Zel's Fleet Blog - BX, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D & 230TE, AC Model 70.

[RichardW]

I've got a spare blower here - it was running when I took it out 4 years ago, but it has done 160k, and donated its control panel to my Sister's Xsara! IIRC it was occasionally a bit noisy, but it might serve as a temporary or spares unit. If you think it's worth it, PM your address and I'll stick it in the post.

[Zelandeth]

Cheers Richard, but we should have one available locally.

Have been in further contact with the owner of the first potential Invacar project. Despite currently looking like something out of Mad Max, the guy's actually not kidding about it looking a lot worse than it really is. Originally I was worried that sorting out the rear wheel arches would be a major hassle - until it was pointed out that because it's GRP, you can pretty easily make a mould using an existing panel for your repair section. Especially as it's not a structural bit. Save yourself some effort too if you chose to upgrade to 12" wheels as that would reduce the amount of body you need to put back in. For reference, the problem with the arches currently is that they've been cut back to allow way too large wheels (off a Daimler Sovereign!) to fit.

12" upgrade isn't a bad idea anyway I reckon. Pretty sure your tyre choices are wider in 12" than 10", and it will obviously help bring the revs down at cruising speed very slightly. Probably help the ride a bit too. Speaking of ride, the rear suspension is apparently straight off a Fiat 126, just the hubs that were changed to allow the Girling brakes to be used. So again easy to find bits for - though I imagine given how light they are that the suspension lives a pretty easy life.

Biggest problem: the entire nose is missing. It's basically just a big fibreglass box, but obviously is a major part of the car's look. I don't reckon recreation of it would be out of the question, the seller was looking at adapting the nose off a Mk 12 to fit. I prefer the look of the 70 though, and the 12 nose lacks the access cover for the brake hydraulics so you'd have to convert it to a pedal operated braking system really. That's the biggest head scratched at the moment - unless I was *really fluffing lucky* and managed to find a donor panel or a parts car. I'm not worried about making the repairs seamless... I've zero interest in making it a concourse car and it will all be part of the cars story.

Beyond that it sounds like a relatively simple case of patching up any chassis/floorpan corrosion (it's very simply constructed, and of course you can just take the whole body off to do the work so that's not really scaring me), put all the bits currently safely stored in boxes back on, and then recommission it...which save for probably a more or less complete brake system rebuild, hopefully would basically just be a thorough service more or less.

Seeing a video of one that's being restored on another forum at the moment running yesterday made me realise something, the engine is a lot smoother sounding beast than I'd expected. Thanks to the fact that the cooling fan, like on a 2CV has stators behind the rotating fan, it also makes that almost supercharger like scream when revved. Sounds bloody brilliant if you ask me...

Other plus this one has is that it's relatively local (as in less than an hour's drive away), which given I'd obviously need to get it transported is actually probably worth a couple of hundred quid in itself.

Think I'm definitely going to need to go take a proper look at it. Still reckon it's a bit on the rich side given the body issues - even if they are cosmetic really - but it's not quite as much of a "run away screaming" deal as I originally thought.

... let's face it - I'm not likely to find one that's just been sitting in a shed or field since 2003 just waiting to be resurrected. Those have almost all been found by now I reckon as I'm a bit late to this party.

We got anyone on here who's a wizard at fibreglass work?

[CitroJim]

Zel, in your hunt for an Invacar, is this of any interest?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232621797848?ul_noapp=true

Spotted via Facebook...

[Zelandeth]

Interesting in its own right, but not really for me that one.

It's really the last of the bunch, the Model 70 that's of interest to me as an actual project. Not least because while it will primarily exist as a bit of fun to take to shows, it at least in theory should still be usable as an actual vehicle from time to time. The earlier models like this are less practical really in that sense due to poorer general dynamics and performance.

The downside of course is that they're the more desirable one, and that prices seem to have gone skywards in the last couple of years as a result! Few things more frustrating than realising that you've missed the boat slightly on owning something...

...Says the guy who wound up paying three and a half grand for a Lada!

[Michel]

Zel, in your hunt for an Invacar, is this of any interest?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232621797848?ul_noapp=true

Spotted via Facebook...

Why was it presumed in the first place that the disabled would *want* to drive something like this?

[bobins]

Why was it presumed in the first place that the disabled would *want* to drive something like this?

"The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there"
L.P. Hartley

[Michel]

Why was it presumed in the first place that the disabled would *want* to drive something like this?

"The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there"
L.P. Hartley

A good point well made.

[Zelandeth]

Zel, in your hunt for an Invacar, is this of any interest?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232621797848?ul_noapp=true

Spotted via Facebook...

