Zel's Fleet Blog - BX, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D & 230TE, AC Model 70.

[Michel]

I think I might regret this contribution next Tuesday but I'll make it anyway!!

I've had cruise control on numerous vehicles since my Lancia Beta Spyder with its crude hand locking throttle system. I would think I've only used it beneficially on half a dozen occasions, almost always in the small hours and only on Motorways. I don't like it. It does the one thing that I hate most about driving, it takes away an element of control from the driver which in turn reduces the necessary concentration. I believe that reducing the necessary concentration is always a bad thing regardless of the method. If you are not up to concentrating fully on the job of driving for whatever reason then you shouldn't be driving!!!

As for the limit function being a license saver, we are all already equipped with such a device, it's called a brain!!

I agree with every word you say there Mick, 100%. If the driver isn't concentrating on their speed and trusting it to the car, what else are they not concentrating on? Me on my motorbike?..

[xantia_v6]

I don't really buy the argument that cruise control makes a driver inattentive, any more than automatic transmission or self-cancelling indicators.

[mickthemaverick]

I'd argue that gear changing and cancelling indicators do not have a direct bearing on driving safely and legally, whereas your speed affects both so should be your responsibility and under your direct control

[Zelandeth]

Thing is, I have zero doubt of my ability to maintain my vehicle at an entirely appropriate speed for the road conditions. However the exact requirements of the computer controlling the speed camera, or even more frustratingly, the increasingly common average speed camera, are more picky than I trust my brain to be accurate at all times.

I also don't buy that it makes me a less safe driver. It's a conscious decision I'm making to hand over maintenance of the vehicle speed on an open road, and that's reducing my workload to free up brain cells to keep more of an eye out for what's going on around me.

Don't get me wrong, yes I'm sure there are plenty of people who do use it purely out of laziness! However for my part it's purely an aid to be used under the right circumstances which I think if anything should improve how safely I'm driving. If there's any question of the suitability of the situation, I'll be taking back direct control.

I also do personally actually prefer non cancelling indicators though!

[RichardW]

Far as I know the throttle has an extra switch in it for the limit function, there is certainly a different part number. You also need the two part brake switch and a clutch position switch to be present for the cruise to work. If you post up the VIN Zel, I'll have a look and see if I can figure out what yours is equipped with.

I use the cruise all the time, saves ankle ache. It's easy enough to flick it on / off and the speed up/down to maintain progress with other traffic, you've just got to remember you're driving with your hand not your foot!

[MattBLancs]

(re: triangle of doom)
Wow, yes that is quite a big example!

[mickthemaverick]

I use the cruise all the time, saves ankle ache. It's easy enough to flick it on / off and the speed up/down to maintain progress with other traffic, you've just got to remember you're driving with your hand not your foot!

All the cars I have had have had the same glitch which I don't like. I agree Richard that if used in that way you are maintaining control but I don't like the over harsh acceleration you get when selecting 'Resume' and I definitely get better fuel consumption using normal foot control. I find my inbuilt 'autopilot' mode allows me to take in all the info from the dash, the mirrors and my forward view to maintain a steady safe gap in traffic while maximising fuel consumption and minimising use of the brakes. However I would argue that if your ankle is feeling weary then it is best to stop driving as it handicaps your abilty to make an emergency stop!

[Gibbo2286]

The batch of new old stock Citroen parts I bought had two different throttle pedals one with the sensor and one without, both sold on though so no help here.
PS, never used cruise control in all my years despite many of the cars owned having it.

[myglaren]

Only had cruise on a long-gone Accord, the recently gone Civic and the current Mazda 6.
The Honda's were very simple and intuitive, the Mazda isn't, quite fiddly.
I do use it now and again, mostly on long 30mph roads. A touch of the clutch or brake pedal and it drops out, or the steering wheel controls of course.
Also long motorway stretches, where I can focus on traffic etc. rather than speed.
The Civic seemed to be more economical on the cruise, and needed to be.

[CitroJim]

If the driver isn't concentrating on their speed and trusting it to the car, what else are they not concentrating on? Me on my motorbike?..

Using the limit to ensure I stay within the posted speed limit allows me to stop having to so frequently check the speedo and thus give me more ability to concentrate on driving safely, observantly and to ensure you stay happy and healthy on your motorcycle Mike

[Zelandeth]

While the Trabant's water ingress issues have definitely been vastly reduced since I've been fettling it, but we definitely still have quite a bit getting in on the passenger side.



Quite a bit of that seemed to be coming in actually through the passenger door. The door card was always wet and I'd noted that the door pocket would actually fill up with water when it rained.

