508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

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jmaja
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Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

GiveMeABreak wrote: 28 Jul 2021, 14:34 Your vehicle is on the cusp of the changes, so Diagbox 7.** won't work with many newer systems.
Yes, I know. While I installed Diagbox with updating it gradually from 7.01 to 7.82 it was just the last few ones that had EDC17C60 as an engine option. And still quite a few ECU's are not automatically recognized, but most seem to work quite well when manually chosen.

I had already SCR leak error codes last autumn when the urea tank was replaced. Strange if they didn't do the actions required in the bulletin.
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Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by GiveMeABreak »

They will only do those if the specific fault codes are showing when the vehicle was in. It looks like you have an issue since them - they would of spotted the crystalised UREA at the time I would of thought.
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jmaja
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607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

The car worked about OK for more than a half year. Then came again the "risk of particulate filter clogging, see handbook" and the power was gone. Nothing happens above 3000 rpm and it is very slow to accelerate to motorway speed.

Before that I had been driving mainly 17 km distances, mostly 80 km/h. Whenever I noticed the regeneration is on, I continued to drive. I also continued when the warning came. Now I have been driving a few 30 km at 80 km/h, but it wont do the regeneration. It just gives this "risk of particulate filter clogging, see handbook", when I would expect it to start the regeneration.

Along with this came very long glowing times, especially during colder days, but also now at +10 C. It can take 30 s and quite often there is a problem with the key detection (wireless system, keys in my pocket) first. I don't know if that is related, but it started after the first "risk of particulate filter clogging, see handbook".

Yesterday I spent a few hours trying to solve this with my DiagBox (7.82). I found the following error codes:

P208E 00 DeNOx system circuit
Cause Local
Status Temporary
Characterisation of the fault Detection of a blockage

P20F6 00 DeNOx system circuit
Cause Local
Status Temporary
Characterisation of the fault Leak detection

P2A00 00 NOx sensor
Cause Local
Status Temporary
Characterisation of the fault Richness measurement faulty

P2204 00 NOx sensor
Cause Local
Status Temporary
Characterisation of the fault Faulty measurement of the NOx content

P2452 64 Particle filter differential pressure
Cause Local
Status Temporary
Characterisation of the fault Plausibility fault

P2002 00 Particulate filter
Cause Local
Status Temporary
Characterisation of the fault Detected absent

P2463 00 Particulate filter
Cause Local
Status Permanent
Characterisation of the fault Detected overloaded

P246C 00 Particulate filter
Cause Local
Status Temporary
Characterisation of the fault Detected clogged

P2047 00 Control of the urea injector
Cause Local
Status Permanent
Characterisation of the fault Open circuit

So all related to DPF or AdBlue systems and nothing about glow plugs. I tried to clear these several times, but none of them was cleared and there was no error message in DiagBox indicating failure while clearing. Earlier I have been able to clear fault codes. Also I tryed to do the regeneration from DiagBox, but it didn't do it despite all the requirements were met (coolant over 80 C, bonnet open etc.)

"Distance travelled since the last regeneration" is now 1443 km and "Average distance travelled for the last 10 regenerations" 418 km. Both very much higher than before.

"Particle filter differential pressure" was zero while engine not running, 43 mbar at idle and 170 mbar at 2600 rpm. Last summer these were much lower.

What should I do? Why it doesn't regenerate? Would it help to drive even longer distance? I feel already half of the distances I drive are just to keep the DPF happy.
jmaja
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607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

I managed to install Diagbox 9.68 yesterday and do DPF regeneration with that while the car was parked. After that I was able to clear all the fault codes. It was already 2200 km since the last generation and the car wouldn't regenerate even when I drove 70 km 60-110 km/h without a single stop. Just showed "risk of clogging" several times.

Now the car seems to work OK. I have no clue why it wouldn't regenerate. Hope it starts to regenerate normally. Today engine light came on again with

P2049 00 Control of the urea injector
Cause Local
Status Permanent
Characterisation of the fault Short circuit to positive

So from P2047 to P2049, thus open circuit to short circuit. DPF + urea is really a mess!
jmaja
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607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

It did regenerate today. Started just as I was arriving home. Drove an extra 20 km to get it done.
jmaja
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607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

Still having problems with regeneration. Thw car went to limp mode every 500 km or so and then I forced the regeneration in DiagBox and it worked OK for the next 500 km or so doing regenerations quite often (once per 100 km maybe).

Then we drove a lot more 2600 km in a week, mostly 80-120 km/h. The first 200 km it seemed to do a very long regeneration and the average consumption was around 7 l/100 km, thus almost 2 l/100 km more than normally at that speed. Then the rest of the 2400 km the car worked very well. I didn't notice many regenerations and consumption was low. No warnings about clogging DPF.

