Electric Cars:what's available?

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bobins
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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by bobins »

I've found a BMW i3 with a REX at a dealers fairly locally that might suit her. 2018 with 7.5k miles and 94Ah battery. That combination would probably tick all the boxes, though I'm not sure about the styling. Are the i3 any good in the real world, or is it a case of : "Are you mad suggesting that ?" :lol:

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

bobins wrote:
30 May 2021, 12:12
I've found a BMW i3 with a REX at a dealers fairly locally that might suit her. 2018 with 7.5k miles and 94Ah battery. That combination would probably tick all the boxes, though I'm not sure about the styling. Are the i3 any good in the real world, or is it a case of : "Are you mad suggesting that ?" :lol:
The I3 REX was expensive new, and still hasn't hit the bargain basement category second hand. But if the price is OK for the 2018 Model, I am sure they will like it. The REX is just that a Range Extender small ICE Motor which recharges the battery (or maintains it at the same level). Many I3 Rex owners find they spend very little on petrol as the occasions when it is necessary for the range extender to be used are few and far between. In the fully charged vid on it, Robert mentions that one user reported doing 25,000 miles and using 9 litres of Petrol. Anecdotally owners I have talked to at charging points have said the same sort of thing.

This is a 2016 review worth a watch although not as up to date in your 2018 Model, probably the 60Ah version with a smaller battery.



Not a mad suggestion at all, apart from possibly the price of such a low mileage model. With a mileage of that amount over 3 years I would be surprised if the REX engine was ever activated :-D

What is the price?

Regards Neil
Last edited by NewcastleFalcon on 30 May 2021, 13:04, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Here's a little test of Electric Only Range of 60Ah BMW I3 Rex (22kWh Battery (18 usable), 94Ah BMW REX (33kWh (27 usable), and 120 Ah BMW (42kWh 38 usable) (no Rex).



Regards Neil
Last edited by NewcastleFalcon on 30 May 2021, 13:22, edited 1 time in total.

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bobins
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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by bobins »

NewcastleFalcon wrote:
30 May 2021, 12:43

Not a mad suggestion at all, apart from possibly the price of such a low mileage model. With a mileage of that amount over 3 years I would be surprised if the REX engine was ever activated :-D

What is the price?

Regards Neil

Thanks for that, Neil, most helpful. The price is £21k which may or may not be acceptable to her, but is probably in the ballpark for something that will give her the confidence of extra range should she get depserate. I can see that most of the time it'll be either be used for 80-100 mile round trips or nipping down to the shops, but with the occasional much further excursion thrown in for good measure :)

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Of course scratch the surface of the internet, and the odd cautionary tale pops out. Petrol flap day on the FCF!
https://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/forum/ ... 49#p687149

Beware if your Petrol flap on the REX doesn't open when you push the button....although from the comments may have been fixed in newer models, and non-use over extended periods never helps. One of the comments may have had a simpler solution

"You did not hold the button on the (fuel) door long enough I hold mine for 10 to 20 seconds and the tank depresses. You just pressed the button but the system needs time to depressurise."



The other slight negative by no means exclusive to BMW, is that the normal general public driver of a BMWI3 might have to step into a BMW service centre from time to time for compulsory wallet emptying to maintain the service history or correct trivial niggles.

Regards Neil

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by Sloppysod »

Neil, Good point about the Chinese cars being closely linked with the manufacturers we are familiar with in the uk.
My comments about corrosion were made a a heads up as to one of the many reasons why they are cheaper. Is there a government standard for corrosion they have to comply with?
However, if anyone does go for a cheaper China car then they would be wise to get it fully wax-oiled before taking it out.
And yes warranty can only be proven if ever called into action, like all insurances.

Gibbo, the taxi driver was of average build and this just looked like normal use.

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Sloppysod wrote:
30 May 2021, 15:49
Is there a government standard for corrosion they have to comply with?
Not that I have found Stu :-D

I see where you made your original point from with a bit of digging and finding a topic for debate on the MGEVs forum. I have no first hand knowledge but I think the Matt from Go Green Autos Ltd gives a fair view, and follows one of your recommendations! Put one of our German friends up on the lift after a year in the UK and you would probably see something similar. :-D

Spoiler: show
Make your own mind up, I think its a fair assessment, and looks like he's done what all good old school thinkers would, nothing too much to write home about so far, but I'll give it a bit extra protection just in case.


Regards Neil

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by Sloppysod »

Hi Neil, yes good videos, I see something similar from a link on SpeakEV.
However, a few comment.
  • An Ev battery is expected to last about 10 years before its degration makes a impossible to live with, and by then the technology will be old-hat and incompatible with the current technologies
  • So if a car fails its MOT on corrosion and you have to scrap it, and you got it cheap, is that a problem and it would be about £2500 a year depreceation.
  • It aslo keeps the car industry going by making replacement vehicles.

