Err no it doesn't, ABS increases braking distances.HDI wrote:A number seemed to know what ABS stood for, fewer knew it reduced braking distances
New drivers and towing is so confusing any ideas please?
Moderator: RichardW
-
- Posts: 8125
- Joined: 04 Dec 2008, 22:08
- Location: Northeast
- My Cars: 07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10 - x 110
It does rather depend on conditions and if you have the wheels locked or not surely?DickieG wrote:Err no it doesn't, ABS increases braking distances.HDI wrote:A number seemed to know what ABS stood for, fewer knew it reduced braking distances
Id never choose a car without ABS over one with it, seems like a massive safety feature to me, especially if its fitted with EBD.
EBD does reduce braking distances.
Chris
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
.
93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
.
93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10
I should have said it does in most practical circumstances with an average driver. Most drivers cannot hold a car at the limit of adhesion under maximum braking.DickieG wrote:Err no it doesn't, ABS increases braking distances.HDI wrote:A number seemed to know what ABS stood for, fewer knew it reduced braking distances
Now using '00 Xantia LX HDI, pov spec
My past Citroens :-
'00 Xantia SX HDI, now dead due to accident
'99 Xantia HDI 110 Exclusive, RIP
'97 Xantia TD SX
'96 Xantia TD LX
'96 ZX TD
'89 BX TD
'88 AX GT
'79 CX2400 Pallas (scrapped )
& a couple of Peugeots !
My past Citroens :-
'00 Xantia SX HDI, now dead due to accident
'99 Xantia HDI 110 Exclusive, RIP
'97 Xantia TD SX
'96 Xantia TD LX
'96 ZX TD
'89 BX TD
'88 AX GT
'79 CX2400 Pallas (scrapped )
& a couple of Peugeots !
- DickieG
- Monaco's youngest playboy
- Posts: 4877
- Joined: 25 Nov 2006, 09:15
- Location: Buckinghamshire
- My Cars:
- x 38
The purpose of ABS is to allow the vehicle to be steered whilst under maximum braking by preventing the wheels from locking up, this allows a balance of tyre grip between steering and braking.
The reason that ABS increases the overall braking distance is that when wheels lock up it causes a build up of debris to form ahead of the tyre which causes additional resistance hence shorter braking distance. Even on a dry/good road surface the scrubbing of a tyre against the road surface causes a build up of debris.
EBD on the other hand generally shortens braking distance as it distributes brake pressure to maximise braking on each wheel.
The reason that ABS increases the overall braking distance is that when wheels lock up it causes a build up of debris to form ahead of the tyre which causes additional resistance hence shorter braking distance. Even on a dry/good road surface the scrubbing of a tyre against the road surface causes a build up of debris.
EBD on the other hand generally shortens braking distance as it distributes brake pressure to maximise braking on each wheel.
13 Ram 1500 Hemi
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
New drivers and towing is so confusing any ideas please?
Personally, I would throw all abs etc onto the tip. Not needed. Car/truck makers went probably a 100 years without it. Then someone made the system, called it better than sliced bread, now we are all stuck with it. Just something else which can cost a fair bit to put right when it goes wrong.
I have had 2 wheel sensors go on my Xantia, bought from local factor(£40 each ); - Cit ones are nearly £80 each. I used the car with the orange light on for nearly 3 months ( cos it was too cold and wet and white to sort it ). Brakes worked fine, no skids or pulling when braking. That is my opinion of abs etc, and will never change. Had some nasty moments with abs on a 44 to truck too. No thank you.
Anyway, hope your lad gets it sorted. I drive artics for a living, also towed caravans and small camping trailers. The artic is easier to reverse into a space, the smaller the trailer the faster it goes out of sight and jacknifes. Move the steering wheel 1/8" in one direction or the other and the bloody thing has gone. .
Get him to try it and he will see what I mean. Good fun though. If one can reverse a camping trailer in a straight line, one can reverse anything, lol.
Greg
I have had 2 wheel sensors go on my Xantia, bought from local factor(£40 each ); - Cit ones are nearly £80 each. I used the car with the orange light on for nearly 3 months ( cos it was too cold and wet and white to sort it ). Brakes worked fine, no skids or pulling when braking. That is my opinion of abs etc, and will never change. Had some nasty moments with abs on a 44 to truck too. No thank you.