Why was it presumed in the first place that the disabled would *want* to drive something like this?

The simple answer I reckon is because it was better than staring at the same four walls all day every day or being entirely reliant on somebody else.

It might have been incredibly basic by today's standards, but it was independence... I'd gladly take that over being stuck in the house with no way to get out.

Having said that, some of the early models were bloody dire things. The Model 70 (whether it be an actual Invacar or AC example) on the other hand looks to be a more mature design which is a collection of quite good bits of equipment in one vehicle, and I reckon might actually work better than its reputation may suggest.

... I'm quite prepared to eat those words when I've driven one and it's as dire as the reputation suggests!

[Zelandeth]

You can't make it up with these cars sometimes, can you? They certainly have a sense of humour.

My heater blower has been quite resolutely dead for roughly a week now. However upon getting into the car having just picked up its replacement, it proceeded to spring back to life again, and Jim can vouch for the fact that I'm not making that up. Either way, it's getting replaced tomorrow as the bottom bearing is quite obviously stuffed.

In other news, my Invacar ponderings have just become quite a bit more complicated.

Turns out that the person who's offering the project I've been looking at and procrastinating over for a few days now is looking for a sensible small modern motor for a daily. Like my 107 that I've been also been pondering looking at moving on. They've suggested a swap.

Actually makes quite a bit of sense, especially given the fact that the 107's value is only going down the longer I procrastinate about selling it, and the Invacar is only going to get more valuable as time goes on, especially as the microcar crowd seem to have got wind of them now and let's face it, that crowd for the most part seem to have plenty of cash to throw around judging from the prices of a lot of those things...Even the Peel P50, which is about as far as I reckon you can get from an actually usable car!

[CitroJim]

However upon getting into the car having just picked up its replacement, it proceeded to spring back to life again, and Jim can vouch for the fact that I'm not making that up.

I can indeed

There's a simple explanation... It's French

[Zelandeth]

Okay...so the Xantia has decided that the heater blower isn't going to be simple. Fitting the new blower today (brand new), resulted in it running at slightly below full speed all the time. It's not on full-full speed, as setting the slider to max results in the relay in the unit clicking and it speeding up a bit. I'm going to poke around with a meter tomorrow and make sure the control voltage is changing as it should be. If need be I'll make one good unit out the two, hardly a big deal. At least for now I have the ability to demist the windscreen and get heat into the cabin again!

This afternoon I took a run over to see the gent with the potential Invacar project. It's...very much not what I expected.

It currently looks like a cast off Mad Max movie prop. The previous owner apparently had been using it as a tractor to shuffle things around a caravan park. As a result it's had stupidly oversize rear wheels attached, the arches cut away to accommodate them, the rear of the body cut away to allow a tow hitch to be attached to the crossmember.

The bit under the engine cover's not a huge issue to my mind as it's a pretty simple box shape, and and shouldn't be that hard to fabricate a repair. The wheelarches are more of a pain, but it should be possible to take a mould from an existing panel to make a replacement piece up. Upgrading to 12" wheels means you only need one part of the curve rather than both.

The biggest issue by far however is that the entire nose has been cut off the bodywork for some unknown reason (our best guess is that it got damaged at some point and just cutting it away was the easiest solution).

I didn't hold out much hope for it structurally either given that there were several gaping holes visible in the floorpan (when I say floorpan, I mean completely flat metal sheet tack welded to the chassis in a few places by the look of it) and it's been sans doors for a long while obviously (they've been set to one side for safekeeping). It's also parked in the grass, which never tends to bode well for underbody metalwork.

I spent about ten minutes standing on my head in the brambles attempting to get a proper look at the underside, before we realised that it would be far easier to just tip the thing on its side - because you can *do* that with these so long as you've got two people (albeit slightly easier if the handbrake works so the sod doesn't try to roll off as you're lifting it). I wasn't really holding out much hope for finding any actual metal left underneath it at this point.

This is what I was greeted with.

The chassis is only bloody perfect! The only tiny hole is in one of the "outriggers" at the front which are purely crash structure - and would be an absolute doddle (even with my welding skills!) to cut out and let in a new bit of metal for.

The floorpan as mentioned above has about the appearance and structural integrity of a soggy teabag. Apparently it was unpainted on the top surface, so it's just dissolved where water's got under the rubber floor mat. That really is just a really thin steel plate though (the seat is fastened to the chassis not the floor), so is utterly trivial to replace.

Hats off to the AC factory - they actually did a really good job of rust proofing the underside of this thing - hence the fact that it's still sound as a pound after 43 years.

