V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

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DickieG
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by DickieG »

CitroJim wrote:Right, just finished breakfast - off we go to have another go at fixing...
Oi what time do you call this Jim you having a lazy day? I'd have thought you would have been at for at least three hours by 8am :lol:
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Trainman
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Trainman »

Says he's been up since 4am....... :^o not sure about that, but about to test the brownies, so if he suddenly acquires another Xantia...... it was mine *gulp*

:lol: :lol:
Steve

2008 C6 2.7 Exclusive in Mativoire Beige with Vitali Leather.
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daviemck2006
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by daviemck2006 »

Then if your v6 goes to Sir Jim then you could get his activa to lpg :twisted::oops::lol::mrgreen:
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Trainman »

daviemck2006 wrote:Then if your v6 goes to Sir Jim then you could get his activa to lpg :twisted::oops::lol::mrgreen:
If these 'brownies' kick in I won't be fit for anything...... [-o<
Steve

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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by KP »

Ha ha! Are they chilli brownies?
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Trainman »

KP wrote:Ha ha! Are they chilli brownies?
No, Chilli for tea........ :-#
Steve

2008 C6 2.7 Exclusive in Mativoire Beige with Vitali Leather.
2019 C5 1.6 Aircross Flair+ in Platinum Grey with Claudia Rimini Leather

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myglaren
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by myglaren »

KP wrote:Ha ha! Are they chilli brownies?
or 'hash' brownies :twisted:
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by KP »

Ooo lucky you :D
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CitroJim
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by CitroJim »

Yep, been up since 4. Washing done, two applie crumbles baked and the aforementioned brownies whih I'm sorry to disappoint you, are just normal ones with no 'additions' at all...

Just now trying to download a new software image to the spare ECU for Steve. It's taking ages...
Jim

Runner, cyclist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by KP »

Ooo I didn't realise there were firmware updates for ecu's on our xantias Jim! Where and how do you get them?
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Mandrake
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Mandrake »

CitroJim wrote:Yep, been up since 4. Washing done, two applie crumbles baked and the aforementioned brownies whih I'm sorry to disappoint you, are just normal ones with no 'additions' at all...

Just now trying to download a new software image to the spare ECU for Steve. It's taking ages...
Noooooooooo.......! :lol:

You'll add the depolution "feature" which holds 1st to 3300rpm for two minutes when cold...

I deliberately did NOT update the gearbox ECU firmware on my new V6 after making that mistake on the first one... :roll:

(I did update the engine ECU firmware though :twisted: )
Simon

1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White

2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
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CitroJim
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by CitroJim »

I know but sadly I had no choice. I was using the ELIT and the menu took me somewherte I really didn't want to go :twisted:

Before I knew what was happening a download had commenced...

I have reinitiliased an S2 with the ELIT but the S1 menus look different...

Hopefully no damage done...
Jim

Runner, cyclist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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Mandrake
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Mandrake »

Oh well, if that fails, you have a Lexia as well ? Fortunately there seems to be a ROM based boot loader in the gearbox ECU - as it seems to be possible to recover from a failed upload. How do I know ? :roll: #-o :oops:

Yes, I had a failed upload on my first attempt on the old car which left it in a state of hydraulic emergency mode and flashing sport/snow lights even after a battery off reset - I thought it was toast #-o but it responded to a second upload attempt after the battery had been removed and all was well after that. [-o<

On the newer firmware if the gearbox oil temp is below a certain temperature then it always does the depolution thing for the first two minutes - every cold start in the morning without fail.

On the older firmware in my new V6 it doesn't do the depolution thing on the first cold start of the morning - it changes up at normal rpm immediately, however sometimes later in the day a subsequent warmer start will exhibit behaviour similar to the depolution mode where it holds 1st to higher rpm for a while...

I think the cause of that can be explained though - from what I remember from the manual the currently active adaptive program (SK1-6 etc) is memorised at switch off and if the gearbox oil is warm (above 30 degrees ?) it resumes immediately in the previously memorised SK mode. So if you were driving in a very sporty fashion shortly before you switched off, when you start up next it resumes in that sporty mode where gears are held higher.

However if the oil temperature is low during startup (as on the first start on a cold morning) it always begins in SK2...

Anyway, I'm leaving my ECU firmware alone and I kinda wish I hadn't done the auto adaptive reset either...
Simon

1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White

2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Trainman »

Jim discovered that the engine speed sensor wasn't getting a constant signal, and when it did get a signal it was fluctuating so much it was almost unreadable. He is now studying his electrical wiring bible......

More later
Steve

2008 C6 2.7 Exclusive in Mativoire Beige with Vitali Leather.
2019 C5 1.6 Aircross Flair+ in Platinum Grey with Claudia Rimini Leather

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Mandrake
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Re: V6 Xantia......... the beginning of another adventure

Post by Mandrake »

Interesting.

Jim - are you measuring it at the back of the ECU connector ? I definitely remember getting an inconsistent, much lower than expected signal from the crank sensor on my old V6 too when I was first trying to measure it, but I'm pretty sure it turned out to be a measurement error.

I'm sure you know this - but it's a floating differential signal on pins 48 and 49 with pin 19 as the shield... From memory I think the error I made was to try to measure pin 48 or 49 relative to earth assuming the differential signal was balanced around earth as I was also trying to measure another signal on a second channel. (and thus share the earth reference for the scope)

But it seems the crank signal may be transformer coupled inside the ECU (with no earthed centre tap) and therefore truly floating with no earth reference, thus it can't be measured with respect to earth.

Measured with respect to earth I was seeing only a few hundred millivolts and it kept changing all over the place. With the scope between pin 48 and 49 I was seeing a strong consistent signal. From memory it was about 2v p-p at idle rising to nearly 10v p-p at about 2500 rpm... my figures could be a bit out, but it was many volts worth of signal.

It would be nice if you find a genuine fault with that signal though. :)
Simon

1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White

2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive