Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

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NewcastleFalcon
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

GiveMeABreak wrote:
31 Jan 2021, 15:54
Yes, some tech is useful but not at the expense of doing everything for you - that would be a killer. I have to turn the Lane Departure Warning off every single time I start the car, as were we are there is rarely any tarmac, yet alone any white lines :rofl2: on the roads - and it confuses the system, so I am frequently getting beeped at all the time and it's quite infuriating - so has become part of my ritual now - start car and hold in button to disable it!
Stumbled across this Marc.....quite prophetic although I take it your car just warns rather than autocorrects with a bit of steering.
GiveMeABreak wrote:
17 Apr 2018, 17:39
Lane Keep Assist LKA: uses a front-facing camera to track lane markings, it automatically corrects your steering if you stray into another lane
This one I'm definitely NOT in favour of - can you image going anywhere with roadworks in the UK (which is just about everywhere) with all the cones splayed across the roads and the lane markings all over the shop - your car would be autonomously whizzing all over the place like a demented dervisher.
Regards Neil
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by GiveMeABreak »

No, thank goodness, just the warning and beeping for Lane Departure Neil. The only semi autonomous thing I've got regarding the steering is the parking, that takes over and does the business if you want to parallel or bay park, or exit from any of these. It's quite eerie to say the least letting go of the steering and seeing it take over 8-[
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Flurry of news stories about mandatory safety features required to be present in cars sold in Europe when they were approved back in 2019. They begin to take effect from May 2022.

The rules apply to
All new models put into production from May 2022.(Existing models in production do not have to comply)
All new cars sold in Europe from 2024 (regardless of whether that model was in production before 2022).

Much of the focus of was on the "Speed limiters and Black Boxes" or (Intelligent Speed Assistance and Event data recorders)

The Intelligent Speed Assistance bit will apparently be capable of being switched off, the black box....not.
https://www.motoringresearch.com/car-ne ... fety-2022/

Yes, the infamous speed limiters: technology that can read limits and automatically slow the car down as appropriate. Yes, they will come to the UK, and no, they won’t be hard limiters. You’ll be able to switch the system off but as a default it will be automatically on every time you start the vehicle. You can override the limiter with a hard press of the accelerator. At least at first. More strict applications could follow in the future.
Image

REgards Neil
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Thank God we're not in there anymore, though I suspect any European car manufacturers will have the same systems. Can't wait to get some American cars over here in that case.

There's one thing I have against the limiter function - I would not call this a safety feature, moreover a danger. If you do need speed to avoid a collision or potential accident - yes you can floor it, but you do have to floor it - even so, this can be hit and miss and there was always a delay in the car reaction.

Second, despite the manufacturers warnings, people do like their car mats - and the number of generic ones I have seen on vehicles that do not have the cut-away for the accelerator pedal are in the majority - so these can inhibit 'flooring' the pedal to the ground to overwrite the speed limiter. They should be removed as unsafe IMO.

Again, we are coming back to technology trying to replace human instinct, awareness and anticipation of things a laser or radar or a camera simply cannot replace.

In my case, I have speed sign recognition - it is great as an aid. Although the signs show up on the dash and HUD, it is up to me whether I observe them or not. As it happens I use this combined with the cruise to maintain the speed limits with a flick of a button, but I would not want any mandating of this.

Same for LDWS - great on motorways - but bloody annoying on winding country lanes with variable, missing, or no white lines and the system goes mad beeping every 2 minutes - so I turn this off every journey or I would end up in the asylum.

I suspect too much 'nannying' will inevitably result in more research and ways to remove such features as we have seen previously.
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NewcastleFalcon
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

GiveMeABreak wrote:
21 Jun 2021, 11:25
Thank God we're not in there anymore, though I suspect any European car manufacturers will have the same systems. Can't wait to get some American cars over here in that case.
Marc, my reading of the rules, is that any new model sold in Europe (and the UK we have already confirmed that we will follow suit) from 2022, and and all new cars, including models in production before 2022, sold in Europe from 2024, must comply with those rules wherever it is manufactured.

Could be wrong.

Regards Neil
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by mickthemaverick »

NewcastleFalcon wrote:
21 Jun 2021, 12:21
GiveMeABreak wrote:
21 Jun 2021, 11:25
Thank God we're not in there anymore, though I suspect any European car manufacturers will have the same systems. Can't wait to get some American cars over here in that case.
Marc, my reading of the rules, is that any new model sold in Europe (and the UK we have already confirmed that we will follow suit) from 2022, and and all new cars, including models in production before 2022, sold in Europe from 2024, must comply with those rules wherever it is manufactured.

Could be wrong.

Regards Neil
Even more motivation to look after my 1994 and 2004 cars to see me out!! :-D
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Indeed...
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Paul-R
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by Paul-R »

When we bought our 2013 C5 X7 (in 2016) and 2015 308 (a year later) I was looking at them with the view that they would be our last cars. Hopefully from the point of view that they would last a long time rather than the other alternative!
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by admiral51 »

It is getting late for me now, will reply in more detail tomorrow but HGV's have been fitted with the tech for quite a good few years.
Without it the following video would have never been posted, it would have been a fatality.

Near Miss

You will need to skip the ad sorry :(

Colin
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by admiral51 »

Sorry for the late update but when you watch the video you need the sound on, and also maybe watch it a second time to see the truck approaching just behind the front of the bus before the bus moved off. The horn being sounded is not from the approaching truck, it is from the truck that the footage came from to warn the child.
I have always believed i am a good HGV driver, but the tech hit the brakes a second before me or any other driver could have and thank the lucky stars that the child ran and did not freeze.
**EDIT You need to remember it is a L/H Drive Truck **
Hope that makes some sense, it is not fool proof, that era assisted braking will still think you are on a collision course as you go round a roundabout if there is a vehicle close to the entry and moving as it is not aware where you are going, ie you are turning left and then right to go straight ahead and that is no fun when halfway round a roundabout the brakes get applied.

Colin
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Speed Limiters & Black Boxes

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Active Safety Braking and Collision Detection technology is good - I have both these systems and have no issue with them as their function is pretty obvious and only act when the driver is unlikely to stop in time or apply enough force on the brakes. I have no issue with these devices.

I do object to any black boxes or forced speed limiting - and just to be clear, by enforced speed limiting, I'm specifically referring to any device that will limit speed to that in force on any single stretch of road. There has been at least one occasion where I have had to get a family member to hospital in an emergency when the ambulance never arrived after an hour, so I had to travel at some unsafe velocities to take them there myself.

It is going to get worse once they close our A&E and build a new one about 50 miles away from the current one..... so I would not want this to happen again and don't want some box of tricks taking over.