I was absolutely gobsmacked by the condition of the underside...I mean there isn't even anything that looks "suspiciously crusty" - heck there's probably less rust on there than on the 107! The thickness and solidity of the metalwork as well is totally beyond what you'd expect for something this size/weight.

I didn't realise until afterwards that I'd totally botched the camera settings up - so apologies for the horrendous photos - the excessive contrast makes it look worse than it really is.

By the way, there are a lot of things missing in the photos (doors, side windows, lights, fuel tank, some switchgear etc - they're all present, just in boxes not on the car itself - well the tail lights actually are now). Think the only thing we're actually sure is missing is the wiper arm - and that's off a Mini so shouldn't be a problem to source.

Going to make an appointment to pop back around at some point in the near future to see if we can spend an hour getting the engine to run (it has recently), not that I really need any more enthusiasm at this stage...but actually knowing there's life in the power unit and seeing/hearing life from it will always do a lot for morale. It's not seized though, that much I've already ascertained. Belt in the Salisbury drive unit looks brand new too!

Really does look like a tiny Beetle unit...

There's a lot of GRP repair work needed...and figuring out what on earth to do about the missing "nose cone" will require some head scratching. I almost wonder if it might be easier to find some Robin/Kitten panels that I could do something of a cut 'n' shut with (it would be waaaaay too wide), as I imagine bits are easier to come by for them. Sadly Invacar Model 70 bodywork bits are basically unobtainable as there are already more rolling chassis around than there are bodies. Oh, and the wiring (what there is of it) has been seriously hacked about in a few places, though helpfully all in the middle of the cable runs it looks like, so it shouldn't be impossible to trace out and repair with a bit of patience with a wiring diagram.

Probably the best part? The fact that it already has a V5C present, so the fight with the DVLA to get the taxation class changed has already been done. What I hadn't twigged until quite recently either, is that being a 1975 example it's tax exempt - and as of May, MOT exempt (it will be getting one anyway).

I reckon this could actually be a good project. Especially given that the fit/finish when they were new was diabolical at best. I don't see the need for perfect body repairs either - so long as the wounds have obviously been tended to and properly dressed, the scars only serve to tell the story of the car and the history it has behind it.

Given the way values are going this might actually be for the first time *ever* something that may end up being worth more in future than it is now. That's crazy-talk for me usually.

Rough plan?

[] Actually decide to get the darn thing and convince the rest of the family I'm not insane.
[] Pull the body off the chassis entirely.
[] Attack everything with every cleaning substance known to man so I can actually see what's what.
[] Replace floorpan and repair front outrigger.
[] Recomission engine and rebuild braking system (surely easier with the body off).
[] Repair rear bodywork and arches (not sure whether that will be easier on or off the car yet).
[] Reassemble.
[] Tackle front end - by that point I'll have had more time to come up with a proper plan of attack and hopefully bounce some ideas off people who know GRP better than I do. The seller has indicated that there may well be a market for repair panels actually if moulds were to be made up, as these things were quite often well bashed about when in use, so a lot have "well patched" front ends.

I have some thinking to do.

[Hell Razor5543]

Good luck with the first item on your list!!!

[Michel]

It shouldn't be too hard to make a mould and a new front end if you can find a willing owner of a complete one. My brother made an entire fibreglass front end (bonnet, wings) for his GSA engined 2CV using nothing more than the original normal sized items as a "mould" and a bit of imagination..... in my mum's garage!

You'll not convince the family you're not insane. Everything else is achievable.

[Zelandeth]

Well, they already know I'm insane. It's just one more item of crazy for the list!

Probably the biggest thing I really need to do to make it vaguely feasible is to see how far I am from being able to clear an Invacar sized hole in the garage.

I reckon if I can do that I should be good. Annoying I reckon they're slightly too wide to fit through our side gate, as that would give me a nice outdoor working area that's not open to the street. Body off it would be doable by lifting and tilting the chassis, which is probably the main thing as I obviously need something between me doing welding and passers by.

Hopefully willing volunteers to let me take a few moulds shouldn't be too hard to find given there's a clear demand for repair panels.

Stupid as it may sound, I could probably get hold of this, clean it, sort the floor reattach the bits and just generally make it look a bit tidier and I could probably double my money. That's not my intention though, I'm far more interested in the car! ...not a bad bargaining chip for getting it into the garage though.

[Hell Razor5543]

Well, they already know I'm insane. It's just one more item of crazy for the list! Stupid as it may sound, I could probably get hold of this, clean it, sort the floor reattach the bits and just generally make it look a bit tidier and I could probably double my money. That's not my intention though, I'm far more interested in the car! ...not a bad bargaining chip for getting it into the garage though.

Well, it would be if your family didn't know you as well as they do ("Double your money? Double your clutter, more like!").