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by Sloppysod »

heres one for discussion. :lol:
Why do EV's need to be serviced so frequently, I understand a Leaf has 6,000 mile intervals, a E-Niro every 10,000 mile intervals, it apears that the service plans are very similar to ICE vehicles.
Why not like Tesla - when the car tells you - possibly never!!
If I have these numbers wrong I am sure someone will tell me :-D

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by mickthemaverick »

I'm sure Neil or Simon will be able to answer that but in the meantime I would have thought that the major service item on EVs would be brake pads. Since the other normal service items on an ICE car are not required that is the only major consumable I can think of. Because of the availability of regenerative braking being a driver controlled function, it is probably sensible to at least check pad wear at predefined intervals. Some drivers will use the regenerative most of the time and some won't use it at all so inspections have to be scheduled to cover the worse case scenario!! That is entirely my thinking and not researched at all so could be complete rubbish!! :-D

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Sloppysod wrote:
30 May 2021, 22:55
  • An Ev battery is expected to last about 10 years before its degration makes a impossible to live with, and by then the technology will be old-hat and incompatible with the current technologies
  • So if a car fails its MOT on corrosion and you have to scrap it, and you got it cheap, is that a problem and it would be about £2500 a year depreceation.
  • It aslo keeps the car industry going by making replacement vehicles.
Thoughts from me.
The first purchasers/leasers of EV's will pay the greatest depreciation within their £x/per month years 1-4, but it seems there are no shortage of takers. Then from years 4-8 first second hand, and onto 10 you can make a case for the depreciation being offset by savings on running costs.

I reckon with my £10,000 purchase price Leaf even if I had to scrap it after 4 years for literally £0.00, I would have saved (and am currently saving) £1,400/annum on running costs/tax/maintenance. Keeping it simple that is a net £1,100/ annum ownership, and less than £100/month with the most pessimistic assumptions.

Of course the car will hopefully still have a value both to me for continuing use, or to sell after 4 years. I would still anticipate a value of around £5,000 at the end of the 4 years, and so far so good and still have my 12 battery bars at 41,000 miles, and I operate the car to assist with long battery life (minimum rapid charging and charging in the range 20% to 80%, never leaving it standing at over 80% or under 20%) and many Leafs even the older ones have done over 100,000 miles.
Here's a link to a video by Euan McTurk who is knowledgeable about these matters being a battery chemist, and a good presenter considering "Will EV Battery Packs Last as Long As the Car itself" which I posted on the Bargain Basement Electric Thread.

viewtopic.php?p=681499&hilit=euan#p681499
On corrosion scrapping cars prematurely, in general these days even in the UK, the standard of bodywork on cars at 15 years old is lightyears ahead of the 70's when the rusty wreck was a common sight on the roads as well as in the scrapyards. I don't expect EV's as a breed will be any less well preserved from a corrosion point of view than ICE, although a decent oil leak can keep some parts of an ICE corrosion free :-D . I also expect current new ICE cars to depreciate like a stone when in 10 years time EV's are dominant. If particular models have excessive corrosion, substandard paint (yes Audi and TESLA have both fallen foul of this and had to rectify a few problems) the internet finds them out and really they just have to sort it out, reputational damage hardly worth any litigation.

Regards Neil
Last edited by NewcastleFalcon on 31 May 2021, 09:38, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Sloppysod wrote:
30 May 2021, 22:57
heres one for discussion. :lol:
Why do EV's need to be serviced so frequently :-D
I would say they don't, other than the normal "check your vehicle stuff" applicable to all cars. The little service booklet I have is pretty unspecific just says if you do over 18,000 miles a year it should be mileage based under 18,000 time based.

My experience so far is that I have done no maintenance at all and have done over 12,000 miles.

Can't really comment on what a service would involve. I have a booklet for the Leaf I should maybe have a look at it :-D Presumably they can come up with a bit of visual inspection check list, tyre kicking, the usual wiggling about of wheels, pry barring suspension components steering components, maybe some air conditioning faffing, or upgrading the latest software, examining brakes and discs for wear, they like to change brake fluid as something to do. Annual MOT at my indy takes care of most of that stuff.

If you are under some sort of leasing or PCP contract, a condition will be service in accordance with manufacturers recommendations, and also with direct purchase or HP during warranty periods similar arrangements will be required by the warranty. Mine has expired so I have more personal choice.

With regen braking really you don't literally have to use the brakes much at all "one pedal driving" lift off the accelerator regen kicks in and slows the car. Much easier on the brake consumables disks and pads than an ICE car, more problems from underuse, rusting up of disks etc than wear from overuse.


Regards Neil

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

What gives the better overview of a car a 10-20 minute video and drive, or a wordy piece to read?

Go on...bit of both... :?:

This bit of reading is about the KIA e-Niro, and I've watched quite a few e-Niro videos but reading this struck home that not all KIA e-Niros are the same. Yes the 64kWh version smashes all range anxiety other than the person who wants to drive from Lands end to John o Groats without stopping. The base e-Niro 2 39kWh version doesn't, coming in at roughly 163 miles real world. Just to confuse matters the E-Niro 2 has a 64kWh version too.

Here's the reading, not sure how bang up to date the prices are, but they are a useful comparator
Regards Neil

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Following on from the KIA e-niro its parent Company Hyundai have its KONA Electric equivalent, also with a 39kWH version as well as the 64kWh higher range offering.

The chap I was conversing with as reported here, who opted for the ICE Version of the KONA indicated that "The electric version was £38,000" Given a optional paint job on the top spec Hyundai Kona Electric he is in the right ball park as it turns out.

Decent read through here about the KONA Electric here at Electriccarhome.co.uk
Regards Neil

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Re: Electric Cars:what's available?

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

One other thing that the development of electric vehicles is initiating, an absolute explosion in the fun side of smaller vehicles, not your conventional and largely unexciting cars. Also in electric bikes/scooters/micro scooters and motorcycles a massive expansion of innovation, daily new products coming out.

Bit of fun and a couple of amphibious ones too



REgards Neil