Many thanks jgra1 - a supremely helpful set of pics (dare I suggest a sticky to assist future belt-changers?). Certainly provides a lot more clarity to the job in hand - and makes me think it would be a 15 minute job with the engine out!
I also came across this site: http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showth ... p=13561143" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; which includes a description and a diagram which I found helpful.
I've now taken the (blindingly obvious) precaution of investing £3.00 in a s/h Haynes manual so will study that when it arrives.
What a great site this is!
Attempting a cam belt change
Moderator: RichardW
Re: Attempting a cam belt change
52 reg Xsara 110 hdi
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Re: Attempting a cam belt change
no problems Smoker glad they are of use.. how would we survive without dig cams!
Re: Attempting a cam belt change
OK - so not what you might call a great success so far.
HELP! Really stuck putting the new aux belt back on. I looked at the the old one, thought I understood the routing and cut it off. Now I can't for the life of me work out how to re-route the new one. It appears to be the same length as the old one, and all the pulleys etc are in place with the tensioner slackened off. Can anyone describe the route for me, or have a pic? non-turbo xud with a/c and pas.
Also, had to mave the car quickly part way through job - with engine mount removed it rolled off the jack under the sump causing the engine to drop and puncture the drive shaft gaitor. So, just caused yet another job (assuming the drive shaft isn't damaged).
Other than that, mostly back together, till I damage something else....
HELP! Really stuck putting the new aux belt back on. I looked at the the old one, thought I understood the routing and cut it off. Now I can't for the life of me work out how to re-route the new one. It appears to be the same length as the old one, and all the pulleys etc are in place with the tensioner slackened off. Can anyone describe the route for me, or have a pic? non-turbo xud with a/c and pas.
Also, had to mave the car quickly part way through job - with engine mount removed it rolled off the jack under the sump causing the engine to drop and puncture the drive shaft gaitor. So, just caused yet another job (assuming the drive shaft isn't damaged).
Other than that, mostly back together, till I damage something else....
52 reg Xsara 110 hdi
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Re: Attempting a cam belt change
Will this work?
2010 C5 X7 VTR+Nav 160
1998 1.5 Saxo
1998 Pug 306 1.9D
2018 C4 B7 VTR+
2011 Citroen C1
1998 1.5 Saxo
1998 Pug 306 1.9D
2018 C4 B7 VTR+
2011 Citroen C1
Re: Attempting a cam belt change
Thanks. It was exactly what I had sketched. My error was not realising there are two! tensioners. One is a manual eccentric tensioner, the other a large spring loaded one. I had only found one and couldn't get the belt to fit. So that bit of the job is done.
BUT just tried to start it and IT WON'T GO. I strongly suspect i've got it a tooth out on the timing belt despite being super careful.
I locked the cam and pump, and marked the crank as I couldn't see the flywheel locking hole and the Haynes is useless in explaining it. So the whole lot has to come off again Can anyone describe in idiot's langauge where the flywheel locking hole is and how I get to it? Sorry for letting the side down.
BUT just tried to start it and IT WON'T GO. I strongly suspect i've got it a tooth out on the timing belt despite being super careful.
I locked the cam and pump, and marked the crank as I couldn't see the flywheel locking hole and the Haynes is useless in explaining it. So the whole lot has to come off again Can anyone describe in idiot's langauge where the flywheel locking hole is and how I get to it? Sorry for letting the side down.
52 reg Xsara 110 hdi
Re: Attempting a cam belt change
Won't start? So the starter is turning the engine but it won't fire into life?
Spider explained where the flywheel timing hole is in an early post on this thread. You need to stick your hand up under the the starter with the locking tool and rummage about. My locking tool is an 8mm drill bit with a zip tie for a handle. You can feel it slot in, but it's a fiddly bugger. If you've locked the camshaft and injector pump correctly, the flywheel timing hole will be in the right place.
I may be wrong here, but I doubt the crankshaft will have moved, despite not being locked. The only big risk of moving it is when you undo the crankshaft pulley bolt, and you do that before you lock the cam, injector pump and crankshaft.
If you've put the belt on a tooth out I reckon it would start, with a tapping noise, followed by a stall and lack of compression. Ask me how I know - I killed a lovely Pug 205 dturbo doing this...
If it's not starting, I suspect something else has been dislodged when the engine dropped, puncturing the driveshaft gaiter.
Spider explained where the flywheel timing hole is in an early post on this thread. You need to stick your hand up under the the starter with the locking tool and rummage about. My locking tool is an 8mm drill bit with a zip tie for a handle. You can feel it slot in, but it's a fiddly bugger. If you've locked the camshaft and injector pump correctly, the flywheel timing hole will be in the right place.
