I have just replaced the four spheres on my xantia 1.9TD SX but am unable to get the system to repressurize.
The procedure for removing trhem was more or less the same as that described elsewhere in the forum. I set the suspension to its highest setting and turned the sphere 1/8 - 1/4 of a turn. I then dropped the suspension to its lowest setting and opened the bleed screw on the front accumulator, there was no hissing, I had it opened almost to the point where it would come out if I had let it. I removed rear spheres first when i opened the first sphere a lot of LHM came out the next one had some leakage but not as much, I replaced these. Next were the fronts they had some leakage (again the first more than the second) but not as much as the rears.
I set the height lever to normal and started the engine. The suspension wouldn't rise so I tried bleeding the system. This is where I am unclear about the procedure, sould the bleeding be done with the engine running or not, I have tried both but I seemed to be only getting LHM with no bubbles with the engine running and with the engine off there did seem to be some bubbles. I tried priming the hydraulic pump when I removed the hose there was LHM fluid in it and when the engine was started the fluid disappeared and I replaced the hose quickly.
I am at the situation now where I think the pump is primed and I am starting the engine letting it run for a few minutes switching it off and bleeding the system, there doesn't seem to be any more air in the system. The accumulator is not clicking. Before changing the spheres the accumulator was clicking every 15 seconds or so, the plan was to change the spheres first and leave the accumulator for another day.
T.P.
Xantia suspension won't repressurize
Moderator: RichardW
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JamesQB
- Posts: 375
- Joined: 13 Aug 2003, 18:01
- Location: North Wales, United Kingdom
- My Cars: Citroen Xantia 1.8 - I miss this car a lot.
- x 5
You say you undid the bleed screw on the accumulator to the point where it would have come out if you'd let it... from what I know there is a small ball under there that can become easily lost, whether it has anywhere inside the accumulator to go if it's undone too much I don't know but I thought it could only be lost if the screw were to be removed completely.
Have you retightened the bleed screw properly? It sounds like the pressure isn't building up at all which would happen if the little ball was missing, you'd have the fluid returning straight to the reservoir instead of into the system... There's no need to undo the bleed screw more than a complete full turn really. Half a turn does me every time.
I've bled the system by starting the engine, putting it into the minimum height setting, turning off the engine and then undoing the bleed screw half a turn.
Another way I've heard of (and sounds more effective) is to leave the engine running the whole time with the car on the minimum height setting, with the engine still running, unscrew the bleed screw half a turn and let the fluid cycle through it, the pump will be sucking up fluid from the reservoir, sending it through the primary circuit and then back again to the reservoir, purging air in those pipes while doing so.
When this is done, re-tighten the bleed screw and, leaving the engine running still, put the car into the maximum height setting. Let it rise up completely and then put it into the minimum setting, let it drop completely. Continue to do this several times (maximum, minimum, maximum...) to prime the rest of the hydraulic system. It should get better and better as more air is purged out of the system.
Unfortunately, it sounds less like an air problem and more like the system not pressurising at all which would either mean a major leak of fluid onto the floor or within a component sending the pressure created straight back to the reservoir. Hopefully someone else can advise on whether or not the ball in the accumulator could be lost...
James
Have you retightened the bleed screw properly? It sounds like the pressure isn't building up at all which would happen if the little ball was missing, you'd have the fluid returning straight to the reservoir instead of into the system... There's no need to undo the bleed screw more than a complete full turn really. Half a turn does me every time.
I've bled the system by starting the engine, putting it into the minimum height setting, turning off the engine and then undoing the bleed screw half a turn.
Another way I've heard of (and sounds more effective) is to leave the engine running the whole time with the car on the minimum height setting, with the engine still running, unscrew the bleed screw half a turn and let the fluid cycle through it, the pump will be sucking up fluid from the reservoir, sending it through the primary circuit and then back again to the reservoir, purging air in those pipes while doing so.
When this is done, re-tighten the bleed screw and, leaving the engine running still, put the car into the maximum height setting. Let it rise up completely and then put it into the minimum setting, let it drop completely. Continue to do this several times (maximum, minimum, maximum...) to prime the rest of the hydraulic system. It should get better and better as more air is purged out of the system.
Unfortunately, it sounds less like an air problem and more like the system not pressurising at all which would either mean a major leak of fluid onto the floor or within a component sending the pressure created straight back to the reservoir. Hopefully someone else can advise on whether or not the ball in the accumulator could be lost...
