Marc's X7, C3 Aircross, Rants, Raves & Everything Else

[myglaren]

Good result there!

[GiveMeABreak]

Indeed Steve, one can only survive on Pizzas and junk for so long. My body is crying out for a curry and some fresh baked bread!

[CitroJim]

That's an excellent result Marc and what a lovely engineer!

[GiveMeABreak]

She was Jim and thanked her for being so efficient and saving me from a Coronary.

[GiveMeABreak]

As it happens, today was taking a friend to the surgery and on the way back the Aircross went ballistic! All ESP functions disabled, multiple messages and then clutch overheating message came on - telling me to decrease use of the clutch pedal! Then I thought I had an issue with the screen, as that went from CarPlay to navigation - which I thought oh no, another issue, then realised it was trying to navigate me to the dealer!

Rang them up and earliest they can book it in is 2nd October!, but have booked me a car for 4 days. I think the clutch issue is a software update according to the tech and I confirmed after the TSB for that, but likely an ABS rear wheel sensor has become contaminated / damaged for the ESP issues - we shall see.

[GiveMeABreak]

Good luck both on resolving your issues... So, let me get this right... If a fault develops the navigation system take over and directs you to the nearest dealer?

I like that!

Yes indeed Jim, but the funny thing is that the dealer couldn't book me in for 2 weeks, so that would of been a bit daft - apparently nobody told the Sat Nav that the dealers are chockers everywhere at present.

I went out yesterday 2 times to start the car to check on the errors (car had not been started since we got back after the initial journey) and sure enough the same errors including the overheating clutch warning still kicking in and the engine fan on full blast.

So that being the case, it would suggest that whatever sensor is monitoring the clutch temperature must be faulty, as well as needing a software update on the engine ECU. Thankfully (and hopefully) extended warranty will cover it and whatever is causing the ESP system faults. We have to go out for supplies today, seeing as the oven was delivered yesterday (which did not fit properly) so we can start cooking again.

I had to remove all the plinths and the washing machine to get to the end of the plinths to plug the cooker plug in from underneath as the wire kept snagging underneath the oven as it was slid back into the unit. Then it was about 1CM too low on the right, so the oven door was scraping when opening and closing. Totally frustrated at this point and 1 stone lighter I found some hard plastic fixing in the shed and sawed that in half to prop under the oven. Perfect fit and oven now level and working.

On another note regarding that oven - although it is the same model, they would appear to have made some changes - notably the interior doesn't seem to show the same weld sections that rusted at the back, so maybe they have made this a complete section now. The oven floor has a different moulding too...

Maybe they have modified it after others complained about it along with me. Fingers crossed. Now on the hunt for a new Combo Microwave as ours is showing signs of requiring a bit longer to reheat beverages . It's always something... spent 5 hours yesterday researching replacements and could find none that were suitable, so gave up for now. Oh, and then one of the iPad's decided it wanted activation and couldn't connect to the servers at Apple - requiring me to reinstall iTunes which I hate with a vengeance just to get it reactivated via that method.

Needless to say I wasn't on the Forum yesterday for more than a few minutes...

[RichardW]

So that being the case, it would suggest that whatever sensor is monitoring the clutch temperature must be faulty, as well as needing a software update on the engine ECU. Thankfully (and hopefully) extended warranty will cover it and whatever is causing the ESP system faults.

Pretty sure there is no clutch temp sensor - my guess is that checks the engine speed vs the road speed and if there is discrepancy between what it is seeing and what it is expecting it assumes the clutch is slipping and will overheat. Since you have an ESP fault, you will Probably find that one of the wheel sensors has gone gaga and is reporting the car going fast and the clutch speed doesn't match.

[GiveMeABreak]

Good point there - they told me it's a known issue (and a TSB for it confirms) and needs a software update for the clutch temp warning. I've been flat out yesterday so haven't even had time to investigate the system yet, so will spend a little time looking at it this morning. Good luck with the Pic!

[GiveMeABreak]

Pretty sure there is no clutch temp sensor - my guess is that checks the engine speed vs the road speed and if there is discrepancy between what it is seeing and what it is expecting it assumes the clutch is slipping and will overheat. Since you have an ESP fault, you will Probably find that one of the wheel sensors has gone gaga and is reporting the car going fast and the clutch speed doesn't match.