Anyway, hope your lad gets it sorted. I drive artics for a living, also towed caravans and small camping trailers. The artic is easier to reverse into a space, the smaller the trailer the faster it goes out of sight and jacknifes. Move the steering wheel 1/8" in one direction or the other and the bloody thing has gone. .
Get him to try it and he will see what I mean. Good fun though. If one can reverse a camping trailer in a straight line, one can reverse anything, lol.
Greg
90 Kawa EN 500 A1- was running---now dead again
04 Kawa GPZ 500 E10 -alive and well.
54 Fiat Punto 1.2 Dynamic
Old Xantias- 16v 2litre 1997 VSX, 2 x 1993 TD Lx, S2 SX 1.9TD
Old Bx's--3 x 1.9 D, 1x 1.6 Auto, 1 x 1.9 GTi, 1 x 1.9 TZS
- Xaccers
- Posts: 7654
- Joined: 07 Feb 2007, 23:46
- Location: Milling around Milton Keynes
- My Cars:
- x 184
http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/problems/Equipment/absbrakes.html wrote: Do cars with ABS stop more quickly than cars without? ABS is designed to help the driver maintain control of the vehicle during emergency braking situations, not make the car stop more quickly. ABS may shorten stopping distances on wet or slippery roads and many systems will shorten stopping distances on dry roads. On very soft surfaces, such as loose gravel or unpacked snow, an ABS system may actually lengthen stopping distances. In wet or slippery conditions, you should still make sure you drive carefully, always keep a safe distance behind the vehicle in front of you, and maintain a speed consistent with the road conditions.
1.9TD+ SX Xantia Estate (Cassy) running on 100% veg
1.9TD SX Xantia Hatchback (Jenny) running on 100% veg for sale
Laguna II 2.0dCi Privilege (Monty)
DIY sphere tool
1.9TD SX Xantia Hatchback (Jenny) running on 100% veg for sale
Laguna II 2.0dCi Privilege (Monty)
DIY sphere tool
- falling-out-with-my-car
- Posts: 1928
- Joined: 06 Apr 2008, 15:26
- Location: Northamptonshire
- My Cars: Citroen C5 Aircross 8 speed Automatic, Flair Model with far to many toys and nice comfy armchair like leather seats. ha ha Ive just had a conversation with the car. setting everything up verbally
- x 24
ABS is alright until you want to drive on snow or icy roads then its useless, might as well have a car without ABS.
Citroen Xantia S2 1.9 TD estate 189K soon to be broken for parts Jan 2017 headlamps & radiator fan assembly already spoken for & A 1987 Citroen 2CV6 special just for fun.
New addition Citroen C5 2.0 HDi Exclusive Hatch purchased 09/12/2016 with 83K on the clock.
New addition Citroen C5 2.0 HDi Exclusive Hatch purchased 09/12/2016 with 83K on the clock.
100% agree. I found this out on my christmas day drive last year. I was fighting with the ABS the whole way down a hill, trying to override it.falling-out-with-my-car wrote:ABS is alright until you want to drive on snow or icy roads then its useless, might as well have a car without ABS.
I guess that is the price you pay for having 4-pot Brembos on the front!
Toby
Previous:
2004 Peugeot 407 HDi 138 SE Luxury Pack
2001 S2 Xantia HDi 110 SX
2001 Peugeot 406 V6 Coupé
1998 S2 Xantia Activa
2000 S2 Xantia HDi 110 SX
1999 Peugeot 406 2.0 16v Estate
Previous:
2004 Peugeot 407 HDi 138 SE Luxury Pack
2001 S2 Xantia HDi 110 SX
2001 Peugeot 406 V6 Coupé
1998 S2 Xantia Activa
2000 S2 Xantia HDi 110 SX
1999 Peugeot 406 2.0 16v Estate
-
- Posts: 8125
- Joined: 04 Dec 2008, 22:08
- Location: Northeast
- My Cars: 07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10 - x 110
Going down a hill last weekend which i couldnt drive up and nor could anyone else due to snow, i went for the brake when doing a very slow speed, the ABS kicked in, the EBD worked and the car came to a very abrupt halt. Ideal!
Though ive little expereience of ABS without EBD, so that might be why i favour cars with it.
