how do you start a diesel with no glow plugs???

This is the Forum for all your Citroen Technical Questions, Problems or Advice.

Moderator: RichardW

nick
Posts: 1079
Joined: 14 Mar 2001, 01:49
Location: Market Rasen, Lincolnshire
My Cars:

Post by nick »

Does it get worse the colder the weather gets? If so it sounds like classic symptoms of at least one glowplug not working.
Stinkwheel
Posts: 562
Joined: 28 May 2004, 01:02
Location:
My Cars:
x 1

Post by Stinkwheel »

yes it does get worse as weather gets colder. Never faled to start yet though.
mbunting
Posts: 712
Joined: 21 Dec 2001, 15:19
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by mbunting »

Getting a diesel started if you live on a hill is easy, roll it down the hill, gently slipping the clutch ( we are NOT bump-starting which could cause problems ). After a short while, stop the car on what little brake power you have, and turn the key.
By turning the engine on the way down, you are compressing the air in the cylinders, but not enough to ignite it. This compression heats up the cylinder a little, and will help starting ( ie. you're being a rubbish glowplug ).
Done this before when I had a couple of dodgy plugs, worked a treat until I managed to replace them.
User avatar
uhn113x
Posts: 1161
Joined: 06 Jan 2004, 22:06
Location: Near Leeds, United Kingdom
My Cars: 1981 Dyane - on road all year round.
1982 GSA Pallas - on road April - September.
1997 ZX 1.9D Dimension.
x 1

Post by uhn113x »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by caveman_si</i>

how do you start a diesel with no glow plugs???
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
With difficulty......
User avatar
mrbump
Posts: 199
Joined: 14 May 2003, 06:39
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by mrbump »

hahaha some funny stories here.[:D] I have also witnessed the amazing 10,000 rpm diesel. Funny thing is you cant even switch them off until they have burnt the 'fuel'. Have seen a good one with a can of 'choke and carb cleaner' - big can shake, sprayed for probably 1.5 secs into intake before it got to engine (turbo), cue drop can and run in opposite direction!!
Philjw
Posts: 115
Joined: 01 Mar 2003, 17:54
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by Philjw »

A method I once saw used to start up a diesel forklift truck was to roll up some paper, set light to it then hold the flames next to the inlet manifold when cranking.
It seemed to work, even on cold days....but I don't think I would recommend it for cars!
NiSk
Posts: 1422
Joined: 24 Jan 2002, 20:11
Location: Sweden
My Cars:
x 1

Post by NiSk »

Referring to "light the blue touch paper . . . " The Volvo diesels i describe (everything from 6 litre straights to 25 litre V12's) use air preheating for cold starts. They are all direct injection with unit-injectors and very high pressure pumps. The preheater is basically a square box through which the induction air is forced (they are turbo-charged as well). The box contains an electrical heating element which heats up the induction air. So Phil's description is far off what the professionals use.
//NiSk
beezer
Posts: 627
Joined: 20 Oct 2004, 22:11
Location:
My Cars:

Post by beezer »

In my truck driving days of the early seventies we didn't have glow plugs (eeh by gum etc). The Ford trucks had a 'cold start' lever which was accessed through the radiator grill and needed a second person to operate it. The Bedfords didn't even have that. Most people ignored the cold start lever and there was much cranking over in the early mornings and clouds of white smoke for breakfast. You knew if the cold start lever was stuck by the clouds of black smoke in your mirrors and the dirty looks of passing car drivers. A few years into the job we got new Transits for the 'express' runs and they had these wonderful glow plugs and the engine stopped when you turned the ignition off (we had to make do with the stop cables in our trucks, many of which didn't work and we had to stall with the brake pedal). High tech stuff.
oilyspanner
Posts: 1246
Joined: 26 Oct 2003, 16:08
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by oilyspanner »

