Peugeot 107 1.0 2008 Starting Issues

[davedougan]

Hi the long saga of poor starting continues. The car reluctantly starts from cold but runs very rough and cuts out if you dont keep a little throttle going. Once its warmed up it runs great (and just sailed thro MOT with no advisories).
It was suggested that the temp sensor might be the issue by not telling the ECU to boost the fuel on cold start. However on plugging in PP2000 and looking at the parameters when cold it's telling me the water temp is down around 8 deg. This kinda suggests to me that the sender isnt the problem.
Does this sound like a correct assumption and if so does anyone have any other ideas on what's causing it. There are absolutely no faults showing up on PP2000 and all the actuator tests seem to work as they should. I'm head scratching here!!

[RichardW]

You'd need to look at what the water temp was doing as it warms up to see what it is up to. Don't know how the cold start enrichment works on these, but it could be at fault. Otherwise, plugs, coil, valve clearances or head gasket spring to mind.

[davedougan]

thanks Richard it's had new plugs and filters and ive checked the coil packs and all working ok. Not losing water and no mayo on oil cap or grey oil on dipstick so probably rules head gasket out. Valve clearances could be a possible as the engine is really tappety on start up and doesnt quiet down till its warm ( I know it doesnt have tappets but its a similar noise). I did watch the temp on PP with the engine running and the temp did start to rise from 8 deg tho i never left it plugged in till fully warm but it looked like it was rising steadily as it should.
Like I said, head well scratched.

[spider]

Sorry to read you're still having issues. If its reading about 8c then that's more or less ruled out.

I'd suggest checking the valve clearances if you can especially as you have a tappety rattle, going from how I read it.

I'd have to check (I don't have access to anything as I type this) but I think they are 'solid' and you have to change the 'bucket' rather than a shim in it. Sorry that's a bit vague but I'm working from memory and this engine/car was launched the year I left so obviously none were at the stage for wanting this doing.

Someone is going to come along now and say they are hydraulic but unless my memory is playing tricks they are not.

[xantia_v6]

A couple of questions to narrow things down...

When it is cold and running rough, is it just the idle, or is it rough under load?

While warming up, do the symptoms gradually improve, or does it suddenly get better?

[daviemck2006]

Both my 107's have never had a problem starting, but both sounded like a bucket of nails when cold, but fine when warm. I think what spider says is true, I'm sure I read in the handbook that the valve clearances have to be checked, I will look in the handbook if I remember tomorrow.

[davedougan]

A couple of questions to narrow things down...

When it is cold and running rough, is it just the idle, or is it rough under load?

While warming up, do the symptoms gradually improve, or does it suddenly get better?

It's fine when on the move even when cold it's just that initial start and idling thats the issue. It's a gradual improvement but fairly fast as within about 5 mins everything is fine. It's just annoying having to nurse it on the throttle

[CitroJim]

Both my 107's have never had a problem starting, but both sounded like a bucket of nails when cold, but fine when warm. I think what spider says is true, I'm sure I read in the handbook that the valve clearances have to be checked, I will look in the handbook if I remember tomorrow.

Mine has never been a problem and doesn't sound like a bucket of nails when cold either but valve clearances is a jolly good call...

[spider]

I don't know if you'd have to take the cam(s) out to do it. On some Toyota based engines you either need a special tool or you have to remove the cams to change them. Having said that it is well worth a little time to at least measure them. May need some sealant for the cam cover as manufacturers now seem to like to have instant sealant as well as (or instead of / addition to) gaskets for some reason.

Someone may have to provide specifics for the check however (although completely unrelated) the ones on the elderly Micra's I know you have to check hot not cold...

99% sure the 107/Aygo/C1 are checked cold however. Well worth half an hour with a feeler gauge I think.

[RichardW]

Valves adjusted by changing the tappets by the looks of it.

Valve clearances when cold :
Inlet : Between 0,145 mm and 0,235 mm
Exhaust : Between 0,275 mm and 0,365 mm

Needs the cam cover taking off, which, yes, uses a sealant rather than a proper gasket.

[CitroJim]

Valves adjusted by changing the tappets by the looks of it.

What bit of the tappets Richard? The buckets themselves or shims?

[xantia_v6]

Wouldn't it be easier to measure the compressions cold before attacking the engine?

[RichardW]

What bit of the tappets Richard? The buckets themselves or shims?

The whole bucket - there is no shim, but the buckets are available in different thicknesses.

[CitroJim]

Oh gosh! That's a bit OTT but I suppose it ensure a very rigid valve-train and is easy in production...

[RichardW]

So is 2 camshafts with variators and 12V for a little 1 litre engine!