The Hydrogen Thread

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NewcastleFalcon
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Dormouse wrote:
07 Jun 2021, 10:04
These cars look like they have borrowed the aerodynamic shaping from some of the pure ultra mileage vehicles in the likes of the Shell Marathon and Trans Australia Electric Challenges. Very low and light with skinny low rolling resistances tyres. Quadricycles by another name to me and probably wouldn't fare well in an NCAP type collision with a Tesla X never mind a timber lorry. Interesting though.
This is a Safety information factsheet which Riversimple have produced for the beta version of their vehicle, and the addons which the production version will have.

https://www.riversimple.com/wp-content/ ... eet_p3.pdf

REgards Neil
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

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NewcastleFalcon wrote:
10 Jun 2021, 14:32
Dormouse wrote:
07 Jun 2021, 10:04
These cars look like they have borrowed the aerodynamic shaping from some of the pure ultra mileage vehicles in the likes of the Shell Marathon and Trans Australia Electric Challenges. Very low and light with skinny low rolling resistances tyres. Quadricycles by another name to me and probably wouldn't fare well in an NCAP type collision with a Tesla X never mind a timber lorry. Interesting though.
This is a Safety information factsheet which Riversimple have produced for the beta version of their vehicle, and the addons which the production version will have.

https://www.riversimple.com/wp-content/ ... eet_p3.pdf

REgards Neil
Very interesting that they actually admit than an IVA is the least onerous testing regime and that they put a question mark against NCAP testing. In one of my many guises I have been an RAC MSA Scrutineer - both Vehicle and Environmental. Now, as one of my other hats has been MOT tester and Vosa trained Vehicle Examiner, I can say that there are broad similarities to RAC MSA Vehicle Logbooking and an IVA examination. Neither are anything close to full structural assessments and do not routinely require a Structural Analysis Report and rely on individual one off examinations normally limited to visual assessment and basic criteria along with the use of proprietary parts in their normal function. Once you get into the realms of non proprietary/ non standard, a basic gauging of the materials used and their assembly is applied but not calculated by the tester. If the vehicle comes with any build or analysis reports, they will be read but not necessarily actioned upon. It is not quite that simple if you have actually done it but it is by no means close to a full Manufacturer's Engineering/ Structural Assessment.
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by Dormouse »

I have studied Riversimple's website further and I am intrigued by their Rasa monocoque central cage. It has to rely extensively on interlocking door crash structures and front and rear controlled crumple zones to survive. I know carbon fibre is immensely strong but there is only so much a simple piece of the structure can do on it's own. Would be really keen to see under it's skin. Their van/5 seater relies on an entirely different structure.
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by Dormouse »

I think I would rather have a plywood 2CV Africar than the Rasa. Or better still, the Rasa running gear in an Africar.
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Its a Public Transport Story, but also a Hydrogen Story. Bit of a currently convoluted infrastructure.

Hydrogen comes from Cheshire (Air Liquide)
Oxford-based Ryze Hydrogen is responsible for transporting the fuel to the fuelling station.
The Fuelling Station has been Built by Danish engineering firm Nel Hydrogen
The Buses come from Wright Bus Northern Ireland
The Hydrogen cylinders are manufactured by Luxfer in Nottingham.

and the buses tootle along on the Number 7 route between East Acton and Oxford Circus.

read all about it
https://www.electrive.com/2021/06/24/lo ... bus-fleet/

Regards Neil
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by myglaren »

James May's Mirai - hydrogen cell motor.

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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by bobins »

An interesting video - partly because of the subject matter, but mainly because it's filmed around here so I can piece together where he was driving :-D The editing of the video puts him here there and everywhere for each shot :lol:
Little things please little minds :rofl2:
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

One point James made in the film 475 seconds in as here


You see the hydrogen fuel cell car works perfectly. It has done since the 90's when I first drove one, a Vauxhall. The only problem, I know I keep going on about this. The problem is the infrastructure, which is not really something Toyota or Honda or Hyundai can control. There aren't enough Hydrogen filling stations yet to make this a viable only car. It would be in Germany, it would be in Japan. In Britain at the moment there are only 3 Hydrogen fuel stations open. There are only 10 anyway, but a lot of them are closed....the one nearest to my house is at Cobham in South London on the M25...

So if you are watching this and you are from the Government....GET ON WITH IT :!:
The problem is the infrastructure, which is not really something Toyota or Honda or Hyundai can control.

Tesla might have been stuck selling cars in 100's had they not singlehandedly set up their supercharger network across America, and expanded to all parts of the globe where they sell their cars, and its a vital part of selling their brand. If Toyota/Honda/Hyundai or whoever else wants to sell hydrogen fuel cell cars at scale its not someone else's problem to solve its theirs.

REgards Neil
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Jo Bamford's Wrightbus getting plenty of work :-D . The firm was going under in 2019 but yes potential for an expanding UK industry and more UK jobs.

https://www.sustainable-bus.com/news/jo ... interview/

Regards Neil
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Latest newsletter from Riversimple down in Llandrindod Wells and their Hydrogen Powered Rasa car.

Who knew the Royal Family had a youtube channel :?: :-D



REgards Neil
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Yesterday the UK didn't have a Hydrogen Strategy....need to have one before COP26...so today we have one.

Might as well have it from the horses mouth, I'm sure Dave Borlace will give it the once over on his justhaveathink channel, so I may wait for the moving pictures on youtube to come out.

UK Hydrogen Strategy 17th August 2021

I found a bit which relates to possibly blending hydrogen into the gas grid, long talked about few little projects going on.
" We are also exploring the option of blending hydrogen into the gas grid, with a decision to be taken in 2023 following testing of the safety, technical and economic case"
This always seems like a bad idea to me.
The volume needed would ensure that such production would have to come from grey hydrogen from fossil fuels without carbon capture and storage, as scale production of blue hydrogen hasn't happened yet, and using "green electricity" to produce green hydrogen via electrolysis, with the massive loss of energy in the process, to then distribute the hydrogen to domestic homes to burn in adapted boilers is just plain inefficient. You would be better off just using electricity to provide heating for the home directly.

It will be interesting, maybe painful , how the market for gas/electricity alters over coming years. Surely use of natural gas in domestic homes will be discouraged, and there is nothing as discouraging as rising prices, and with the use of electric heating incentivised. Something will have gone badly wrong if gas heating retains its premier position of being the cheapest form of domestic heating, no one will change, and the domestic sector will continue to burn fossil fuels en masse.

REgards Neil
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

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A NORTH-East engineering firm has been given £14.6m to develop a carbon-free hydrogen engine, protecting 640 jobs in Darlington.

The Government-backed Brunel project is being led by Darlington-based engine maker Cummins.

It is aimed at developing a hydrogen engine, designed to replace existing large diesel engines in road haulage
Northern Echo
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Re: The Hydrogen Thread

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myglaren wrote:
18 Aug 2021, 09:54
A NORTH-East engineering firm has been given £14.6m to develop a carbon-free hydrogen engine, protecting 640 jobs in Darlington.

The Government-backed Brunel project is being led by Darlington-based engine maker Cummins.

It is aimed at developing a hydrogen engine, designed to replace existing large diesel engines in road haulage
Northern Echo
Have to see what they come up with, if it turns out to be an internal combustion engine which uses hydrogen, that wheel has already been invented, and mostly rejected. BMW had one, and Toyota still persist in their R&D wing. Hydrogen fuel cells have both efficiency advantages and no NOx emissions which are produced in the combustion of Hydrogen with "Air"

The presenter will no doubt get the thumbs down so for an alternative little coffee table read try autocar :-D
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/tech ... ome-viable




Toyota's Efforts


Image

Regards Neil