When we came back just a few days of our normal driving 10-20 km at one go, totally about 150 km and the clogging warnings and even limp mode came back.

What causes this? Is the DPF on the edge of clogging and should be replaced or opened and cleaned? Or is this car just totally unusable for our normal driving?
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Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by Paul-R »

If the vehicle has done 200,000 km and the DPF hasn't been cleaned or replaced then that to my mind requires looking at. The build-up of non-combustible residues in the DPF would certainly reduce the length of time between regenerations.

I've had a trawl through the thread but don't remember seeing anything about the Eolys level or replenishing. Do you have any information on that?
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Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by GiveMeABreak »

I've just come back to this topic to advise you that your 508 is overdue for an after sales campaign, which is being flagged up against your vehicle. I would contact your nearest Peugeot dealer, provide your VIN and they will be able to advise as to what the work involves. It won't cost you anything, but you'll have a better idea once you contact them.

Regarding your particle filter, the service schedule states this should be checked for clogging at 150k KMs and thereafter at every 25k KMs, so at 200k KMs, it is likely end of life.

Particle filters can only burn off soot when they regenerate, they can't burn off ash or elements of Cerine in the additive fluid, along with other engine deposits. These remain buried in the filter and are what ultimately block it. So at this stage I would consider getting the particle filter replaced or deep-cleaned, but bear in mind even a deep clean is unlikely to restore it to 100% of capacity as it was when new.
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jmaja
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Joined: 09 Jul 2021, 22:29
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607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

GiveMeABreak wrote: 22 Aug 2022, 10:07 I've just come back to this topic to advise you that your 508 is overdue for an after sales campaign, which is being flagged up against your vehicle.

Regarding your particle filter, the service schedule states this should be checked for clogging at 150k KMs and thereafter at every 25k KMs, so at 200k KMs, it is likely end of life.

So at this stage I would consider getting the particle filter replaced or deep-cleaned, but bear in mind even a deep clean is unlikely to restore it to 100% of capacity as it was when new.
It took a while to get a someone to answer from Peugeot service. They seem to be very busy. There are two campaigns for my car. One is the timing belt replacement. They did it (+gears) two years ago and want for some reason to do it again after 4 years/60 000 km whichever comes first. For me it will be 4 years more likely. I think they said 2 years when they did the first change. I may remember wrong or they have increased it to 4.

The other campaign was checking some part of catalysator (not DPF) for corrosion. This was a bit strange, since they said it has been on since 2018 and in 2020 two campaigns were done on my car. Haven't heard about this one before! Why they didn't do that earlier?

I asked the service what does it mean to check for clogging as per service schedule. They just use DiagBox km report. Mine says the DPF is still good for about 60 000 km.

There must be some way of telling from the data given by DiagBox should the DPF be cleaned or replaced due to clogging. The car has been driven 215 000 km and since I bought it (188 000 km) DiagBox has estimated the DPF to last to about 280 000 km. The DPF problems first appeared during summer 2021.
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Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by Paul-R »

Paul-R wrote: 22 Aug 2022, 10:02I've had a trawl through the thread but don't remember seeing anything about the Eolys level or replenishing. Do you have any information on that?
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Inside every old person is a young person wondering what the hell happened.

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jmaja
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Joined: 09 Jul 2021, 22:29
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My Cars: 508 1.6 BlueHdi 2016
607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

Forgot about Eolys. DiagBox says there is about 800 ml left of about 1300 ml. That's only calculated. Haven't checked the actual level. Where is the container?
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607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

Amount of additive in the additive tank 850 ml
Additive reservoir volume 1370 ml
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Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by Paul-R »

So I would guess that the Eolys has been refilled before the 188,000 km mark, probably around 130,000 km. It looks like cleaning or replacing the DPF is the next step. At least it needs looking at.
As I get older I think a lot about the hereafter - I go into a room and then wonder what I'm here after.

Inside every old person is a young person wondering what the hell happened.

"Trying is the first step towards failure" ~ Homer J Simpson​
jmaja
Posts: 19
Joined: 09 Jul 2021, 22:29
Location: Finland
My Cars: 508 1.6 BlueHdi 2016
607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

What is the part number of DPF for my car?
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Joined: 09 Jul 2021, 22:29
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607 2.2 2005

Re: 508 1.6 BlueHDi lack of power

Post by jmaja »

I finally got the DPF part number. They usually wont tell, but this time the second Peugeot service I called did. 9823467180

It was much less expensive than I thought. 801 € for the actual filter + 33 € for pressure sensor pipes + about 20 € for seals etc. I have heard they would cost 1500-2000 €.

Still very expensive for a car worth 10 000 €. Never ever have I paid more than 500 € for parts needed for repair during 35 years of repairing my own cars.
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