Gethro wrote:Neil thanks for your comments. I understand your thoughts and am trying to negotiate with the GM not the SM. one question you may be able to give a reasoned opinion on given you history.
Why do you think they (both manufacturer and dealer) are unwilling to open up the engine and investigate or allow me to have it independently inspected without losing their contribution and all at my cost; not only that but they will not allow me to witness the removal of the failed parts and will not give me them either if I agree to the works being done: i understand why they have now given me a deadline of a week to agree or otherwise but it's frustrating when it actually could be linked to the recall?
Lets be honest, it's easy to tar the last man who touched the car, who is potentially a better mechanic because he's independent and relys on extremely high customer satsfaction to spread the word and does'nt rely on a computer system to diagnose a problem. I think I've also said before he changed the oil; I'm no mechanic but I am technically aware in my field and I can't believe a different manufacturers oil to that approved by Citroen would cause a Conrod to fail. The oil surely only needs to comply to the high standards set by BSI? I could equally question the QA of the dealer as surely they'd want to know what if anything caused this: they'd then know when the next customer turns up with similar problem.
Would appreciate your thoughts.
Gethro,
I'm only guessing here, as you will appreciate. However Citroen seem to be saying in effect either let us agree not to investigate, just get it fixed and each pay a proportion, OR lets investigate and see where that leads, but the pragmatic solution of offering a 'goodwill' no profit fix will be withdrawn. Of course, if its stripped and there's irrefutable evidence of a bodge job by the dealer - I can't imagine what that might look like, to be honest, but lets say the remains of a 10mm spanner is found in there - Citroen will no doubt pay, or rather insist on the dealer paying, in full. But equally, if there isn't and it remains a mystery, or if your indie has put some unsuitable (perhaps viscosity not quality?) oil in there, aren't they entitled to say ' well we WERE prepared to do a deal, to get this sorted asap, but you chose not to accept it so now we go back to positions of strict liability' - prove it was our fault or sod off, in short?
However - two things!
The car and everything on it IS YOURS and you can do whatever you like with it, UNTIL you accept Citroen's offer, at which point they will insist , as always on the failed parts being returned to them - both ownership and physically. Always that way for warranty or goodwill claims. They offer, you accept, on those terms or not at all. They won't allow you to stand in the workshop because of real or perceived insurance, H&S and staff concerns, but if the car is to be opened up, not as a result of you accepting the goodwill offer but as part of an investigation, you're quite entitled to have someone there - eg AA or independent engineer - but again they may say they will accept the engine being stripped, but not on their premises if this is to be a litigious affair.
After all, they want their techs and workspace making money, and Citroen want to be getting on making and selling enough cars to be in a position to offer goodwill to you and others! This is a big deal to you, and understandably so, given the potential costs but very small beer to the dealer and particularly Citroen. They will have a quick go at making you happy, if they fail they will accept that you will remain sad/angry and move on, accepting also that their publicity machine is bigger than yours and there is very small chance of you pursuing this to a successful conclusion at court, and even if you do the cost to them is a mere bagatelle...!
I'm not saying it's fair, or ideal, but then again all they want is to keep you as a potential future customer. Once that possibility is obviously lost, so is their interest. That's my reading of it, for what its worth and my advice remains as before!
Also - to my eyes, given the issue of your having left the Citroen network as fast as possible once the warranty expired, let alone the possible issue re the oil change, Citroen are being quite good about this. If you can get the dealership to do as I suggested, or thereabouts, I do think that'd be fair and certainly as good as you'll get. Particularly if as I suspect, Citroen would have no intention of faffing around repairing your engine or swapping parts, they'd just supply a short motor, factory assembled and just needing the head swapped?
Hope that helps!
Oh and PS - Have you asked the GM if he will do what I suggested? What did he say, if you have?
Neil