Brake light failure

[smoker]

Someone tooted me yesterday and said that I had no brake lights on my '98 xud 306 estate - no abs.

Bulbs are OK so am suspecting the switch. According to Haynes I have to dismantle the facia to get at it. Is this the most likely cause, and is it an easy fix?

Cheers

[Gibbo_Wirral]

A brake light switch fault is a common failure and a cheap and easy fix. The problem is getting to it.

Some do say you need to dismantle the facia to get to it but find someone with small hands and work up from the footwell and you should just manage it.

[spider]

Haynes says (if I remember correctly) to remove the fascia (this is not a simple task on a 306! Matrix time for instance is about nine hours) and steering column etc. The servo is quite difficult to remove actually but that's not relevant here.

I'd be tempted as above to look from underneath and maybe take the instrument panel out that may provide a bit of access too. I think its in a 'box' section.

I cannot recall having seen one failed though. I assume the high-level centre light in the tailgate is dead as well ? , Its worth double checking fuses etc and checking for power at the brake lights themselves although I'm not sure if the switch is the earth on these in which case power will be there anyway.

I think I'm just saying spend a few minutes with 'easier' items first as if its not the switch you'll really be cursing.

[Oldpug]

You have to be a contortionist with long skinny fingers to change the switch,why its fitted where it is only Peugeot knows??
The way I do it is to remove the column cowling and the four nuts securing the column,drop the column down.Then with a bit of fiddling you can get into the housing and hook out the switch, its a push in fit so its best to remove and refit the wire plug when its out.
Before you go to all this hassle just make sure it really is the switch at fault. Check the fuse? the multiplug connections to the rear lamps etc.

[smoker]

Thanks for the helpful comments. Particularly encouraging that the dash may not have to come out - if it did I honestly think I'd scrap the car.

No power to the rear brake lights at all - all three are dead but the bulbs are OK. Haynes shows a number of electrical items running off the same fuse; they all work and fuse is OK. All other rear lights are OK.

I've ordered a switch today - £6.12 from Euro car parts and will have look at a non-facia method tomorrow. At a quick glance I wonder if it might also provide more room if I undid a brake bleed nipple at a wheel and pinned the brake pedal to the floor.

If anyone has any other thoughts - please share them!

[smoker]

OK, job done. It was the switch and oldpug's method of dropping the steeing column was a winner.

Cheers

[spider]

Excellent news.

If you have a Haynes to hand ( ! ) now its done and you're inclined: Frighten yourself by reading the procedure. IIRC It states to simply remove the dash (referring to section x etc) then do x y z, omitting the fact that fascia removal is far from quick or simple*

*Its just a pain, lots of bits and long winded rather than "difficult" though. Certainly a 'different' way to spend a day.

[Oldpug]

I did not realise that Haynes recommends removing the dash!! they are mad,where did they get it from?
I can remember the first time I DID remove a 306 dash,to replace a heater matrix.Put it all back together,job done,no brake lights?? When moving the dash around its very easy to pull the wire out of the brake light switch.

[spider]

Andy is not sure when building a 306 if you should start with the heater or the servo then build the dash / rest of car around it.

Its because they say (from what I remember) you need to have the column out too, so you can get into that 'box' section where the switch lives.

[Filberton]

Thanks to OldPug for giving me the confidence to have a go.
I can confirm that despite Haynes say so, changing the brake light switch does NOT need fascia removal. Just completed it in 20 minutes for £3.20 (switch from Euro car parts) Tools required 1/2 inch socket and Torx screwdriver and maybe a flat blade screwdriver/knife blade (to adjust the switch). 1 small cut to my hand(only because Peugeot left a metal edge).
Slight bit of contortion as had to lie half out of the car, head in foot-well under steering column.

My Pug was a 2000 model with air bag so first safety move was to disconnect the battery....just in case.

Three Torx screws to release the top and bottom steering column cowl. They are underneath and recessed about 30mm so need a longish reach. A bit of jiggling and both halves come off.

There are four 1/2 inch nuts (12mm) holding the column which are undone, no issues. column just lowers down, no worries.
Lower the column down and you will find there is a hole that Peugeot have left through the box section. hole is about 4 inch by 2 inch (100mm by 60mm for metrics). Mind the edges as they are unfinished so a bit like razor blades.

Lie with head in footwell looking up and you can see switch up high at the top of the brake pedal. Press on the pedal and you can see how it works. With small fingers (or screwdriver) switch can be pushed back into the box. Don't worry, it may look like a thread but it is not, just a friction fit and the white washer is fixed so will not drop.

Back in the hole above the column, two fingers, you can feel the wires so just gently draw them out and the switch is on the end.

Pull the old switch off and fit the new one on. (do this first as a)there is not space to fit the wire later and b) when fitting the new switch, you may drop it a couple of times and it is easier recovered by just drawing the wire.

Two fingers hold the switch, put it through the hole and find the small hole it fits in. If like me you'll think you 've got it but then find it has gone by the clutch, the hole is further to the door than you think. When you think it is right, duck back under the pedals just to check. Once located it is just a one finger push to get it in place. Push it right home but it will need adjusting in a bit. If necessary depress the foot brake as you push to make sure it is fully home.

check it is in place by another look from below then re-assemble simply the reverse of dismantling......almost done.

But......once the battery is reconnected, just check pedal travel before lights come on. (don't forget you need ignition on to check)
My Europarts switch was slightly longer than the Pug original so I had to really stamp on the pedal to get the lights on so final adjustment, back under the foot-well, put a screwdriver against the switch and GENTLY apply pressure so it clicks just on click in to the box section, check and repeat in necessary. Don't press too hard with the screwdriver as if it goes too far it is difficult to pull back without re-dismantling.

job done.....and a sigh of relief. Definitely not a fascia out job...and with a bit of time (20 minutes) a lot better than the £80 or so the garage wanted.

My other 306 is just the same but being older has no airbags so less need to disconnect the battery.



Filberton

[Oldpug]

Many thanks "smoker" & "Filberton" for the feedback,I`m glad that my advice worked.
When people take time to reply on here,give tips and advice its always nice to get a reply and some thanks.I`ve noticed many times that OP`s get replies to their topics but never bother to get back?

[maxwell98]

I know this is an old post but would just like to add some feedback - first thanks to Fiberton his detailed "how to" was a great help unfortunately my fat pudgy hands with short fingers were no help whatsoever - however the fact that other people had done this made me persevere and eventually manage to get the switch into the hole (6and a half hours - is this a record?) - I tried to make a tool to help- sort of a z piece with the switch attached - didn't work got my neighbour and his wife to try - failed - finally it became a question of ignoring the pain. Still don't know how I did it but it just popped in.

One tip I can pass on tho' - is once you have the switch seated in the hole reconnect the battery and put the ignition on then push the switch in gently until the lights go out then just one click more and your brake lights should be adjusted correctly - then disconnect the battery and reassemble as above.

One final tip - when you have everything back together again and you have a friend standing at the back checking your lights for you make sure you are pressing the brake pedal and not the clutch - although the feeling of doom and despair followed by intense relief is worth experiencing.

Thanks to all who have gone before

[spider]

Well done.

Although you might think "omg it has taken me six hours" , that is *nothing* compared to removing and refitting the fascia... So you have saved time.

Mind you its recommended to remove the dash complete for a 405 heater matrix (and most people do) , its only recently that I've learned that you can sometimes get away without doing this which saves a day...