Xantia: Low back side

citroenxm · Post by **citroenxm** » 23 Mar 2007, 20:48

deian wrote:
Nice to see you show ur face paul, u fixed the beast yet?

Thankyou! I get the feeling of a touch of unwelcomeness in your line..

I have been busy with other work lately... Yes, I have the V6 back on the road with a replacment starter and altinator..

I freed one of the linkage units up with pleanty of WD40 and leaverage and it came back nicely...

Good to see you tackling this your self.. albeit with lots of good help from other friendly users.. Well done!

Regards
citroenxm

deian · Post by **deian** » 23 Mar 2007, 22:29

Sorry Paul, No unwelcomeness at all, just been wondering where you've been lately that's all. Didn't mean to offend. You know me by now, I'm laid back and friendly. I also value your views.

Job isn't done yet though, I don't feel I will get complications, although the help and advice from this forum is fantastic, which will help make the operation go smoothly.

Glad to hear about the XM, nice to have the rare ones still working on the road. I still need to do that belt too. Lazy me.

deian · Post by **deian** » 24 Mar 2007, 15:39

Ok, I went under today and fiddled for hours, after deciding not to bother with the star/torx bolts to get the height corrector cradle off i decided to drown all the linkages in WD40, i tool the manual selector off the shaft, all the linkages move!!!!!

So take the anti-roll bar clamp and it's link off and put the new one back on, deciding to tighten it with the suspension up! movement is nicer and so on, something isn't quite right, it doesn't settle on normal height (normalish for now), and it doesn't even drop down properly when i lower the selector in the car, what i have to to get it to lower is to loosen the clamp and then push the back of the actual height corrector so it opens the valve, but it doesn't go down as it did before because the weight would drop it down.... whats wrong? any ideas?

I did drop the car after locking the height with axle stands on high, so i had the space underneath the back without it dropping, and no pressure so i could open the pipes, but i didn't open the pipes. Did this fudge anything up??

Or is it simply a case of needing to take the height corrector itself off and clean the shaft?

Thanks (nice day isn't it)

citroenxm · Post by **citroenxm** » 24 Mar 2007, 17:49

Diean

EXACTLY! You cannot put the clamp back on with the suspension simply in the high mode!!

The linkages will be in NORMAL MODE and your suspension on high..

You will need to put the car rear up on RAMPS, and then lie under the car, then with the car up on the ramps and the engine running and in NORMAL height selected, connect the linkages and clamps up then, bit at a time, slacken the clamp, TURN it on the rollbar the appropiate way for making the car go to correct ride height, then when your happy with its ride height tighten the clamp! Its fiddly but NOT STRAIGHT forward if you'r not certain what to do!!

Good luck

Regards
citroenxm

slim123 · Post by **slim123** » 24 Mar 2007, 18:06

Or the easy way!

Throw away the "rule" book.

Loosen the anti roll ber clamp and spray some WD40 on it so that it can move freely.
Start the engine and set the height to normal.
Move the height corrector spool valve itself, by push / pull on the metal bracket sticking out from the front of the height corrector.
When the height is correct, tighten the clamp on the anti roll bar.

This way the clamp will follow and be in the correct position.

Adjusting by way of moving the clamp will work, but it is a very fiddly process as moving the clamp a tiny bit will move the height a mile.

For reference, if you move the spool towards the rear, the car will go up and to the front it will go down.

Regards
Slim,

citroenxm · Post by **citroenxm** » 24 Mar 2007, 18:22

Slim123

EXCELLENT!! I like it.. Yes I agree, hence my wording, it is fiddley the way I did it, but couldn't think of any other way!

Well, I know for next time now!

Regards
citroenxm

deian · Post by **deian** » 24 Mar 2007, 19:28

Top tip paul, and slim too. I put it in the middle and then fiddled with the shaft thing and low and behold, up it went when i pushed it, and down it came when i pulled it... didn't know to do it when the selector was centred! doh!

I didn't notice the shaft inside the height corrector only moved a tiny bit, i thought the movement was big, only when i centred the selector lever and fiddled did i notice it move up and down a lot when i played.

Top job. I didn't end up taking anything off in the end, just replacing the clamp and "adjusting"!

Thanks to all who contributed!

Mandrake · Post by **Mandrake** » 24 Mar 2007, 19:29

citroenxm wrote:Slim123

EXCELLENT!! I like it.. Yes I agree, hence my wording, it is fiddley the way I did it, but couldn't think of any other way!

Well, I know for next time now!

Regards
citroenxm

Yep, slims way is pretty much the way I do it too, and its why I deliberately avoided copying all of the height adjustment pages from the manual and did just the pages showing the height figures - the "official" procedure is ridiculously long and complicated and involves two special tools that simply aren't needed.

Another little tip is when tightening the clamp, always do so with the spanner/ratchet at right angles to the rollbar - this will minimize the amount that the clamp will move position due to the torque of tightening the bolt - as even a tiny movement in the clamp will result in a large change in height !

It's fiddly enough that it is a matter of trial an error, typically you'll have to try 3 or 4 times to get it spot on.