Yes, you're right there Richard, seems it's all estimated:

Engine management ECU operating strategy that calculates the temperature of the clutch friction plate:
Estimated temperature of the clutch at 350°C: Activation of the cooling fans at 50%
Estimated temperature of the clutch at 370°C: Activation of the cooling fans at 100%
Estimated temperature of the clutch at 400°C: Display of the message

So probably all related to the ESP issue. Hopefully a quick fix in that case if a wheel speed sensor. The issue I have at present it that my diagnostic laptop is a little too old so doesn't support virtualisation, so I can't run the VMware version of Diagbox V9.** presently, so can't diagnose it myself or see what the ESP fault is!

I never bothered replacing the laptop after we moved the X7 and the C3 on, so couldn't really justify it, especially with the ongoing warranty we'll keep up.

[GiveMeABreak]

So update on my car's issue:

Initial problem started on a journey:

• ESP Fault
• No Hill Start Assist, no Descent Control and no ESP functions at all
• No TPMS
• Clutch Temperature too high warning, resulting in engine fan on high speed constantly and permanent beeps and warnings to limit use of the clutch pedal.
• No Air Conditioning
• No Cruise Control
• No Self-Parking Assistance
• Sat Nav wanting to take me to the nearest dealership (!)

All the above caused directly and indirectly as a result of one Wheel Speed Sensor.

So for those interested:

Because the ESP system now doesn't know the speed of the vehicle (moving), against the engine speed, it thinks the clutch is slipping and therefore (as Richard mentioned there is no actual clutch temperature sensor) it puts the engine fan on high speed to cool it down. So I now sound like I'm arriving everywhere in a private jet.

Obviously any fault in the ESP system and all cruise control and ESP functions are disabled.
But because the engine fan is permanently on high speed, the A/C switches off, which it does when it thinks the cooling system temperature is too high.
Because of the ESP issue, the Auto Parking system can't determine if I'm going backwards or forwards and what the speed I'm doing is, so can't manoeuvre and disables that system.
Ditto for the Tyre pre Pressure Monitoring - as it can't measure and monitor each wheel speed and compare when one sensor is out, so disables monitoring of tyre pressures.

Lastly, because of all the faults, the Sat Nav automatically switches on and sets a route to my nearest dealer! Shame it doesn't know that they couldn't book me in for a week though!

So I wanted to show an example of how one simple sensor can cause so many other things to malfunction.

Off to pick my car up now and return the new C4 (C41)e with EAT8 gearbox that I have to admit wafts along the road with as near as good a ride as my X7 had and soaks up all the bumps! Incredible system without all the hydraulics.

[NewcastleFalcon]

Off to pick my car up now and return the new C4e with EAT8 gearbox that I have to admit wafts along the road with as near as good a ride as my X7 had and soaks up all the bumps! Incredible system without all the hydraulics.

Is this the vehicle you had Marc
https://www.citroen.co.uk/models/c4-e-c4.html

It would be interesting to have your first hand review in the Electric Cars what's Available thread. I always think they are a nice looking vehicle and I like the quirky rear lights. Yes they are too expensive for most, and your neck of the woods may well be devoid of decent public charging, but I think most reviews of the eC4 have been positive.

Neil

[GiveMeABreak]

I made a type Neil, yet that's the car, but not electric, good old ICE, I meant to put the model code (C41) but pit an 'e' instead, so have corrected this.

Same car though and it has grown on me.

[CitroJim]

Gosh, That one simple problem really got its knickers in a right old twist

Can I expect similar sorts of 'fun' from my C3 in future I wonder?

[myglaren]

I wonder the same with daughter's C3. It appears to be performing well currently. Still have to investigate if it has a DPF/Eolys and the dreaded Adblue.
There was a blue light that came on and was worrying her. I drove it and saw it was only a tell-tale that the engine wasn't up to temperature.

[CitroJim]

I wonder the same with daughter's C3. It appears to be performing well currently. Still have to investigate if it has a DPF/Eolys and the dreaded Adblue.

Have a butcher's in the spare wheel well for an Adblue tank Steve, that's where mine is... Most illogical place ever in my humble...

You'll know if it is as there's likely to be crystals growing around it... A small spillage is all it takes...