Zel's Fleet Blog - BX, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D & 230TE, AC Model 70.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
So went to move the Skoda earlier so I could mow that corner, and the clutch slave cylinder has failed. Was quite interesting as I was in reverse and with the choke on full at the time, so suddenly the car started accelerating backwards beyond my control.
Great...another thing for the list!
That car is seriously about to appear priced to sell, patience has run out...
Great...another thing for the list!
That car is seriously about to appear priced to sell, patience has run out...
Current fleet:
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
That sounds quite scary Zel!
It's certainly trying you a bit just recently... I think it's clearly saying it wants to stray with you
It's certainly trying you a bit just recently... I think it's clearly saying it wants to stray with you

Jim
Runner, cyclist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
Runner, cyclist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
Haven't driven it in about two months! To be honest I'd be surprised if it's done more than 500 miles in the last year.
It's such a shame that it's been such a problem child, as I love driving it. It's totally different to the Lada - everything's feather light and easy. The thing virtually steers by telepathy. One of the most comfortable driver's seats out there as well I reckon - the comfort levels are something that virtually everyone who gets in it complement, usually much to their surprise.
Just between parts being a swine to get (which in fairness may just be down to me having a string of poor luck with eBay), and the fact that it's thrown it's toys out the pram in I think four different ways in terms of cooling issues now, that's an issue on four of the last five trips out, and now the clutch slave cylinder has gone pop for no readily apparent reason.
I'll change that, adjust the valve clearances and double check the ignition timing in the hope that that stops the pinking, change the (hopefully) sticking thermostat and pray that stops the overheating and then see where we are. MOT is just about due too.
When I'm in getting that done I'll ask about getting the semi trailing arm bushes changed. It's an absolute pig of a job and I'm not even considering trying to do that myself. I quite simply Do Not Do suspension or steering work. The amount of pain, suffering and stress it saves me makes it worth paying someone else to do it. That way when that giant bolt made of unobtanium snaps, it's their problem not mine!
With the gremlins sorted and a bit of work in a body shop to get that up to standard and the seats retrimmed she could be an absolutely fantastic car. There's massive potential there, and despite my own grumpiness lately I *know* that and do love the thing.
It just really starts to grate when so many things go awry in quick succession - especially when half of them are variations on the same theme for different reasons. Even more so when another car decides to pop its head gasket. Having three classics on the drive is too many. Especially when two of the three are broken and one's running, but a half finished project because you're too busy trying to sort the other two to finish that one!
107 needs a service soon, the driver's wing is still waiting to be fixed, and I really should sort the exhaust properly (keep trying to talk myself out of the stainless option...).
More garden work tomorrow by the looks of it. Really hope we finish early enough that I can attack the Skoda with the pressure washer and turn it back to orange. It's currently mostly green.
It's such a shame that it's been such a problem child, as I love driving it. It's totally different to the Lada - everything's feather light and easy. The thing virtually steers by telepathy. One of the most comfortable driver's seats out there as well I reckon - the comfort levels are something that virtually everyone who gets in it complement, usually much to their surprise.
Just between parts being a swine to get (which in fairness may just be down to me having a string of poor luck with eBay), and the fact that it's thrown it's toys out the pram in I think four different ways in terms of cooling issues now, that's an issue on four of the last five trips out, and now the clutch slave cylinder has gone pop for no readily apparent reason.
I'll change that, adjust the valve clearances and double check the ignition timing in the hope that that stops the pinking, change the (hopefully) sticking thermostat and pray that stops the overheating and then see where we are. MOT is just about due too.
When I'm in getting that done I'll ask about getting the semi trailing arm bushes changed. It's an absolute pig of a job and I'm not even considering trying to do that myself. I quite simply Do Not Do suspension or steering work. The amount of pain, suffering and stress it saves me makes it worth paying someone else to do it. That way when that giant bolt made of unobtanium snaps, it's their problem not mine!
With the gremlins sorted and a bit of work in a body shop to get that up to standard and the seats retrimmed she could be an absolutely fantastic car. There's massive potential there, and despite my own grumpiness lately I *know* that and do love the thing.
It just really starts to grate when so many things go awry in quick succession - especially when half of them are variations on the same theme for different reasons. Even more so when another car decides to pop its head gasket. Having three classics on the drive is too many. Especially when two of the three are broken and one's running, but a half finished project because you're too busy trying to sort the other two to finish that one!
107 needs a service soon, the driver's wing is still waiting to be fixed, and I really should sort the exhaust properly (keep trying to talk myself out of the stainless option...).
More garden work tomorrow by the looks of it. Really hope we finish early enough that I can attack the Skoda with the pressure washer and turn it back to orange. It's currently mostly green.
Current fleet:
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
Zelandeth wrote: When I'm in getting that done I'll ask about getting the semi trailing arm bushes changed. It's an absolute pig of a job and I'm not even considering trying to do that myself. I quite simply Do Not Do suspension or steering work. The amount of pain, suffering and stress it saves me makes it worth paying someone else to do it. That way when that giant bolt made of unobtanium snaps, it's their problem not mine!
Whilst I have no problems with suspension work Zel - except perhaps on Skodas!!! -I feel exactly the same about doing exhaust work...
I always farm that out. I hate it.
I also tend to farm out CV joint boots too... I hate CV boot grease

