Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

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rrijken
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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

Took it for a drive today and looked at numbers. At idle without airco, injectors have a lower voltage then stated at 750rpm, idle is around 700 though so should be lower guess.

Standing out though is the downstream sensor. At closed loop this should fluctuate very slightly, but this fluctuates quite a lot from 70 to around 700mV and showes 'rich' for very long times. Upstream is fluctuating a lot and switches between weak and rich normally think.

Is the O2 sensor broken? And if yes, which one?

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Robert - are you getting any new faults up? A faulty O2 sensor should result in a fault code identifying the issue and the sensor.

rrijken
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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

Nope, that's the problem. No fault recorded at all....

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

Went through the journal again, have two old P0012 in there (now 122000km, both at around 115000), rest are all:

426 x A4C5
164 x F9D1
4 x B9C6
3 x U2118
2 x F8E8
1 x F5FF

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by GiveMeABreak »

A4C5 is a short circuit of the high level brake light. It's been logged 426 times.
F9D1: Passenger’s mirror mechanism sensor inputs fault: Short circuit to positive or short circuit to earth (The memorised mirror positions cannot be recalled and or malfunction of the indexing of the exterior mirrors to reverse gear - Suspect Passenger´s side rear view mirror)
B9C6: Memorisation keypad lighting output fault: Short circuit to earth (same issues as above - this time suspect is Driver's Door Harness)

So a few issues there but that P0012 I think we discussed earlier - Variable timing electrovalve: Locked at the lower stop. This can be either a camshaft sensor fault - or more importantly, it has not been timed correctly, which can be caused if the wrong tools were used or they tried to time it using dot punch marks.

Symptoms of this can be (from general sources):
  • The engine may run erratic and stall, hesitate, run rough or have a hard starting condition.
  • The engine may have excessive fuel consumption, carbon fouling of engine components, and various drive complaints depending on the camshaft failed position.
  • Driving the vehicle for a prolonged time with the camshafts not retarding may cause other problems to the valve train or engine depending on the cause of the failure.

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

Thanks. Will check timing then guess. You have a manual for that? Changed timing belts on Rovers and Fiats but citroen will be a first.

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by GiveMeABreak »

I'll put something together for you - will take me about 20 minutes to type it up then I'll put the link here.

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Ok, so here is the link to the timing procedure:

C5 X7 2.0 Petrol 143 EW10A Timing Belt Procedure

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

Thank you. Will report here again, probably with pictures.

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

Had time today to change the left engine mount today after having changed the right one 1 month ago (vibrations in car + headligh beam vibrating). Easy job and finished in a bit over 30 minutes. Drove car home and it did not hesitate once..... Decided to drive a bit more on a road with a lot of stop and go, it did not hesitate once..... Could it be???? Doubt it, but it drove like a dream....

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

A4C5: changed the brake switch to a new one (well had it done when I bought the car). Brake light is working so have no idea...
F9D1 and B9C6: both mirrors work, also with the memorisation switches....
P0012: will have a look at the cam shaft sensor first, part number for this?

Timing, checked the car maintenance note and timing was done at a Citroen dealer so this should have been done right.... Will have it looked at next time at dealer though and if wrong then they can cover the costs.

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

Marc,

Found another post about a peugeot with the ew10a engine doing the procedure without the special tools.

will want to check the timing soon, turn the crank till I can lock it, when locked the camshaft holes should line up with the holes behind the pulleys, correct? If they do not align then timing is out and should be corrected.

woukd you recommend changing the belt and pump in that case? Belt was exchanged at 85000km, 3 years ago, now 122000km.

thanks!

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by GiveMeABreak »

I have a diesel and when I had mine done (at 10 years - so age, not mileage related) I opted to have the lot done. Depending on engine, they have the belt, only, the belt and pulleys, or the complete, belt, pulleys and water pump. I think the complete kit was about £158, so decided on that and had it fitted by my local mechanic. The diesel procedure on mine is slightly different to yours - but you have the official procedure to refer to that I put up, so you need to decide how to progress. All I will say is that the timing is a sensitive and critical operation, so I won't take chances and so left it to the professionals to do with all the right tools.

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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by rrijken »

Result! Today I decided to change the camshaft position sensor and the upstream o2 sensor. I also cleaned the vvt valve. After this I hooked up lexia and reset the autoadaptives as per lexia instructions.

The hesitation has now completely gone and the car reacts to the throttle as it should, no kore dangerous situations. Happy me! On to the next thing. Front washer piper has become brittle at the place where it is attached to the bonnet first (driver's side corner) where there is a bend in the pipe. Want to either replace the pipe or just fix it with some tape or the likes.

have a part number here? Maybe just buy some piping and replace it with generic ones?

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Citroen C5 X7 throttle hesitation

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Hi Robert. That's great news, glad you have finally pinned it down and that may help others in future, so thanks for the update.

As for the washer parts, the piping is cheap enough to buy and cut to needs with various tubes and connectors readily available on the after market, but in case you want parts for OEM stuff, let me know the item numbers for the bits you want:
Robert Pipes.PNG