Though ive little expereience of ABS without EBD, so that might be why i favour cars with it.
Last edited by Citroenmad on 26 Feb 2011, 08:02, edited 1 time in total.
Chris
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
.
93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
07 Citroen C5 HDi VTR - Red
09 Citroen C3 1.4i VTR - Silver
01 Citroen Saxo 1.1i Forte - Mango Orange
.
93 Ford Mondeo 2.0i GLX
19 Hyundai i10
- Xaccers
- Posts: 7654
- Joined: 07 Feb 2007, 23:46
- Location: Milling around Milton Keynes
- My Cars:
- x 184
It's a pity we din't have a snow mode button which disables abs when the roads are icy
1.9TD+ SX Xantia Estate (Cassy) running on 100% veg
1.9TD SX Xantia Hatchback (Jenny) running on 100% veg for sale
Laguna II 2.0dCi Privilege (Monty)
DIY sphere tool
1.9TD SX Xantia Hatchback (Jenny) running on 100% veg for sale
Laguna II 2.0dCi Privilege (Monty)
DIY sphere tool
- falling-out-with-my-car
- Posts: 1928
- Joined: 06 Apr 2008, 15:26
- Location: Northamptonshire
- My Cars: Citroen C5 Aircross 8 speed Automatic, Flair Model with far to many toys and nice comfy armchair like leather seats. ha ha Ive just had a conversation with the car. setting everything up verbally
- x 24
That could simply be done according to speed, or with temperature sensors as soon as the outside temperature drops below 0 the abs comes off reactivating when the temperature rises, an automated system no chance of human error then not turnning it back on again.
in some vauxhalls there is a switch to disable the air bags on the passenger side of the car so people can put a child seat in the front not something I am recommending though, a baby must be more distracting than a mobile phone!!! there is plenty of scope here for human error not switching them back on again, I cant see why a temperature ABS disabling feature couldn't be used.
oh and thanks for the advice regarding trailers and newish drivers people.
in some vauxhalls there is a switch to disable the air bags on the passenger side of the car so people can put a child seat in the front not something I am recommending though, a baby must be more distracting than a mobile phone!!! there is plenty of scope here for human error not switching them back on again, I cant see why a temperature ABS disabling feature couldn't be used.
oh and thanks for the advice regarding trailers and newish drivers people.
Citroen Xantia S2 1.9 TD estate 189K soon to be broken for parts Jan 2017 headlamps & radiator fan assembly already spoken for & A 1987 Citroen 2CV6 special just for fun.
New addition Citroen C5 2.0 HDi Exclusive Hatch purchased 09/12/2016 with 83K on the clock.
New addition Citroen C5 2.0 HDi Exclusive Hatch purchased 09/12/2016 with 83K on the clock.
- falling-out-with-my-car
- Posts: 1928
- Joined: 06 Apr 2008, 15:26
- Location: Northamptonshire
- My Cars: Citroen C5 Aircross 8 speed Automatic, Flair Model with far to many toys and nice comfy armchair like leather seats. ha ha Ive just had a conversation with the car. setting everything up verbally
- x 24
Nah that wouldn't work for incontinent people
Citroen Xantia S2 1.9 TD estate 189K soon to be broken for parts Jan 2017 headlamps & radiator fan assembly already spoken for & A 1987 Citroen 2CV6 special just for fun.
New addition Citroen C5 2.0 HDi Exclusive Hatch purchased 09/12/2016 with 83K on the clock.
New addition Citroen C5 2.0 HDi Exclusive Hatch purchased 09/12/2016 with 83K on the clock.
- Xaccers
- Posts: 7654
- Joined: 07 Feb 2007, 23:46
- Location: Milling around Milton Keynes
- My Cars:
- x 184
Ew ew ew!
Good idea about the temperature control Nigel
Good idea about the temperature control Nigel
1.9TD+ SX Xantia Estate (Cassy) running on 100% veg
1.9TD SX Xantia Hatchback (Jenny) running on 100% veg for sale
Laguna II 2.0dCi Privilege (Monty)
DIY sphere tool
1.9TD SX Xantia Hatchback (Jenny) running on 100% veg for sale
Laguna II 2.0dCi Privilege (Monty)
DIY sphere tool