hi,
you use the boost valve to trick the wastegate in to opening at a higher pressure
it's not like an on/off valve it a tee piece so you vent a little boost pressure off in the pipe between compresser housing and the wastegate so the accuator see slightly less than real boost pressure
you can not alter the spring on a standard accutuator you can buy an adjustable accuator but these are expensive for small mods like these, but when you start asking big boost from racing diesels you'll need to buy one as the standard accuator have limitations i've never seen a kkk on a citroen petrol or diesel
but the engine is the same basically as the 205/306/405 peugeot
and these run garrets t02b good for about 18psi without mods to the turbo
yes the petrol tank will be ok
just you'll have a very large feed pipe but it won't cause any probs
the xantia intercooler might look good but pressure drop across the intercooler is high
where the peugeot might look smaller but its a lot better in efficency upto quite high boost pressures well past the realms of what were talking here i would bin the stock one and buy a peugeot one
Xantia TD Tuning
Moderator: RichardW
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oilyspanner
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Pugs AND Cits come with a mixture of both Bosch/Lucas pumps and Garrett/KKK turbos.
The spring constant can be changed on both, and just to prove to myself i hadnt lost my marbles, have a look at the following,
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ken.waters1/306_tuning.htm
It puzzles me that is the overhead turbo was better, then why would Cit change it for later engines? Space isnt the answer as a overhead intercooler WOULD fit under a Xantia bonnet!
180BHP really isnt all that much since you can get VW diesels with this much power as standard (although im yet to see one).
The spring constant can be changed on both, and just to prove to myself i hadnt lost my marbles, have a look at the following,
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ken.waters1/306_tuning.htm
It puzzles me that is the overhead turbo was better, then why would Cit change it for later engines? Space isnt the answer as a overhead intercooler WOULD fit under a Xantia bonnet!
180BHP really isnt all that much since you can get VW diesels with this much power as standard (although im yet to see one).
hi all
the best vw diesel is 150bhp standard
you can chip tune them to around 225bhp
but these use a big laggy turbo (130 bhp model better in every day life less laggy)and the latest computer controlled common rail injection system
far cry from a small turbo and a mechanical pump of psa engine thats been around for at least 20 yrs
as for the intercooler with it being sited on top of the engine, heat transfer properties have to be better than a front mounted intercooler which get's lots of cold air passing over it so it can be made cheaply(inefficient)an still do it's job
car manufacturers like to save money first,make better only if necessary
---neil---
the best vw diesel is 150bhp standard
you can chip tune them to around 225bhp
but these use a big laggy turbo (130 bhp model better in every day life less laggy)and the latest computer controlled common rail injection system
far cry from a small turbo and a mechanical pump of psa engine thats been around for at least 20 yrs
as for the intercooler with it being sited on top of the engine, heat transfer properties have to be better than a front mounted intercooler which get's lots of cold air passing over it so it can be made cheaply(inefficient)an still do it's job
car manufacturers like to save money first,make better only if necessary
---neil---
You can get a VW TDI 2.5 litre V6 with 180 Bhp (okay so its not a 1.9, but thats powerfull as a standard engine!)
but then of course there is a 3.3 litre V8, but im not sure thats in any car yet, let alone what its Bhp will be.
Surely no matter how good the heat trasnfer properties are, with the warmed air from off the rad and very low airflow (in comparison to a 1'x2' rectangle at 70+mph) crossed with the heat from below the intercooler from the engine, it seems sensible that a front mounted intercooler is ALWAYS going to be better? And once you add in all the extra piping is there THAT much saving?
Is there any easy way to put an intercooler spray onto a top mounted intercooler? It does make an impressive difference to a front mounted one!
but then of course there is a 3.3 litre V8, but im not sure thats in any car yet, let alone what its Bhp will be.
Surely no matter how good the heat trasnfer properties are, with the warmed air from off the rad and very low airflow (in comparison to a 1'x2' rectangle at 70+mph) crossed with the heat from below the intercooler from the engine, it seems sensible that a front mounted intercooler is ALWAYS going to be better? And once you add in all the extra piping is there THAT much saving?