I may be wrong here, but I doubt the crankshaft will have moved, despite not being locked. The only big risk of moving it is when you undo the crankshaft pulley bolt, and you do that before you lock the cam, injector pump and crankshaft.
If you've put the belt on a tooth out I reckon it would start, with a tapping noise, followed by a stall and lack of compression. Ask me how I know - I killed a lovely Pug 205 dturbo doing this...
If it's not starting, I suspect something else has been dislodged when the engine dropped, puncturing the driveshaft gaiter.
2000 Clio 1.2 8-valve
1993 Mercedes 190E
2007 Honda FRV diesel
1998 Xsara TD, 293K - gone but not forgotten.
205s, 405, ZXs all loved and crushed.
1993 Mercedes 190E
2007 Honda FRV diesel
1998 Xsara TD, 293K - gone but not forgotten.
205s, 405, ZXs all loved and crushed.
Re: Attempting a cam belt change
Sorry to hear of your experience - hope I don't repeat it! Yes - turns over but won't catch - normally it's pretty much instant.
Going to start again soon (when it gets light). I have some time today so will re-check the timing first then go from there. I'll report back.
Going to start again soon (when it gets light). I have some time today so will re-check the timing first then go from there. I'll report back.
52 reg Xsara 110 hdi
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- (Donor 2021)
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Re: Attempting a cam belt change
take starter out smoker.. its a few mins job.. disconnnect batt first..
hope it's all back together and running ok..
J
hope it's all back together and running ok..
J
Re: Attempting a cam belt change
OK - it lives! Cam and IP (or crank, depending on how you look at it) were out by 1 tooth. Bad spannering on my part. All corrected and fired straight up.
I've also saved a bit of weight - from the belt covers, a number of fragments of which are lying on the garage floor.
And, the gaiter which I thought was punctured has just popped off the drive shaft (the fat end inboard of the driver's side wheel). Looks "interesting" to try and refit. Just off to see if I can get a new clip for it.
I've also saved a bit of weight - from the belt covers, a number of fragments of which are lying on the garage floor.
And, the gaiter which I thought was punctured has just popped off the drive shaft (the fat end inboard of the driver's side wheel). Looks "interesting" to try and refit. Just off to see if I can get a new clip for it.
52 reg Xsara 110 hdi
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Re: Attempting a cam belt change
Good to hear its OK.
I was going to say I had to take the starter out of the 205 to get the pin in (the factory tool as well) as the pattern / third party starter was too large. You do not need to disconnect its cabling just undo the bolts and it will move an inch which is enough, but this is a moot point now you've done it (congrats , the next one will be easier)
Factors should have a clip, failing that a strong good quality cable tie will probably do if its "head" will not obstruct anything.
I was going to say I had to take the starter out of the 205 to get the pin in (the factory tool as well) as the pattern / third party starter was too large. You do not need to disconnect its cabling just undo the bolts and it will move an inch which is enough, but this is a moot point now you've done it (congrats , the next one will be easier)
Factors should have a clip, failing that a strong good quality cable tie will probably do if its "head" will not obstruct anything.
Andy.
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
Re: Attempting a cam belt change
Close one eh?
You're not alone. Three years back I lost a socket doing the belt on my Xsara. It took me a month to find it - resting beside the belt tensioner under the belt covers. Another near disaster!
Good job my Merc has a timing chain...
Glad to hear you're now winning.
You're not alone. Three years back I lost a socket doing the belt on my Xsara. It took me a month to find it - resting beside the belt tensioner under the belt covers. Another near disaster!
Good job my Merc has a timing chain...
Glad to hear you're now winning.
2000 Clio 1.2 8-valve
1993 Mercedes 190E
2007 Honda FRV diesel
1998 Xsara TD, 293K - gone but not forgotten.
205s, 405, ZXs all loved and crushed.
1993 Mercedes 190E
2007 Honda FRV diesel
1998 Xsara TD, 293K - gone but not forgotten.
205s, 405, ZXs all loved and crushed.
Re: Attempting a cam belt change
Thanks again for all the moral support. I guess first time was never going to be easy. If I still have the car after another 30k miles I'll be able to do it in half an hour...ish
52 reg Xsara 110 hdi
- CitroJim
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Re: Attempting a cam belt change
Well done Smoker, excellent work
I once lost a woodruff key down amongst the timing belt on a 1.9TD when doing a pump change... I stripped off all the covers and could not see it for the life of me and then spotted it on a ledge right below the crank sprocket. Oh the reliefralph wrote:Close one eh?
You're not alone. Three years back I lost a socket doing the belt on my Xsara. It took me a month to find it - resting beside the belt tensioner under the belt covers. Another near disaster!
Jim
Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...