2001 C5 2.2HDi - Very Rattly then Stopped!!

corsehf · Post by **corsehf** » 17 Jan 2011, 00:30

Hiya Steve, good to hear from you again.
I'm hoping that it's an injector issue - will find out tomorrow but the guy who's checking out the injectors thinks it's a broken exhaust rocker and not necessarily a slipped belt neither? which is why i need to time everything up just to check.
On the chain drive for the two cams, the useless Haynes manual claims that the two links to look out for have a mark on the link and are coloured??
I can see a mark but don't think they are coloured??

woodywoodpecker · Post by **woodywoodpecker** » 17 Jan 2011, 00:41

corsehf wrote:Hiya Steve, good to hear from you again.
I'm hoping that it's an injector issue - will find out tomorrow but the guy who's checking out the injectors thinks it's a broken exhaust rocker and not necessarily a slipped belt neither? which is why i need to time everything up just to check.
On the chain drive for the two cams, the useless Haynes manual claims that the two links to look out for have a mark on the link and are coloured??
I can see a mark but don't think they are coloured??

Andy
I have the peugeot 406 haynes manual in pdf i think its about 190meg i will find somewhere to upload it to and give you the link, this covers our engine in very good detail with photos of how to set the timing.

corsehf · Post by **corsehf** » 17 Jan 2011, 08:31

Thanks Steve, i have been out and purchased a Peugeot 406 Haynes Manual especially for this job but so far has proved a waste of time. All of their instructions for 'In Car Procedure' has been done and photographed whilst the engine was out of the car.
I have read somewhere that the HDi engines used the block from the XUD and as i have done many cam belts on those engines, i know where the timing pins go however, after taking off the starter motor and spending 20 mins trying to fight my way through the crap they insist on sticking on diesel engines nowadays only to find nothing - even though it says in the Haynes Manual that it IS behind the starter motor.
Anyway, rain stopped play yesterday so didn't get very far and have yet to actually find this new hole. One issue that i do have is that i didn't put the car on its highest suspension setting making jacking the car up to find this hole now slightly more hazardous!!

dieselnutjob · Post by **dieselnutjob** » 17 Jan 2011, 09:58

I thought that they moved it to the back of the engine on the 2.2

corsehf · Post by **corsehf** » 17 Jan 2011, 12:48

Just had a report back from the Injector specialists:
Two of the injectors passed the tolerence test by delivering a certain number of cc's.
Two failed and of the two, one was 1% under tolerence whilst the other one was a massive 109% over!!
Looks like we may have a winner!!

What does everyone think??
Do you think an injector over delivering diesel will give me an engine that just misfires?
It would explain why i have more oil in the sump than before.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 17 Jan 2011, 14:00

I would say its highly likely that is the problem.

Peter

steelcityuk · Post by **steelcityuk** » 17 Jan 2011, 15:53

I'd say see my previous post...

Glad you've found the fault.

Steve.

dieselnutjob · Post by **dieselnutjob** » 17 Jan 2011, 18:56

last time I bought injectors they were much cheaper from French injection specialists
the exchange rate isn't so good now though
got mine from
Olivier Garnier
Douai Diesel
tel 0033327945959
fax 0033327945958
was years ago though

lussasgraham · Post by **lussasgraham** » 17 Jan 2011, 19:40

i currently live in france and would be very surprised if any citroen part was cheaper here than in the uk.If it was id save a fortune on postage for the spares for my car. worth a try though.

corsehf · Post by **corsehf** » 18 Jan 2011, 20:33

Injectors are being reconditioned as we speak, I have checked the timing and all the pins drop in so happy with that.
Just need to check the compression first before the injectors are re-fitted so as to make sure that no damage was done to the piston / con rod.
Struggling to find anyone with a compression tester that fits the injector holes though!!

dieselnutjob · Post by **dieselnutjob** » 18 Jan 2011, 21:09

I would have thought that if it bent a con rod then a piston would be lower by enough that you could detect it by sticking a rod down the injector hole and measuring how far down the piston is.
So put each piston at TDC and see if you can see any discernable difference how far down a rod has to go to sit on the piston.
I would imagine that if excess of diesel caused enough compression to damage the engine that it would in fact explode and burn off before that point, after all that's how a diesel works.
I know you had diesel getting into the sump, but it's a four stroke engine and compression/burn probably only takes place during half the cycle (or less) so diesel that got in during the other half would have some chance to get past the rings before being burnt.
If you had ingested water it would be different because water doesn't burn. It just fills up the cylinder until theres no more room then it breaks something.

corsehf · Post by **corsehf** » 20 Jan 2011, 23:16

One thing i forgot to say regarding the timing.
I did mention that i had located the holes for the timing procedure and the 2 pins drop in fine - camshaft & crank.
However, i forgot to mention that the camshaft drive chain is also marked but i'm 99% sure that i could not see the marked links when the pins were fitted. I have seen the marks so i know they are there (not coloured neither like they are meant to be) but i'm sure they were not visible when the pins were fitted. Will need to do it again and check.
How is the camshaft pulley fitted to the exhaust cam - is it on a key way so there is no chance of slippage?? or have i got something wrong??

Also, is there an easy way of getting the old fire seals out of the injector tubes??

dieselnutjob · Post by **dieselnutjob** » 21 Jan 2011, 19:39

corsehf wrote:Also, is there an easy way of getting the old fire seals out of the injector tubes??

Probably they aren't there. Normally they come out fixed to the injector nozzle.

corsehf · Post by **corsehf** » 23 Jan 2011, 20:46

Not good news!!

Could not get a compression tester in time that fitted so went ahead and rebuilt engine with newly reconditioned injectors
It took 30 mins to start it and then it was just about running on 3 cylinders again!!

With the car bellowing white smoke out of the back, i managed to keep it running to get it warmed up - whilst running at about 3000 rpm - it sounded fine! - then it stopped and didn't want to restart.
Thinking it was now a broken rocker, i started to dismantle the engine again only to find that one of the new injectors had not been working - all the others were sooty but one of them was spotless still. Not sure if this is due to a dodgy injector or no power feed to it?? - anyway, it will go back to the injector specialists to recheck.
BUT, in the meantime, can anyone shed any light on how to get the inlet manifold off on a DW12?? - total nightmare, i have managed to lift the front of the manifold up up by about 5 - 6mm but its not moving anymore and i do not want to use so much force it breaks.

Any ideas??

dieselnutjob · Post by **dieselnutjob** » 23 Jan 2011, 22:53

yes

swap two injectors and try again
if the problem stays with the injector then it is the injector
if the problem stays with the cylinder then it's something else
like the wiring
or no combustion in that cylinder due to lack of compression