V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

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Trainman
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Trainman »

Hell Razor5543 wrote:Steve, check out this post first;

http://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/forum/v ... =3&t=49018" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I've seen that, I have think it's time for something more drastic now.........

Hell Razor5543
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

It might well be the connectors aren't all contacting as they should. It might be worth doing the sanding trick to see if that allows the contacts to meet.

KP
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by KP »

Well if team wfa wanted some of the bits from this v6 I could strip out most of it up here and drive it down for a strip down and I could give them some really cheap rates on the bits left over and donate the box to help pay for replacement of yours and leave another one ready for disassembly to keep the club auto gearbox stockist in stock...

Jim seriously you need to think about offering exchange gearboxes with tc's to CC members and the like as I bet you could easily sell some around the world and any extra pennies could always go on your new activa tuning adventures ;)

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DHallworth
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by DHallworth »

KP wrote:Jim seriously you need to think about offering exchange gearboxes with tc's to CC members and the like as I bet you could easily sell some around the world and any extra pennies could always go on your new activa tuning adventures ;)
Knowing that a torque converter costs about £500 to have reconditioned and the only place worth sending it to is Mackie's in Glasgow, then there's Jim's time etc. to go into each box and any parts it needs, Jim would need to be charging about £1k a gearbox for it to be worth his while. There's so few Xantia/XM/C5 etc. V6's on the road these days and as they're worth so little money I honestly don't believe people would spend the money often enough for it to be a commercially viable hobby.

The other problem you've got is Xantia's and XM's use slightly different internals within the gearbox. If you fit a Xantia box in an XM you'll forever have the snow and sport lights flashing on the dash so you'd also need to have one of each ready to offer.

David.

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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Mandrake »

Trainman wrote:Will, I'm going to give it a few days and see what happens...... if it's recurrent, then I can see a train trip down to collect one, in the mean time, I'm going to butcher the two diagnostic leads that don't work and try to make one good one, it's something I've been putting off, but I think to get my bum in gear.....
If you're stuck and want to borrow my 30 pin adaptor for a few days let me know and I'll send it down, I think I've done everything I need it for for the moment. It seems to work on the new V6, I can read engine, gearbox, ABS, central locking alarm and immobiliser. I can't read the deadlock ECU, airbags or air con. Not sure whether that's a problem with the car or the cable, but the bit you need works...

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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by KP »

I don't think mackies are charging even half that these days to redo a tc if you provide. And just think of the international market, sure there might only be one bought per year but that's still one more kept on the road and the atrition rate is shockingly high with V6's.

Yes the internals vary per vehicle but getting a used one of each would be cheap enough. I'm sure Paul has a spare xm v6 box and a C5 one from Luke would t be much...

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DHallworth
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by DHallworth »

That price from Mackie's for a TC REBUILD was only a few months old...

David.

KP
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by KP »

I'm sure I saw a cheaper quote for a td6 rangie than that...

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DHallworth
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by DHallworth »

Different gearbox, different torque converter?

I know the 4HP20 ones need to be cut open, repaired and then welded back up and balanced.

Have actually been round Mackie's in Glasgow and seen them doing it.

David.

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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Trainman »

Dragging this back to the car........ I've driven her this morning and all is fine, this is driving me bonkers........, I'm going to sit down this afternoon and have a look at sorting out one of the two 30 pin cables I have to try and get it to work, the other alternative is a run down to Jim's to swap the ECU or 'nick' one of Simon's old V6 when Will decides what he's doing with it......

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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Mandrake »

DHallworth wrote:That price from Mackie's for a TC REBUILD was only a few months old...

David.
Was that to buy a rebuilt one or get your own one rebuilt ?

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Mandrake
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Mandrake »

Trainman wrote:Dragging this back to the car........ I've driven her this morning and all is fine, this is driving me bonkers........, I'm going to sit down this afternoon and have a look at sorting out one of the two 30 pin cables I have to try and get it to work, the other alternative is a run down to Jim's to swap the ECU or 'nick' one of Simon's old V6 when Will decides what he's doing with it......
The ECU from my old car is good...not sure if a S2 ECU can go in a S1 car - best to check with uncle Jim on that ;)

If you want to confirm any of the pinouts of the the 16 to 30 pin adaptor I can run a multimeter over mine...

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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by KP »

All TC's need the weld strip grinding off and then rewelding when done though :)

Steve we can definitely give the ECU's a swap when I being it down, you'll need to pop round as it will be driveway bound once I get it home :)

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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Mandrake »

KP wrote:All TC's need the weld strip grinding off and then rewelding when done though :)

Steve we can definitely give the ECU's a swap when I being it down, you'll need to pop round as it will be driveway bound once I get it home :)
If you guys start swapping gearbox ECU's between the two cars beware - you MUST perform an auto adaptive reset on each ECU with a Lexia before you drive the new host car so they can "learn" the characteristics of the different gearboxes.

My gearbox is very worn and will have totally different clutch characteristics to Steve's so both will change very poorly and possibly make some funny noises and have odd behaviour until the reset is done.

You do the auto adaptive reset in the replacement parts section of Lexia. After doing the reset you MUST as the first trip the car makes after the reset take it on a spirited test drive of 10-15 minutes where lots of gear changing under acceleration and deceleration is involved - this is so the ECU can quickly learn the new gearbox characteristics during a special accelerated learning phase that only lasts a certain amount of time/miles. (Yes the service manual says this spirited test drive must be done :lol: )

If you take it for a lazy drive on urban streets or a cruise on the motorway it won't learn properly so find a windy country road where you can alternatively boot it and slow down, working up and down through the gears. (I find gearbox sport mode good for this)

Its normal for changes to be quite abrupt for the first 5-10 minutes or so after the auto adaptive reset so don't panic, keep driving and working it through the gears and it will quickly smooth out.

If you can't get the Lexia working on the 30 pin car, you could do the auto adaptive reset on my ECU while its still in my car then immediately transplant it into Steve's car before driving it. (Then do the spirited test drive immediately)

furriegurrie
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by furriegurrie »

DHallworth wrote:
KP wrote:Jim seriously you need to think about offering exchange gearboxes with tc's to CC members and the like as I bet you could easily sell some around the world and any extra pennies could always go on your new activa tuning adventures ;)
Knowing that a torque converter costs about £500 to have reconditioned and the only place worth sending it to is Mackie's in Glasgow, then there's Jim's time etc. to go into each box and any parts it needs, Jim would need to be charging about £1k a gearbox for it to be worth his while. There's so few Xantia/XM/C5 etc. V6's on the road these days and as they're worth so little money I honestly don't believe people would spend the money often enough for it to be a commercially viable hobby.

The other problem you've got is Xantia's and XM's use slightly different internals within the gearbox. If you fit a Xantia box in an XM you'll forever have the snow and sport lights flashing on the dash so you'd also need to have one of each ready to offer.

David.
Can you eleborate a bit about teh differences between the 4HP20 in a serie 2 Xantia and an Xm. I have recently purchased a Xantia V6 with the idea to have teh autobox spare for my Xms. I've overhauled one of these boxes succesfully about 6months ago so know a bit about them now. Are the differences, other than the selector handle in the car, in the valveblock and the ecu?