Apart from that, I'm generally happy to do it myself...
Jim
Runner, cyclist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
Runner, cyclist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
Exhaust work for me depends on the car. The Saab for example I will not go near it on as they're invariably an absolute pig to work with.
Skoda...well, it's essentially just a bean can bolted to the manifold. Though I did wish I'd got someone to do the last one when two nuts rounded off and one stud snapped...
Guess the Lada gets points for the exhaust being easy simply because it's got enough ground clearance that I can easily get under the car without having to jack it up. That and that there's no precise alignment involved as on a lot of cars.
Skoda...well, it's essentially just a bean can bolted to the manifold. Though I did wish I'd got someone to do the last one when two nuts rounded off and one stud snapped...
Guess the Lada gets points for the exhaust being easy simply because it's got enough ground clearance that I can easily get under the car without having to jack it up. That and that there's no precise alignment involved as on a lot of cars.
Current fleet:
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
I'm of the get someone else to do it camp with exhausts. If I had a ramp I'd probably still get someone else to do it. I just don't like them at all.
Last edited by elma on 10 Jun 2017, 20:50, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
I hate working on exhausts! Straight down to the exhaust centre for me. Done enough of them myself when times were hard to never want to do any again. They're even a PITA with ramps, air tools and cutting gear!
Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk
Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
Now *this* is why I left all the wiring accessible for a while, bug fixing!
Something is going on when I go over 65ish mph. A missfire makes itself known, and one of the relays on the EFi relay block starts chattering - my money is on the fuel pump feed relay. The other two are the one that controls the main live for the whole system, and the inlet manifold heater. Drop the speed back and it behaves again. If it was the system enable relay I'd expect the car to stall then restart as the system goes through a ~1 sec self test when first powered up. Can't see the manifold heater causing the symptoms unless I also had a dodgy earth or feed so the heavy current draw (about 400W from memory) could cause voltage issues...though it shouldn't be enabled after the first couple of minutes anyway as the manifold is then water heated.
I'm going to hang an indicator light over each of the relays so I can see their status, then go for a test run and confirm which one is acting up. Then work out *why* it's acting up.
First will be checking my feed for the system enable relay though given it's stuffed into the fuse box socket for the rear window heater relay - and those fuse box contacts are notoriously dodgy even when used as intended!
The fact that it only happens at speed suggests it's a dodgy contact that's being caused by the vibration as speed increases to me...
If I'm lucky it'll just be the system enable relay dropping out because the feed is dropping out. If not something more odd is going on...though CPS would be first port of call, as if the ECU momentarily loses data from that it will assume the engine has stopped and kill the power to the fuel pump.
Realised the other day that this setup is probably why there's no interia switch on these cars - there's no way to have the fuel pump running without the engine running (or at least cranking) aside from the 1 second priming cycle when you turn the ignition on. The logic basically is that any smash serious enough to render fire a risk is probably going to be serious enough to stop the engine. Likewise if a fuel hose ruptures, the engine will stop, and almost instantly that will cause the fuel pump to cut out. It's pretty much impossible to have a major fuel spill unless you punch a hole in the tank or the return line (which is pretty unlikely without also holing the feed line as they're strapped together for 95% of their length).
Guess that's classic Lada "how can we use just what we need to make this work?" thinking really isn't it...
Something is going on when I go over 65ish mph. A missfire makes itself known, and one of the relays on the EFi relay block starts chattering - my money is on the fuel pump feed relay. The other two are the one that controls the main live for the whole system, and the inlet manifold heater. Drop the speed back and it behaves again. If it was the system enable relay I'd expect the car to stall then restart as the system goes through a ~1 sec self test when first powered up. Can't see the manifold heater causing the symptoms unless I also had a dodgy earth or feed so the heavy current draw (about 400W from memory) could cause voltage issues...though it shouldn't be enabled after the first couple of minutes anyway as the manifold is then water heated.
I'm going to hang an indicator light over each of the relays so I can see their status, then go for a test run and confirm which one is acting up. Then work out *why* it's acting up.
First will be checking my feed for the system enable relay though given it's stuffed into the fuse box socket for the rear window heater relay - and those fuse box contacts are notoriously dodgy even when used as intended!
The fact that it only happens at speed suggests it's a dodgy contact that's being caused by the vibration as speed increases to me...
If I'm lucky it'll just be the system enable relay dropping out because the feed is dropping out. If not something more odd is going on...though CPS would be first port of call, as if the ECU momentarily loses data from that it will assume the engine has stopped and kill the power to the fuel pump.
Realised the other day that this setup is probably why there's no interia switch on these cars - there's no way to have the fuel pump running without the engine running (or at least cranking) aside from the 1 second priming cycle when you turn the ignition on. The logic basically is that any smash serious enough to render fire a risk is probably going to be serious enough to stop the engine. Likewise if a fuel hose ruptures, the engine will stop, and almost instantly that will cause the fuel pump to cut out. It's pretty much impossible to have a major fuel spill unless you punch a hole in the tank or the return line (which is pretty unlikely without also holing the feed line as they're strapped together for 95% of their length).
Guess that's classic Lada "how can we use just what we need to make this work?" thinking really isn't it...
Current fleet:
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
If one relay is the prime suspect - why not just change that? Might save an awful lot of messing about, time & frustration. If it doesn't, you're no worse off.
Don't mind steering work despite having once swapped the rack on an XJ40 - only to find it was the pump that was leaking, then having to swap the racks back because the XJR rack I'd used was too precious to use on a cooking '40, if it wasn't going to save having to buy a rack. I hate PAS fluid like Jim does CVJ grease. I can't be bothered with those boots, for the price of a driveshaft (at least for a C15/Pug 205) it's just not worth the hassle - or cost/inconvenience of farming it out.
Don't mind steering work despite having once swapped the rack on an XJ40 - only to find it was the pump that was leaking, then having to swap the racks back because the XJR rack I'd used was too precious to use on a cooking '40, if it wasn't going to save having to buy a rack. I hate PAS fluid like Jim does CVJ grease. I can't be bothered with those boots, for the price of a driveshaft (at least for a C15/Pug 205) it's just not worth the hassle - or cost/inconvenience of farming it out.
Citroens:-
'81 2CV Club
'05 C15
'97 Xantia Exclusive estate
others:-
Jeep XJ Cherokees x 3
'96 Cadillac Eldorado
'99 Cadillac STS
& the numerous "abandoned projects"
'81 2CV Club

