C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Qube90 wrote: 24 Apr 2018, 11:54 Thanks. I talked to "parkingbrakerepair" but they didnt have any cables to Citroën
Just to confirm - the following are stipulated by Citroen in regard to the EPB:
CAUTION: The parking brake cables and the unlock cable cannot be separated from the electrically controlled parking brake unit (FSE).
CAUTION: Prohibition on opening the electric parking brake system in after sales. If a malfunctioning of the electric parking brake system is diagnosed, it is necessary to replace it.
And just one further thing of interest: The EPB alters the speed of application of the brake according to the car's battery voltage - so a weak car battery can also affect the EPB.
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by RichardW »

That's only dealer stuff though... I'd open it if I had one with broken cables... nothing to lose!
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by Michel »

RichardW wrote: 25 Apr 2018, 12:08 That's only dealer stuff though... I'd open it if I had one with broken cables... nothing to lose!


Yes indeed. How many of us have opened and repaired sealed or "contact your dealer for replacement" parts in the past? I suspect it's more than one of us....
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Well I would be interested to see the results from anyone doing this - but the point being that it would seem the cables can't be unattached from inside the unit...
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by Paul-R »

Marc, you say that the EPB has a defined lifetime use and the number of applications is counted up. Where is the count stored? Is there a procedure to reset this to zero? Does fitting a brand new EPB unit automatically reset the counter to zero?

It seems daft that even if the EPB is still working properly that after a certain number of applications it would cease to work. I can accept that it would throw up an EML or error message but does it also mean that the BSI (or whatever) would then disallow the car to be driven. Equally driving, and thereby parking, without a parking brake could also be a problematic experience.
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by lexi »

Could be that Citroen does these things with their software implementation. I don't think the EPB manufacturers ie ATE or Teves etc, put a lifespan on these units? I used Sikaflex, Self amalg. tape, and Duckhams Keenol grease on the Vel Satis to seal up casings and cable apertures. Dirt and water are likely killers more than anything I suppose.
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

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Paul-R wrote: 25 Apr 2018, 18:39 Marc, you say that the EPB has a defined lifetime use and the number of applications is counted up. Where is the count stored? Is there a procedure to reset this to zero? Does fitting a brand new EPB unit automatically reset the counter to zero?

It seems daft that even if the EPB is still working properly that after a certain number of applications it would cease to work. I can accept that it would throw up an EML or error message but does it also mean that the BSI (or whatever) would then disallow the car to be driven. Equally driving, and thereby parking, without a parking brake could also be a problematic experience.

Ok, so the system incorporated in the X7 is made by Continental Teves.

Diagbox can read the number of handbrake 'Application / Release Cycles' that have been carried out. There are 2 readings actually, one for the normal application and one for application at maximum force.

The system is designed to operate for 16,777,214 application cycles (very specific, don't you think?) of either normal or maximum application. (so no need to panic just yet :-D )

There is no reset Paul - when a new EPB is installed, it must be configured and I suspect that the count information is stored directly in the EPB ECU, which is non-removable from the internal part of the EPB unit.

There are 36 possible specific fault codes returned by the system and it seems to be a very detailed and complex system. So even with some of the automatic functions inoperative the system can still be activated manually.

So no, the BSI would not stop the car or prevent the handbrake from operating whilst it is able to still do so. The counter is really for diagnostic checks and to determine how many cycles have been used in determining any faults - but anything that does fail in the unit like the sensors or actuators will necessitate a complete replacement unit. But it is encouraging at least with that duty cycle figure at least!
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by Paul-R »

Thanks Marc, very informative. It still doesn't tell us what happens after the 16,777,214th application though, does it?

For info 16,777,214 is 2^24 - 2 (2 to the power of 24, minus 2). Why minus 2 and not minus 1? Probably because there are two counters I suppose.

Further reflection. does anything actually happen after it reaches 16,777,214 I wonder. Is it maybe just a case of it can't count any higher perhaps?
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by GiveMeABreak »

There is nothing documented about what happens when this value is reached. As I indicated previously, it should carry on working, assuming it is able to do so.

By my reckoning, at 20 application / release cycles per day for 7 days a week, it should still be working by the time I reach the ripe old age of 2,300!
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by Qube90 »

Took it apart and have taken the cables of. Dont see a problem to replace the cables..... If you could buy new ones 😥
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by EDC5 »

GiveMeABreak wrote: 25 Apr 2018, 22:05
By my reckoning, at 20 application / release cycles per day for 7 days a week, it should still be working by the time I reach the ripe old age of 2,300!


:rofl2: It's nice to have a good margin!

I was worried the limit would be 10,000 applications or something small like that.
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

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Qube90 wrote: 26 Apr 2018, 08:06 Took it apart and have taken the cables of. Dont see a problem to replace the cables..... If you could buy new ones 😥
Continental Teves are based here in Wales. This is where they make a lot of automotive products.

You might consider sending a query via their contact form and see if they would consider supplying you with some cables, here is their link:

https://www.continentaltevesukltd.co.uk
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by Rosanbo »

Qube90 wrote: 26 Apr 2018, 08:06 Took it apart and have taken the cables of. Dont see a problem to replace the cables..... If you could buy new ones 😥


Can you post some pics please.

Is this the same for all models with electric PB, i.e. C4 mk2,

C4 mk2 has a small motor on the caliper, does that make it cheaper to replace?
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by GiveMeABreak »

No they are different systems entirely. The X7 EPB assembly is on the previous page.
The C4 picasso uses emergency calliper motors in addition to a handbrake unit, which in itself is about £826
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Re: C5 X7 Electronic handbrake cable

Post by Xantippa »