Injector replacements

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MikeT
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Injector replacements

Post by MikeT »

I noticed GSF sell new injectors about £30+VAT ea which doesn't seem too bad but they also sell one with a lift sensor and that cost £130+VAT!

I can imagine having mine tested and repaired would probably the cost the same, if not more.

Are there any other options?

Additionally, I'm wondering if I should buy those specifically made for veg oil or get uprated injectors instead?

All opinions and advises gratefully received.
elma
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Post by elma »

I had injectors serviced at lsuk a couple of years ago for £100.
They all had new nozzles and recalibration.
When I got them back they looked shiny new, but that only lasted a little while.
Difference to low end performance and economy though makes it well worth it.

I think new or serviced are the only options. If your real lucky you may find a scrap car with almost new ones but I reckon anyone who bothered to have the service would keep them if they scrapped the car.

Don't know anything about veg oil ones.
I'd fit the higher performance ones if you have the garrett turbo and the normal ones if you have the kkk. Reason being that I'm fairly sure thats what citroen do.

To raise another question, is it possible to have the nozzles from a vsx put into any bosch injector case from a xantia?
MikeT
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Post by MikeT »

Servicing sounds cheaper than I thought, did you remove the injectors yourself? I wonder if they could be upgraded with the service? The reason I'm thinking of upgrading is because I want to try nitrous injection and it follows that the more fuel I can add, the more power I'll get - up to a limit of course. Otherwise I'll have to supplement the fuelling other (more costly) ways.
elma
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Post by elma »

Yep, they are easy to take out. Gets trickier as you get closer to the pump though but if you've managed glowplugs in the past you'll do it.
Use a proper diesel injector socket though or you can damage the little nipples the leak off pipes attach to. I know as I did that already.
Peel out the copper washers and fire seals and replace them with new ones. I replaced mine and I'm led to believe that if you don't then it is possible to get injector knock when they are brand new nozzles which would just be a pain in the butt. They are only a few quid.

Make sure you do not cross thread the injectors when you replace them. I had a car which had brand new cross threaded injectors a while back. Theres not much you can do about it in situ and it turned out to be a real pain in the arse.

Which xantia do you have? I think that athenas and vsxs already have the uprated injectors. Its only the nozzles and pressure setting anyway, the rest is the same. Ring round the places on the net that refurb injectors and ask about performance mods. I don't know about nitrous etc but they must have seen it in the past as anyone who wants to do it will have to see them at some point.

As I have the garrett turbo I am also looking at injector spec at the min. I want the larger volume nozzles which I believe come with the vsx fitting to my injector bodies. Theres a couple of seriel numbers on the dodge ram page for the injector nozzles but I've not got around to checking if they are the ones for our cars yet.
KP
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Post by KP »

Theres a nice big thread all about this over on www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/forum in the SVO section IIRC.

Never heard of any difference between the injectors fitted to the XUD engines other than the ones with Lucas/Cav pumps.

For MikeT and his nitrous idea, the easiest thing for you to do regarding extra fuelling is just have an injector fitted before the inlet manifold and then get a small 12v pump and have it dump extra fuel in when the nitrous circuit kicks in. This will then not affect normal running of the car as i guess you would employ some form of boost control device that allows 2 or more boost settings so you could have one just above standard and then one way above standard, say 20psi or the like. This would then need extra cooling as the turbo is well outside of its efficiency island and thus you would need to look at using something like an Angel Ring(A metal loop in front of your intercooler that dumps CO2 onto it and brings the temps right down :D
MikeT
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Post by MikeT »

Thanks elma, I'll ring around.

Cheers for the link KP but that's thrown a spanner (well a whole toolbox) into the works. It advises...

Standard "Nozzles = DNOSD 299/299A/C, set at 145-155 bar, or some models 175 bar." (I guess elma is looking for the latter?)

"BDN12SDC 6862 work well set at 135 bar, in Turbo XUD 9 Bosch Pumped (Xantia) series on veggy" so I might have been heading for trouble getting injectors uprated because...

"Dont Bother ever Increasing Injector Opening pressures, This will cause a delivery rate reduction, retarded timing, possible smoke and excess pump peak pressures"

Secondly "Advance 'Point Of Injection' by 3-4 degrees" If my pump is semi-automatic wouldn't the ECU compensate for any changes?

"Change Glow-Plugs, for some that are 2mm longer Duratherm 0 250 201 042" Ok, I can get them but my glowplugs work first cycle at the moment.

"Loop fuel inlet to return, After filter, with a tap and tee to allow air-venting during 'bleeding' system, or changing filters. The Injector Leak-Off return pipe chain should be plumbed into the now redundant tank return line. A good addition, is a vacuum guage, teed into the point after filter and before pump. This will give you an indication of when the filter is becoming choked." I can't imagine what this is all getting at. :? I've had no problem with air getting in or bleeding the lines or changing filters - perhaps it's more related to WVO than SVO but what's with the leak-off pipes going to the return?

"During very cold weather, use up to 10% Unleaded with the veggy or 50/50 standard diesel/veggy blend" Is it safe to put (diluted) petrol in a diesel?

Re Nitrous - I know LPG could be injected at the inlet but not diesel or SVO as that could pre-ignite. As for cooling, it's what nitrous does up to a point ;)
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Post by CitroJim »

MikeT wrote: "Loop fuel inlet to return, After filter, with a tap and tee to allow air-venting during 'bleeding' system, or changing filters. The Injector Leak-Off return pipe chain should be plumbed into the now redundant tank return line."

NO NO NO :evil: NEVER DO THIS :evil: Unless you wish to end up with a leaky pump and fuel filter :roll:

If they come out with dangerous statements like this, I seriously question the quality and validity of anything else they have to say. :x
Jim

Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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