James
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JamesQB
- Posts: 375
- Joined: 13 Aug 2003, 18:01
- Location: North Wales, United Kingdom
- My Cars: Citroen Xantia 1.8 - I miss this car a lot.
- x 5
I may be wrong but I think the hydraulic pump is a 6+2 type (two thin metal pipes coming from the pump, instead of just one), this means it has 6 pistons working to deliver high pressure fluid to the power steering and 2 pistons delivering high pressure fluid to the accumulator and hence to the suspension and brakes.
If the accumulator were to have a problem stopping the system from pressurizing, the power steering should still work, as you say it is.
I'm hoping someone here has some knowledge of the ball in the accumulator, how it can become lost or if it can move into the wrong place if the screw is undone too much, etc and able to advise on what to do if this is the suspected cause.
I did a search of these forums and found a thread that almost mirrored yours. A fellow was talking about the same problem you have, after working on the hydraulics, the system wouldn't repressurize. He said he had completely removed the pressure release screw but saw nothing come out or fly out. I've grabbed the salient points from all the messages:
<font color="blue">Dave (Helper): "I think it's pretty obvious that the ball has gone missing if you tightened the screw again and still nothing happens.
Try the power steering, if there is power assistance there then the pump is fully primed and working, this would nail the culprit as being the lost sealing ball.
Your option's then would be to purchase a complete new regulator, very expensive, or go to a scrappy armed with a 12mm ring spanner and find a BX with the lump still in and do the same to that, this time though catch the bits that fly fall out, I say BX as you are unlikely to find a Xantia on the heap with the lump still in.
Tell us what you find with the steering.....
Dave"</font id="blue">
<font color="red">Person Wanting Help: "I am fairly sure nothing popped out...........is this poss"</font id="red">
followed by this fellow then saying that he'd solved the problem and, responding to those who wanted to know what the solution was...
<font color="red">Person Wanting Help: "Basically, it was a case of nipping down my local ball bearing place picking up three 7mm ball bearings free of charge ( Kind old fella ) and inserting one in the place where I lost the original from (Incidentally, there is no spring behind the pressure release screw ). The rest they say is history.
P.S, Citroen could supply a 7mm bearing, but only on special order and only in packs of 50. (£2.50 for 50).
Cheers"</font id="red">
Hope this helps! [:)]
If the accumulator were to have a problem stopping the system from pressurizing, the power steering should still work, as you say it is.
I'm hoping someone here has some knowledge of the ball in the accumulator, how it can become lost or if it can move into the wrong place if the screw is undone too much, etc and able to advise on what to do if this is the suspected cause.
I did a search of these forums and found a thread that almost mirrored yours. A fellow was talking about the same problem you have, after working on the hydraulics, the system wouldn't repressurize. He said he had completely removed the pressure release screw but saw nothing come out or fly out. I've grabbed the salient points from all the messages:
<font color="blue">Dave (Helper): "I think it's pretty obvious that the ball has gone missing if you tightened the screw again and still nothing happens.
Try the power steering, if there is power assistance there then the pump is fully primed and working, this would nail the culprit as being the lost sealing ball.
Your option's then would be to purchase a complete new regulator, very expensive, or go to a scrappy armed with a 12mm ring spanner and find a BX with the lump still in and do the same to that, this time though catch the bits that fly fall out, I say BX as you are unlikely to find a Xantia on the heap with the lump still in.
Tell us what you find with the steering.....
Dave"</font id="blue">
<font color="red">Person Wanting Help: "I am fairly sure nothing popped out...........is this poss"</font id="red">
followed by this fellow then saying that he'd solved the problem and, responding to those who wanted to know what the solution was...
<font color="red">Person Wanting Help: "Basically, it was a case of nipping down my local ball bearing place picking up three 7mm ball bearings free of charge ( Kind old fella ) and inserting one in the place where I lost the original from (Incidentally, there is no spring behind the pressure release screw ). The rest they say is history.
P.S, Citroen could supply a 7mm bearing, but only on special order and only in packs of 50. (£2.50 for 50).
Cheers"</font id="red">
Hope this helps! [:)]
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blueboy2001
- Posts: 423
- Joined: 29 Jan 2003, 04:16
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- My Cars:
Thanks to everyone who replied to my post I have to put my hands up and say that the fault was mine. I figured that bleed screw only needed to be tightened to the point where there was no fluid or air getting out, of coures this was sending all of the fluid back to the reservoir. Tightening the screw fully did the job.
The spheres have been replaced and the ride is back to its usual self.
Once again thanks to everyone
The spheres have been replaced and the ride is back to its usual self.
Once again thanks to everyone