'05 C15

'97 Xantia Exclusive estate

others:-
Jeep XJ Cherokees x 3

'96 Cadillac Eldorado
'99 Cadillac STS

& the numerous "abandoned projects"

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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
Van, the question is whether the relay itself is at fault or whether its supply (or ground...) is dropping out, causing the relay chatter.
If it's just a duff relay that would be a fantastic result! Plenty of spares on hand.
Ah, XJ40 steering rack replacement...I remember that job. Almost as much fun as changing the gearbox. Still wish I'd bought that car...have regretted not doing it ever since. Even though I hated working on it with a passion!
If it's just a duff relay that would be a fantastic result! Plenty of spares on hand.
Ah, XJ40 steering rack replacement...I remember that job. Almost as much fun as changing the gearbox. Still wish I'd bought that car...have regretted not doing it ever since. Even though I hated working on it with a passion!
Current fleet:
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
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- A very naughty boy
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
Zelandeth wrote:relay chatter.
Now there's a term I've not heard for a few years now!
Good luck in finding it Zel

I'm sure you will given your plan...
Jim
Runner, cyclist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
Runner, cyclist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
That's why, to me, the obvious starting point is to change the relay, if it solves the problem, you've found - & fixed - the fault. If it doesn't, you know it's not that & THEN you can get down to some serious fault finding.
I had 3 XJ40's on the trot, a 3.6, an XJR & a 4 litre manual, so got to know my way round them fairly well & don't recall any serious problems, the rack was tedious - & messy! I had to change the front discs in steady rain, because the old ones had heat fatique cracks - & we were going to France the following day. The least enjoyable job was replacing valves by the side of the road in the Great Karoo (it's a desert in South Africa!) - all to no avail. We then towed it 200 miles to the hotel, no a/c, PAS, PAB - or fun. Still have the XJR, it's undoubtely my most desirable project!
I had 3 XJ40's on the trot, a 3.6, an XJR & a 4 litre manual, so got to know my way round them fairly well & don't recall any serious problems, the rack was tedious - & messy! I had to change the front discs in steady rain, because the old ones had heat fatique cracks - & we were going to France the following day. The least enjoyable job was replacing valves by the side of the road in the Great Karoo (it's a desert in South Africa!) - all to no avail. We then towed it 200 miles to the hotel, no a/c, PAS, PAB - or fun. Still have the XJR, it's undoubtely my most desirable project!
Citroens:-
'81 2CV Club
'05 C15
'97 Xantia Exclusive estate
others:-
Jeep XJ Cherokees x 3
'96 Cadillac Eldorado
'99 Cadillac STS
& the numerous "abandoned projects"
'81 2CV Club

'05 C15

'97 Xantia Exclusive estate

others:-
Jeep XJ Cherokees x 3

'96 Cadillac Eldorado
'99 Cadillac STS

& the numerous "abandoned projects"

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- Donor 2024
- Posts: 4982
- Joined: 17 Nov 2014, 00:36
- x 1494
Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
Not had a chance to look at this today.
Tomorrow I've got to find time to somehow, as I need the car first thing Wednesday to collect my in-laws from the airport at the crack of dawn. Tuesday I'll be out virtually all day between medical appointments and shifting Abby's stuff from her old work. Yay...I get to drive into and out of Oxford at rush hour...
I'll swap the relays out anyway, though I doubt they're the cause. Easy to eliminate though as they're just standard off-the-shelf cube relays.
Have spent a little bit of time this evening getting an old Toshiba laptop (Windows 2000 era) that will do nicely for running EFiLive to talk to the injection system on the Riva.
Major advantage of using this over a modern one? It has a real serial port, so I *know* it will just work. USB to serial converters seem to be highly variable in this sort of application I've found.
Tomorrow I've got to find time to somehow, as I need the car first thing Wednesday to collect my in-laws from the airport at the crack of dawn. Tuesday I'll be out virtually all day between medical appointments and shifting Abby's stuff from her old work. Yay...I get to drive into and out of Oxford at rush hour...
I'll swap the relays out anyway, though I doubt they're the cause. Easy to eliminate though as they're just standard off-the-shelf cube relays.
Have spent a little bit of time this evening getting an old Toshiba laptop (Windows 2000 era) that will do nicely for running EFiLive to talk to the injection system on the Riva.
Major advantage of using this over a modern one? It has a real serial port, so I *know* it will just work. USB to serial converters seem to be highly variable in this sort of application I've found.
Current fleet:
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
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- (Donor 2017)
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
"Easy to eliminate though as they're just standard off-the-shelf cube relays" THAT is exactly why I suggested it as a starting point 

Citroens:-
'81 2CV Club
'05 C15
'97 Xantia Exclusive estate
others:-
Jeep XJ Cherokees x 3
'96 Cadillac Eldorado
'99 Cadillac STS
& the numerous "abandoned projects"
'81 2CV Club

'05 C15

'97 Xantia Exclusive estate

others:-
Jeep XJ Cherokees x 3

'96 Cadillac Eldorado
'99 Cadillac STS

& the numerous "abandoned projects"

-
- Donor 2024
- Posts: 4982
- Joined: 17 Nov 2014, 00:36
- x 1494
Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Pug 107, Saab 900, Lada Riva, Skoda Estelle & Sinclair C5
No surprises for guessing that I never had a chance to look at it today. Flat out all day then had to waste the whole evening due to a social engagement.
Did note today though that the behaviour can occasionally be brought about during braking as well, and that it's not rpm related. I can cane it through the years, and it will still start to play up at exactly the same point whether in 4th or 5th.
These two points continue to suggest to me that it's a purely "physical" issue that I'm looking for...
The miniscule clearance between the cooling fan shroud and CPS keeps coming back into my mind...
Radiator will get pushed back slightly at speed (it's on rubber blocks at the base), reducing the clearance - likewise the engine will no doubt get pushed forward slightly on its mountings under braking due to its weight. Just keep thinking that's where my search needs to start...
First though I've got three known good relays (borrowed from the Saab), and three panel indicators which I'm going to rig up in plain sight so I can observe the relay feed status without driving into a river because I was trying to figure out which one was chattering by touch at 65mph...
Did note today though that the behaviour can occasionally be brought about during braking as well, and that it's not rpm related. I can cane it through the years, and it will still start to play up at exactly the same point whether in 4th or 5th.
These two points continue to suggest to me that it's a purely "physical" issue that I'm looking for...
The miniscule clearance between the cooling fan shroud and CPS keeps coming back into my mind...
Radiator will get pushed back slightly at speed (it's on rubber blocks at the base), reducing the clearance - likewise the engine will no doubt get pushed forward slightly on its mountings under braking due to its weight. Just keep thinking that's where my search needs to start...
First though I've got three known good relays (borrowed from the Saab), and three panel indicators which I'm going to rig up in plain sight so I can observe the relay feed status without driving into a river because I was trying to figure out which one was chattering by touch at 65mph...
Current fleet:
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 88 Renault 25 Monaco, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 75 Rover 3500, 73 AC Model 70.