Regards,
Simon

deian · Post by **deian** » 24 Mar 2007, 21:18

Well it's not bad as it is, but I will take onto a proper car ramp tomorrow to do it with the car on a level surface and on normal height with the engine running, i won't get crushed if the antiroll clamp bar slips then. The old saying is true... you learn something new everyday. As much as the car is a little weird and mechanically challenging it's not off putting at all and i will most definately be driving a hydractive citroen again. If i can replace those sphere i reckon the ride will be ghost like on the roads, i can't imagine what the CX or the new C6 is like.

Mandrake · Post by **Mandrake** » 25 Mar 2007, 00:13

Can't speak for the C6 but the CX definately rides better than any Xantia, especially at the front, but it does have a lot more body roll on corners....which can take a little getting used to.

It's amazing how fast you can chuck them into corners for such a front heavy car with plenty of body roll. They have plenty of grip at the front with the right tyres, a wider front track and lower centre of gravity than the Xantia, which probably helps.

Definately a unique and special car. It's great to see one lift off its haunches when you start it up, it lifts such a long way due to the enormous suspension travel....(quite a bit more than a Xantia especially at the front) and they still look cool 30 years later.

(Although I prefer the series 2 styling)

I still really want one but given their age it wouldnt be an only-car daily driver....(more of a project car)

Pity they have such a crap boot and poor interior ventilation/cooling! (And rust like crazy, even down here)

Regards,
Simon

citroenxm · Post by **citroenxm** » 25 Mar 2007, 21:02

Hi

A Xantia will NEVER ride as good as a CX or DS, and possibly an XM!

The heavyer the car, the better the ride, as the way it was designed!

The DS was a heavy car and the system was designed for that car.

I think the Computer Control on the XM spoils it slightly.. but its still worlds ahead of Springs and Dampers!!

Unfortunally, the Xantia is just not heavy enough to give that PERFECT Carpet ride!.. It is still Smooth, but not like that DS or CX system!

I'd still like to try a CX myself, and may grab one one day.

Well Done Diean, you'r learning!

Regards
citroenxm

deian · Post by **deian** » 25 Mar 2007, 21:45

Learning is a funny one, it's all easy to read what people advise you or read technical documents online and so on, the actual knowing is to put the theory into practise... which i haven't done much... i understand the way it works, the physics and the maths, the common sense even, and of course some of the more obvious basic facts don't cross ones mind until someone point it's out to you... i.e pauls tip about the heavy car for better ride... continuing from this... a better ride is also achieved with a car that has a long wheelbase and double wish bone suspension... this is where the cx wins hands down! And why Citroen has put it in the C6 again.

Of course, the Xantia will do fine for me now, it's a very reliable workhorse that satisfies in many ways, my taste for older classics is being wetted more than ever by Citroen.

Oh, i'm still fine tuning that stupid clamp/height... it's very vague, trouble is finding ramps to do it easily.

Post by **CitroJim** » 25 Mar 2007, 21:52

Handling vs comfort is always a compromise. I have never ridden in a DS or a CX

but I've seen pictures of a DS at full roll and it is spectacular and yet they hold on. Roll is unliked these days and handling is everything so the Xantia has heavy anti-roll bars which has to compromise ride comfort to some extent. The standard Xantia is a great handler and yet is still more comfy than any conventianally sprung car of equal ability around corners. Weight, I don't think is the full answer as the GS had a reputation for comfort and that is very light. Our little 205D is incredibly comfy and very softly sprung for a small, light car but does it roll

It rolls like a Renault 4

and feels unsafe. It is an armchair on wheels. The downside is that a fair load in the boot puts it on the bump stops and if I drive it like my GTi I soon get into dangerous territory

My drive has the two handling benchmarks sitting on it, a 205GTi and an Activa. The 205GTi handles exceptionally well but it feels, for the most part, to be devoid of any significant springing at all. It is hard, harsh and raw. The Activa handles better than the GTi in my opinion and yet despite being considered harsh and hard by hydropneumatic standards it is still really comfortable. One only realises just how comfy it is after spending a few days driving the GTi.

However you look at it, hydropneumatic suspension still gives the best overall compromise between ride and handling. Hydractive in "sport" mode and Activa is a blinder.

Post by **CitroJim** » 25 Mar 2007, 22:11

Mandrake wrote:It's amazing how fast you can chuck them into corners for such a front heavy car with plenty of body roll. They have plenty of grip at the front with the right tyres, a wider front track and lower centre of gravity than the Xantia, which probably helps.

That, I believe, is due to one of the best characteristics of the hydropneumatic system. Excellent damping which keeps the wheels solidly on the ground and keeps the tyre contact patch more or less constant. Conventional spring/damper systems have great difficulty doing that.

I saw a CX Break out on my travels today. First time in a long time I have seen one. They are absolutely beautiful. No picture ever seems to quite do them justice.

Stewart(oily) · Post by **Stewart(oily)** » 25 Mar 2007, 22:54

Nice thread guys, I just took the hydraflush out of the Xant today, and re lubed the linkages with my oil, grease mixture applied with a paintbrush, please dont rely on WD40 it buggers off within a fortnght and will not give you the suppleness that a lubricated linkage can give, now floating

Stewart