Xantia 1.9TD Estate 1996 died whilst run' - Def Solved!!

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romie
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Post by romie »

Are you going to tune the pump now?
oh yeah? I can 'tune' it eh? What does that achieve? Better fuel consumption? :)

I've found a post from CitroJim referring to Calibration.
Calibration is required but you can do that yourself very carefully. After reassembly, if necessary, adjust the maximum delivery screw (the one facing toward the distributor head) so that the engine will just red-line under moderate load and then refine, along with the throttle stop screw so that it will just red-line off-load on the snap acceleration test.
... are these one and the same thing?

When adjusting the power adjuster screw, I naturally set it so that I had tick over at around 900RPM, (I think this might be slightly high), and that with no load she will just hit the red-line.

Other than that I've not looked into 'calibrating / tuning' anymore.. should I and for what reasons?

Thanks for the heads up :)
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Post by MikeT »

You have options but the common reasons for tuning are performance and economy. You could tune for all out economy but it would mean working those gears hard and 0-60 times in minutes rather than seconds. That would be extreme but should also give extreme mpg figures!

On the other hand, most want more power and with the ability to upshift earlier, can also give better economy if you're careful.

The Max Fuel adjuster sets how much fuel is injected per given load setting, across the whole RPM range, including idle.

The "throttle stop" (which is NOT the same thing) is a physical stop on the outside of the pump which the accelerator lever butts against when the accelerator is floored.
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Post by romie »

hmm, I'd be after economy over performance - lots of long distance caving, cycling etc journeys. I've got the ZXR750 for performance :P

Surly the economy is down to foot action - I can use a heavy or light foot accordingly? By reducing the available fuel flow rate to a small max rate I'm just hindering myself when I DO need to move, no? The vehicle will always need the same amount of fuel to achieve a given rpm with a given load?

After putting the pump back on I just set the power adjuster to allow for 900RPM tick-over and red-line without load.

.. ah so am I correct to assume by adjusting the power adjuster screw along with the throttle position as a pair I can 'move' the amount of fuel delivery up or down depending on rev range?

OK, so just thinking about this for a sec, if I reduce the amount of fuel flow using the power adjuster screw I would then have to 'increase' throttle position to keep the 900RMP tick-over? . . and the same kind of thing with the red-line end?

There must be a sticky on here somewhere for doing this to the injector pumps? :?
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
Suzuki Bandit GSF400 1992 x 2
Mountain bike, skateboards, snowboards, surfboard, longboard and feet!
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Post by MikeT »

This is what I love about diesels. You could take economy to the extreme by leaning off the fuelling to the bare minimum and setting the boost wastegate to ~6psi. It's an experiment I would like to test one day but I'm having too much fun going for power.

There's a fair few guides on adjusting these pumps dotted around the internet and I'd recommend you check them out to get familiar with what adjustments are available. Even the Haynes manual gives details of setting the rpm limit and idle speeds.

I do have a PDF of how the VE Pumps work, if you'd like a copy (shoot me your email) but it doesn't tell us how we can calibrate them, unfortunately.

Personally, I would set the max fuel with the boost pipe disconnected and using the visible smoke as a guide. Once you're happy with off-boost settings, you can reconnect the boost feed and tune the LDA for on-boost tuning, again using visible smoke as a guide. You might also want to adjust peak boost to match.
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Post by romie »

Cheers MikeT, I'll definitely look into that, I'm quite interested in max econ mode due to my many long trips but low time restrictions... wonder if a sail would fit on top of a Xantia >:)

I'll have to sit back, digest and figure out all these terms tho.. really just started on these oily diesel side of things :s

Right, I'll pop you my email address.

Cheers
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Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
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Post by Xaccers »

romie wrote:Cheers MikeT, I'll definitely look into that, I'm quite interested in max econ mode due to my many long trips but low time restrictions... wonder if a sail would fit on top of a Xantia >:)

SVO and Costco are your friends :)
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Post by MikeT »

romie wrote:Right, I'll pop you my email address.
PDF sent.
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Post by romie »

SVO and Costco are your friends
I was thinking about this.
So apparently the government doesn't like us using SVO (even tho it's obviously carbon neutral), because SVO still produces 'bad' gases when burnt. I like the idea of SVO as it's a much more elegant from plant to tank approach.
But the government does like Bio-fuel as the processing of the SVO to Bio takes out all the nasties that go into the air. Therefore we're individually allowed to make enough to allow us to travel 25,000miles a year or summit like that.

