe that the updated software is backwards compatible with the old EV’s.
It looks to me that you already have the later software which was factory installed.
Remember the gearbox you have fitted could be a year older that your car, sitting a warehouse shelf. The ECU could be a lot newer.

What is the P code you are getting in the transmission?
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by xantia_v6 »

Wheeler (drifting slightly off topic), Do you happen to know the version number or disk number of the Xantia 4HP20 update which disabled the "hold 1st gear until 30MPH while cold" feature. I have heard from reliable sources that the update existed on a Lexia CD. I believe it was only installed at customer request, but of course no customer knew of its existence.
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by wheeler »

At a guess with it being a Xantia something like this would have been available from late 20's version, remember the later versions of Lexia discs will have old updates too. If you had CD41 installed it should cover this update.
I'm not back at home till Monday now so cant check for a specific version number for you right now, Its not a specific update i have heard of though.
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by xantia_v6 »

No urgency, as the car and lexia CDs are half a world away from me.
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Mr Micawber
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by Mr Micawber »

GiveMeABreak wrote:
12 Nov 2021, 15:28
If you car was serviced by Citroen, it's possible they may have already updated it - this is normal practice when they service the cars to check whether there are any updates to apply.
Hi Marc,

Yes, that is possible I suppose but I have no proof one way or the other.
It should also be noted that the software applied as a result of replacement of electrovalves to the BW variant is designed to be compatible with both the BW and the original ACUTEX electrovalves. I quote from the official document:
The automatic gearbox ECU software evolves to be compatible with both types of electrovalve.
I think that quote from the Citroen documentation is ambiguous. For example, I took it to mean that the ECU does not need to be replaced and re-programmed. Rather the existing ECU can be updated, hence the use of the description "evolution".
The documentation also stresses the importance of the software "update" once the BW valves have been fitted. If it is normal practice to update software at each service, and that it is compatible even with the Acutex valves, then the "urgent" and "imperative" warnings would not be necessary. We're in muddy waters here I think.

Simon
Last edited by Mr Micawber on 15 Nov 2021, 10:46, edited 1 time in total.
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Mr Micawber
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by Mr Micawber »

wheeler wrote:
12 Nov 2021, 16:02
What is the P code you are getting in the transmission?
Hi,

I'm familiar with P codes but my Lexia doesn't give them. This is what it displays:

06 Pressure regulation, difference/setting.

Simon
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Re: AL4 software update

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Yes it just means the new software version (once updated) is backwards compatible.

As you have the same software version, it's already been done - and if not at a service then it was already applied at the factory. As soon as they have something like this where an update is provided that is backward compatible - it becomes the standard software version for all later builds to save time and expense at the dealer applying it down the line. Obviously earlier vehicles are excluded, hence the bulletin.

If you can provide your VIN, I'll check the build date.