Is there any easy way to put an intercooler spray onto a top mounted intercooler? It does make an impressive difference to a front mounted one!
hi vanny
vauxhall have a vetcra coming out next year that is a 1.9 and it has 212bhp now that is a powerful engine it also runs 3bar boost(approx 45psi) 0-60mph in 6.5secs and limited top speed of 155mph
but i think i'll stick with my 2.5td xm and my nissan zx300 twin turbo
as for the intercooler spray yes it's dead easy spare washer bottle of a good size and a range of washer jets and a motor
but i've always found it better to inject water inside the engine has far greater affect(see company called ERL watersystems)
or use nitrous oxide that leaves the jet at around -157deg c
an excellent cooler
yes a front mount intercooler is the way to go thats why i said bin the standard one and put the more efficient peugeot one thats on top of the engine in front of the rad(where original one used to be)
vauxhall have a vetcra coming out next year that is a 1.9 and it has 212bhp now that is a powerful engine it also runs 3bar boost(approx 45psi) 0-60mph in 6.5secs and limited top speed of 155mph
but i think i'll stick with my 2.5td xm and my nissan zx300 twin turbo
as for the intercooler spray yes it's dead easy spare washer bottle of a good size and a range of washer jets and a motor
but i've always found it better to inject water inside the engine has far greater affect(see company called ERL watersystems)
or use nitrous oxide that leaves the jet at around -157deg c
an excellent cooler
yes a front mount intercooler is the way to go thats why i said bin the standard one and put the more efficient peugeot one thats on top of the engine in front of the rad(where original one used to be)
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by neilsxm</i>
hi, again
diesel tanks is an excellent to breed bacteria this can pull down performance
with your car been around for 10 years it is very possible that you and everybody else has loads living in your tank!!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
This bacteria is called 'cladysporium resanae' spelling may not be correct!! It lifes in the ocean. They use sea water to pump oil from under the sea bed and some of that water gets suspended in the oil. THen because Diesel is less refined some of that water remains in the diesel, carrying these micro bacteria. The bacteria feed on the fuel and create a highly corrosive waste product from all their poo!! You'd probably find a load of sludge at the bottom of your fuel tank, as well as water. If the tank is metal it could perforate!!! (Not a problem for most/all Cits as they have plastic tanks.)
Aircraft are prone to fuel tank corrosion because of these blighters!! So they build in water drains into the tanks, they live in the water, and add inhibiters to the fuel.
THe cheaper the Diesel the less likely it will have any sort of inhibitors.
hi, again
diesel tanks is an excellent to breed bacteria this can pull down performance
with your car been around for 10 years it is very possible that you and everybody else has loads living in your tank!!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
This bacteria is called 'cladysporium resanae' spelling may not be correct!! It lifes in the ocean. They use sea water to pump oil from under the sea bed and some of that water gets suspended in the oil. THen because Diesel is less refined some of that water remains in the diesel, carrying these micro bacteria. The bacteria feed on the fuel and create a highly corrosive waste product from all their poo!! You'd probably find a load of sludge at the bottom of your fuel tank, as well as water. If the tank is metal it could perforate!!! (Not a problem for most/all Cits as they have plastic tanks.)
Aircraft are prone to fuel tank corrosion because of these blighters!! So they build in water drains into the tanks, they live in the water, and add inhibiters to the fuel.
THe cheaper the Diesel the less likely it will have any sort of inhibitors.
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oilyspanner
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Anders - RME is just Rapsolja (rape seed oil) that has been esterized (thus Raps Methyl Ester). This is done to prevent it from solidifying at temperatures under freezing - in fact it will go as low as -18 C, but after that you have to add conventional diesel to it. I ran my company car on it for 3 years (An Audi A4 Avant TDi). Absolutely no problems at all.
Sorry all the rest of you, this a Swedish-Danish discussion, over here in Sweden the state has been sponsoring the development of biodiesel. It still costs a bit more than conventional diesel, but if you use it in a company car, you get a tax payback equivalent to the tax on a petrol driven car. (otherwise a diesel gets taxed another 50%)
Vanny - I read in CCC over Christmas (while I was in england) that Ford Rallysport has managed to get about 230 bhp out of the 1.5 liter version of the jointly PSA/Ford developed small diesel and are thinking of using in a future rally car (far less fuel consumption/weight).
//NiSk
Sorry all the rest of you, this a Swedish-Danish discussion, over here in Sweden the state has been sponsoring the development of biodiesel. It still costs a bit more than conventional diesel, but if you use it in a company car, you get a tax payback equivalent to the tax on a petrol driven car. (otherwise a diesel gets taxed another 50%)
Vanny - I read in CCC over Christmas (while I was in england) that Ford Rallysport has managed to get about 230 bhp out of the 1.5 liter version of the jointly PSA/Ford developed small diesel and are thinking of using in a future rally car (far less fuel consumption/weight).