I now know a guy to produces his own Bio. He reckons (negating the cost of the buying the kit), after he's bought the necessary chemicals, he can make Bio for around 16p/Litre.
The trouble is it takes him 4 hours of his time as well (for one batch). Then it comes down to how much is your time worth - hmm.

I'm pondering this at the moment, I'd need to make/buy the apparatus and find space to put it in - wonder how smelly/dirty it is? S'pose it could go at the back of the garden.

Anyone got a good from start to finish guide on the subject of making ones own Bio in the garden :)
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
Suzuki Bandit GSF400 1992 x 2
Mountain bike, skateboards, snowboards, surfboard, longboard and feet!
romie
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Post by romie »

Cheers MikeT, gratefully received :D
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
Suzuki Bandit GSF400 1992 x 2
Mountain bike, skateboards, snowboards, surfboard, longboard and feet!
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Post by Penguin »

romie wrote:
SVO and Costco are your friends
I was thinking about this.
So apparently the government doesn't like us using SVO (even tho it's obviously carbon neutral), because SVO still produces 'bad' gases when burnt. I like the idea of SVO as it's a much more elegant from plant to tank approach.
But the government does like Bio-fuel as the processing of the SVO to Bio takes out all the nasties that go into the air. Therefore we're individually allowed to make enough to allow us to travel 25,000miles a year or summit like that.

I now know a guy to produces his own Bio. He reckons (negating the cost of the buying the kit), after he's bought the necessary chemicals, he can make Bio for around 16p/Litre.
The trouble is it takes him 4 hours of his time as well (for one batch). Then it comes down to how much is your time worth - hmm.

I'm pondering this at the moment, I'd need to make/buy the apparatus and find space to put it in - wonder how smelly/dirty it is? S'pose it could go at the back of the garden.

Anyone got a good from start to finish guide on the subject of making ones own Bio in the garden :)
You are allowed to use 2500 litres of bio or straight Veg every year without the need to pay duty on it.
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Post by Xaccers »

romie wrote:
SVO and Costco are your friends
I was thinking about this.
So apparently the government doesn't like us using SVO (even tho it's obviously carbon neutral), because SVO still produces 'bad' gases when burnt. I like the idea of SVO as it's a much more elegant from plant to tank approach.
But the government does like Bio-fuel as the processing of the SVO to Bio takes out all the nasties that go into the air. Therefore we're individually allowed to make enough to allow us to travel 25,000miles a year or summit like that.

I now know a guy to produces his own Bio. He reckons (negating the cost of the buying the kit), after he's bought the necessary chemicals, he can make Bio for around 16p/Litre.
The trouble is it takes him 4 hours of his time as well (for one batch). Then it comes down to how much is your time worth - hmm.

I'm pondering this at the moment, I'd need to make/buy the apparatus and find space to put it in - wonder how smelly/dirty it is? S'pose it could go at the back of the garden.

Anyone got a good from start to finish guide on the subject of making ones own Bio in the garden :)
You don't have to make Bio, just dump SVO straight into the fuel tank.
Conversion to Bio is to enable it to run in vehicles which cannot run on SVO as it should then have the same viscosity.
The chemicals used to make Bio are not nice, so it's better for the environment to use SVO.
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Post by CitroJim »

romie wrote:wonder how smelly/dirty it is? S'pose it could go at the back of the garden.
Not very. The process is very dangerous as some nasty chemicals are used, one very toxic and one very corrosive. The are Methanol and Sodium Hydroxide (Caustic Soda)

My personal thoughts are that they have no place in a domestic setting and are far too risky and dangerous to even contemplate.

SVO has none of these drawback...

If you really want to knw about Bio then have a look at http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/forum/ It's full of nutters who think brewing bio in their garden sheds is a neat idea.... Got to say they know their stuff though and everything you could ever want to know, from some incredibly knowledgeable people, is all there.
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Post by myglaren »

Brewing decent biodiesel looks like far too much hassle (as Delia says "Life is too short for stuffing mushrooms" :) ) when you can dump SVO in the tank.
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Post by Xaccers »

You also need a supply of WVO to convert, which from what I've heard officially requires you to register as a supplier.
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Post by messerschmitt owner »

I run a 40% or so mix of svo to diesel in the XM and it runs just fine. Huge concentrations of SVO give starting and running difficulties until the engine is warm but the mix I use is spot on. Pays to shop around though as the price of svo varies quite a lot in the supermarket (yes, I know, I need a cash and carry card)!

An XUD engine with a Bosch pump runs with no conversion work needed whatsoever.
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