Xantia-Sphere Specs

[NewcastleFalcon]

Got my new spheres in store today at GSF. Its as well going along armed with exactly what you want.

I also printed off a voucher code from the GSF website which got me 10% off in store. The discount is probably available at most GSF stores.

Fitted the spheres bounce test OK now, but a small test run has returned me to a problem which I covered in my first ever post to the FCF, a leak from the join between rear strut and sphere.

Xantia Rear Strut Removal

In my pre-enlightenment days when I attacked the rusty canonball with a lump hammer and chisel, before I read the post about the bent threaded rod sphere remover, the end of the strut got a bit chewed up specifically the recess where the sealing ring sits.

I have a problem now sealing the sphere at this junction. I did achieve a fix by using a genuine citroen sphere, and using gas spec plumbers thread sealing tape on the threads of the sphere itself. I am not sure which contributed most to achieving the seal but it worked and lasted.

I will be giving the tape a try before I resort to other fixes.

Regards Neil

[citronut]

i cant see how with whatever butchery used to remove a sphere you could damage the seal seat, as in theory it is protected till the sphere is off

[NewcastleFalcon]

I will take a picture of it tomorrow before I make a second attempt at the plumbers tape solution ( I only had the ordinary white stuff lying around today not the gas spec yellow stuff I used last time). The sealing suface is flat but the "rim" is rough and chewed in places. Sealing ring stays in place and sphere tightens up but the seal isn't good enough when the system is under pressure.

regards Neil

[citronut]

ok
i would clean/file any lumps and bumps out of the surface of the suspension unit, then the sphere might sit tight against the seal

[NewcastleFalcon]

I have taken a picture of the strut end with the O-ring in place er.....not my best




The rim is chewed-is its function to stop the O-ring from spreading? Could a fix be generated by utilising the correct size of "washer with an o-ring in the middle"-

Does anyone know what I mean?..I bet there is a proper name for those things I am always happy to learn new stuff.

What about a bit of plastic metal to re-establish the rim?

I have two rear struts in the shed but I don't want to do a replacement job if I can avoid it.
The threads on the spheres look parallel to me, but the gas spec tape is a higher density than the ordinary white stuff and managed to stem the leak last time. Certainly its no worse than when I sealed it up a couple of years ago.

The old sphere I removed was numbered 96 178 590, no chevrons on it though and further numbers 0- `125 and DJ in big letters. Surprisingly I have another sphere and strut and the sphere is marked with the same numbers/letters.

I presume these must be old citroen part no's because couldn't find reference to them anywhere on the linked tables.

Does anyone know the description for the 96 178 590 part number?

Many thanks

Neil

[citronut]

that is eroded away in a big way,
i would just fit another strut/ram

[NewcastleFalcon]

I am going to try this approach, following a conversation with a friendly engineer



Not my own original thought, but something worth a try. As long as the face is not too damaged the copper ring should have a good chance of providing a better seal than the rubber.

Proof of the pudding is always in the eating though and I will find out soon enough. I am tempted to do a belt and braces job with a bit of threadsealing tape but if the copper seal works it should not need the additional braces.

regards

Neil

[citronut]

were is that copper ring going to bear onto cylinder and sphere at what point,

i dont think it will work as theres 2,600 psi im there,

o belive all the time you have /are spending trying to seal this cylinder you could have fitted the other cylinders by now, and be done with it,

you could always take th old ones to someone that can ally weld, then go to a machine shop to get the surface re/machined

[NewcastleFalcon]

I am a bit nervous to start the strut removal job. Got the others out when I was destroying the old car so it didn't matter too much how many other bits I damaged along the way. If it would whip out easy I would have done just what you have said.

The ring just fits into the recess where the rubber ring goes, bears on the flat surface and is sandwiched between the body of the sphere and the strut end just like the rubber ring. In theory so I am told the copper "gasket" could withstand even more pressure than the rubber o-ring.

Problem is nipping it up tight enough and this is probably where the trial will come unstuck. Still if it does I have lost nothing, and will just have to get over the various trials and tribulations of getting the strut out and replacing it with one of thefairly reasonable ones I have.

If anyone has an exploded diagram of the strut/radius arm it may be useful if I have to go down this route.

thanks

Neil

[citronut]

the trouble i can see will be the copper ring wont meet the sphere as its not as thick as the seal, even with the seal compressed

[NewcastleFalcon]

Thats a good point. The copper ring was the right diameter to fit in the recess but the inner dimensions had to be widened to just fit over the threads of the sphere. The ring as you say is probably not thick enough to make the necessary contact to achieve a seal, and undoubtedly to give it a chance of sealing the sphere will have to be screwed on pretty tight.
With the system depressurised the strut flops about and it is difficult to brace it whilst tightening up the sphere. In normal circumstances getting the sphere hand-tight only doesn't present this difficulty.

The idea came from a brief conversation with an engineer I know, and there gets to be a sort of motivation/satisfaction to take the idea on and make the fix work. Certainly if I get the strut off he is quite willing to come up with a more permanent refurb of the strut for me.

regards

Neil

[Xantidote]

Although it's always very rewarding to come up with a method of repair to avoid having to throw an item away, if you're going to have to remove the offending strut to effect a repair using the copper ring, then you might as well just fit one of your spare struts. Also, you're less likely to have problems when you next have to remove the sphere.

[citronut]

you could always file the outter edge of the cylinder ( the eroded section ) down so it brings the copper washer proud of the cylinder surface, that is if the working tip of the sphere is not going to cime into contact with anything/the piston when screwed in to make a seal

[NewcastleFalcon]

The sphere has successfully sealed with the strut with no leaks..............................................

The sphere tightened, bracing the strut end with some adjustable grips, to the necessary level to produce the seal.

However, the pipe leading to the strut must have been flexed a bit to much producing a weep or spray from the pipe.

Thanks for your help/observations/comments on the thread, but I feel a new one is coming on if I hit problems with this pipe replacement. I will need to get the car jacked up and supported a little higher cos the pipe from the rear nearside suspension strut is difficult to trace and I am not sure at the minute where it ends up

regards

Neil

[Xantidote]

The sphere has successfully sealed with the strut with no leaks

Did you use the copper seal in the end, or manage to achieve a good seal without it?

Re. the pipe - hope you haven't swapped one problem for another