//NiSk
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ukmobileman
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This is what i've been told, and i looked at a Cit brochure somewhere that confirmed this. The estate weighs quite a lot more (more than the difference between the BX and BX estate), and i believe its due to this that they lowered the power output to get a better fuel economy. If you remember in '95 Citroen where REALLY pushing 'economy of diesel' especially with the 'new' AX 1.5D getting 75mpg, the advert had an AX on rollers and the add was on like every ten minutes!
I've been told that they also reduced the BHP for tax reason when moving them some where (might not have been this country), but im not sure if this is true or not!
As for the BHP, my engine came from a '96 Xantia LX Estate, it was as standard as could be when i put it in my BX (even the hose lengths where pretty much the same), and i put it on a rolling road about three months after doing the swap. It was putting out 86BHP and 141lb/ft torque, so it does seem that they where detuned to 85bhp.
I've got a bit more out of it by adjusting the fuel slope (as described earlier in the thread), in a couple of weeks i will be fitting a top mounted intercooler in Series with the front mount. I'll also be swapping from the water hose i currently use for the turbo (which swells something stupid) to polished steel piping (as much as i can!), combined with a full retuning probably by the 'DervDoctor' it should be giving out somewhere in the range of 120bhp, but more importantly 200+lb/ft torque, which is gonna make towing just a bit easier!
I've been told that they also reduced the BHP for tax reason when moving them some where (might not have been this country), but im not sure if this is true or not!
As for the BHP, my engine came from a '96 Xantia LX Estate, it was as standard as could be when i put it in my BX (even the hose lengths where pretty much the same), and i put it on a rolling road about three months after doing the swap. It was putting out 86BHP and 141lb/ft torque, so it does seem that they where detuned to 85bhp.
I've got a bit more out of it by adjusting the fuel slope (as described earlier in the thread), in a couple of weeks i will be fitting a top mounted intercooler in Series with the front mount. I'll also be swapping from the water hose i currently use for the turbo (which swells something stupid) to polished steel piping (as much as i can!), combined with a full retuning probably by the 'DervDoctor' it should be giving out somewhere in the range of 120bhp, but more importantly 200+lb/ft torque, which is gonna make towing just a bit easier!
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oilyspanner
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Its all go, I just Bought a TZD on EBAY Clean and tidy needing a clutch and a head gasket, I am in the middle of removing a late 1.9TD From a 405 which i am hoping to tidy up and fit next weekend, I am going to extend the pipe linking the actuator to the turbo up to where I can get at it easily and tru a bleed valve as suggested earlier in this thread, it also has a Bosch pump, Where is the Dervdoctor?
Stewart
Stewart
I have just dug out the April 1998 Xantia Tech Spec Brochure that I was given when I bought my 1.9TD Estate and the power and torque for the 1.9TD Saloon and Estate stated are identical at 90 bhp and 145 lb.ft.
The unladen weight of the saloon is stated as 1312 kg whilst the estate weighs in at 1360 kg (3.6% extra). The 0-62 mph time for the saloon is 12.7 secs and the estate takes a sluggish 14.1 secs. Combined fuel economy is 40.9 mpg for the saloon and 40.4 mpg for the estate.
If these figures are correct then it appears that the same engine, and power, is used in both varients.
Vanny,
Does the Dervdoctor do a good job at tuning mechanical diesels. I too tow a caravan and would like some more power but Allard are a bit far away from me (I live in Stockport) and Van Aarken are too far away and expensive. The only worry I have is that a more highly tuned engine may be more susceptable to the dreaded haed gasket leak which, as i am towing the caravan to Austria this summer, would not be good news!
The unladen weight of the saloon is stated as 1312 kg whilst the estate weighs in at 1360 kg (3.6% extra). The 0-62 mph time for the saloon is 12.7 secs and the estate takes a sluggish 14.1 secs. Combined fuel economy is 40.9 mpg for the saloon and 40.4 mpg for the estate.
If these figures are correct then it appears that the same engine, and power, is used in both varients.
Vanny,
Does the Dervdoctor do a good job at tuning mechanical diesels. I too tow a caravan and would like some more power but Allard are a bit far away from me (I live in Stockport) and Van Aarken are too far away and expensive. The only worry I have is that a more highly tuned engine may be more susceptable to the dreaded haed gasket leak which, as i am towing the caravan to Austria this summer, would not be good news!