As soon as I pulled the door card off (3 screws and about 60 seconds) a likely candidate for this became apparent sitting in the bottom of the door cavity. Which also explained why that window rattled so badly.



That thing in the bottom of the door, that's the rail that the window should be sitting on. Also acting as a gutter to direct water running down the glass to drip off at either end, away from the door card etc.

The glass was essentially just balanced on the metal rollers that the rail should run on. How it hadn't fallen off or been damaged I've no idea. The rail is in pretty rough shape, but I wouldn't have condemned it. The very ends are a bit crispy, but I've seen far worse. The biggest issue (aside from the window glass having escaped) is that it's been bent quite substantially. I've straightened it as best I can, but it's still not right. A new one is €30 from Trabantwelt, so hardly the end of the world. While the glass isn't sitting as deeply in the channel as it ideally should be, I have managed to coerce everything more or less back to where it should be.



I suspect there would have been some sort of sealant to help bond the glass to the carrier originally as well.

I will need to pull a lot of this apart when I change the window rubbers anyway so I'm not worrying too much about it right now. I've just made a mental note not to open that window again if I don't have to until I've had a chance to get things properly fastened together. There's no chance of it actually falling apart on its own now though and the door doesn't rattle anywhere near as much. Will it help keep the rain out? Remains to be seen. I did look at the driver's side one before and everything looked okay.

Another order for assorted miscellaneous parts has been made.

[] Window lifting rail as the ends have rotted off this one.
[] 20 trim clips as I'm missing all but one or two in each door.
[] Replacement for the mostly missing retaining clips for the engine jacket.
[] Cooling fan to cowl gasket.
[] Replacement for the missing rubber stoppers the bonnet should sit on.
[] New sill kick plates as these are pretty scabby and I suspect will be in several pieces once they're removed.

All small things individually, but will add up at the end of the day.

[CitroJim]

Superb work Zel It's all coming along very nicely

[Zelandeth]

The amount of water in our conservatory tells me that it's been raining pretty heavily on and off most of the day today. So I'd usually expect there to be a lake in the passenger foot well (random thought, does it still count as a well if the floor is actually flat?) in the Trabant.



Well that's an improvement! The dark bit near the wheel tub is just a shadow rather than a puddle. No water! A little of the Cpt. Tolley's I dribbled around the suspect seams on the bulkhead has found it's way through, but the floors (and doors) are bone dry.

That definitely feels like we've made a few steps forward there now.

Had a nice wander over Chesham way to catch up with some of you lot, which was a nice change of pace.



The drive there and back highlighted a couple of things. First is that those front tyres are getting binned. Before our trip north next week if I can arrange it. They're just absolutely hopeless in the wet. I'll probably keep hold of at least the rears as they look to be a pretty aggressive winter tread and someone might want them as a part worn pair, but I personally prefer a fully matched set on the car.

Secondly is that the rear end really is getting quite crashy on poor roads. That combined with the really visible positive camber of the rear wheels I think tells me it wouldn't be the worst idea to start looking at shopping for a new (or rebuilt) rear axle. My intention is to be keeping this vehicle long term, so I don't mind spending a few quid getting things up to scratch.

The first part in the puzzle of "what will it take to get cruise working" has now arrived.



Actually attached to a whole COM2000 unit we probably don't need, but it was no more expensive than just getting the stalk. I'll grab a note of the VIN when I next get a chance so we can find out exactly what variants of what systems we actually have fitted, and if we do need additional pedal switches/different throttle pedal assemblies hopefully we can then track down what part numbers I need to start hunting. We'll start with the easy version though - plug in the stalk, code it in and see if it works. Never know, we might be lucky.

Do have a job for tomorrow though before thinking about any of that.



It's always something! Guess I'll be picking up a new pair of headlight lamps tomorrow then.

[RichardW]

There only seems to be one brake switch, and the clutch switch may well be fitted anyway for ECU purposes, so the only thing possibly missing is the throttle pedal.

[CitroJim]

Great to see you yesterday Zel and delighted the Trabant is now dry

As said, let me know when you're good next week and we'll have a look at the cruise in Diagbox...

There's some quite rough roads on that trip. Between the pub and Berkhamsted is not good and then after Berkhamsted it deteriorates seriously right up until you get to Dagnall... Even the hydropneumatic Citroens would be crashy along there so you may be worrying unnecessarily about your rear end...

Agreed about the Pug being a keeper - the Berlingo/Partner is a fine and very useful vehicle. When my C3 wears out I think a Berlingo will be my next car.