My boat engine has a Lucas Thermostart device which consists of an electrical element and a pipe from the injector leak offs, this is cunningly placed in the inlet and the starting drill is, press button for ten seconds then crank starter in four second bursts, diesel hits the hot element and produces gouts of flame in the inlet tract, inbuilt burning rag! still produces clouds of smoke on startup though.
Stewart
JohnD
(Donor 2022)
Posts: 2632
Joined: 14 Mar 2001, 23:41
Location: Epsom, Surrey
My Cars: 2010 Citroen C5-X7 tourer
1998 Citroen Saxo 1.5D
2018 Citroen C4-B7
1998 Peugeot 306. 1.9D
2011 Citroen C1
x 72
Contact:

Post by JohnD »

My introduction to diesel started back in 1974 with a Ford 9 seater Transit fitted with a 2.5 York engine. It didn't have glowplugs, just a reservoir of diesel high up on the bulk head. When a switch was pressed, a coil fitted in the manifold glowed red whilst diesel dripped onto it. After a minute the starter was used and if compression was good, the engine fired with clouds of smoke. Try starting with the air cleaner removed and the flames coming from the manifold were alarming. After a couple of years I changed the head for a new model with holes for glowplugs. The plugs were wired through a relay, straight off the battery. Preheater time was just a matter of trial and error. To stop the engine, a knob similar to a choke cable was used.
nick
Posts: 1079
Joined: 14 Mar 2001, 01:49
Location: Market Rasen, Lincolnshire
My Cars:

Post by nick »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by JohnD</i>

When a switch was pressed, a coil fitted in the manifold glowed red whilst diesel dripped onto it. After a minute the starter was used and if compression was good, the engine fired with clouds of smoke. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
My parents have a late 1950's Fordson diesel tractor that starts (sometimes) using a similar method. There's a button near the fuel tank which has to be pressed repeatedly and squirts diesel onto a heating coil in the manifold. I have heard of farmers starting old tractors by stuffing a rag soaked in diesel into the manifold then lighting it !
beezer
Posts: 627
Joined: 20 Oct 2004, 22:11
Location:
My Cars:

Post by beezer »

Then you had the tractors that started with petrol and then ran on paraffin. Ee those were t'days.
nick
Posts: 1079
Joined: 14 Mar 2001, 01:49
Location: Market Rasen, Lincolnshire
My Cars:

Post by nick »

Yep, my grandad had one of those. He said the only way it would start on cold/damp mornings was to take the spark plugs out the night before and leave them in the aga oven until required.
Before then there were those tractors that needed a point on the manifold heated with a blowlamp for several minutes until they would consider starting....
JohnG
Posts: 24
Joined: 17 Nov 2004, 01:12
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:

Post by JohnG »

The system NiSk refers to was also used in the 10-and12-litre Turbo 6 engines in trucks and coaches.These carried dire warnings
of fatal mechanical and/or personal damage if an easy starting spray was used due to the eplosive consequences when the spray vapour came into contact with tht heating element.Easy start and any kind of heating device......Definitely not!
NiSk
Posts: 1422
Joined: 24 Jan 2002, 20:11
Location: Sweden
My Cars:
x 1

Post by NiSk »

Beezer and Nick - I've still got a 1952 Ferguson TE20 petrol/TVO (Tractor Vapourizing Oil = paraffin). It runs OK on petrol but isn't very powerful on paraffin, whats more, paraffin costs more than petrol over hear so the whole thing is just for the sentiment of it!
What really shook me, especially concerning the difficulty there is in getting parts for "recently deceased" Citorëns, was that while on holiday in the UK a couple of years ago I went into the combined Post Office /General store/ Agricultural workshop of the village where my parents lived in Cornwall (Rumford) and casually asked if they had a head gasket for a TE20. Imagine my surprise when they offered me a choice of Low compression petrol, High compression petrol or Petrol/TVO! Amazing - for a vehicle that was built over 50 years ago!
//NiSk
Post Reply