any thoughts appreciated

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pugsick
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any thoughts appreciated

Post by pugsick »

You may have read my previous threads about my 'joys' of 407 ownership, I was fortunate to have it read on planet and the results are bellow, any suggestions or ideas i would be most grateful...

'PERMANENT FAULTS X 3'=

1, diesel temp signal open circuit short to positive..

2, EGR Fault, permanent fault.

3, Turbo position repeat signal to distant.

'INT. FAULT X 1' =

1, Turbo position repeat signal valve.

In addition top this John kindly checked the FAP as i am on permanent 'limp' mode (no smutty gags please).

33% loaded filter, Quantity 0.00/
Last regen 1705km.

Any help appreciated,

Yours sincerely a sad sick pug.
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Post by CitroJim »

Ahh well, just a bit of guesswork here but...

1. A normal indication if the sensor is open-circuit or the wiring to it is damaged. This'll be the fuel temperature sensor but no idea where it is physically..

2. That's a given. All EGR systems are a permanent fault so it's not wrong there.

3. "To(o) Distant" suggests that a signal is out of range i.e. too far away from normal. Something lost in translation perhaps? A failure to position the variable geometry of the turbo correctly as commanded by the ECU?

'INT FAULT X1'= looks like a bit of computer programming language
:roll:

4. The valve that controls the turbo geometry setting is acting up. A vacuum problem perhaps. Or even the sensor that detects the geometry setting?

On the FAP, does that mean in 1705Km the filter is already 33% choked?

Seems a relation between the EGR and Turbo geometry setting system might exist, perhaps in their vacuum actuation if indeed they are vacuum actuated?

Not exactly clear is it?

Sorry, that's not really a lot of help is it...
Jim

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pugsick
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Post by pugsick »

CitroJim,,,, trust me it is a great help.

I will forward the info to my mechanic and also the 'cowboy' engine repairers.

In my haste (or was it desperation) i forgot to add the fault codes.

I have listed them in the same order as previously listed;;

P0183

P0490

P2563

P2562

Once again many thanks,, much appreciated.
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Post by Toby_HDi »

I have looked on ServiceBox to locate the fuel temp sensor but can't find it.

On another note, you may remember that I speculated that a fuel cooler could be causing the air leak we detected if you had one.

You do, so may be worth checking it and its connections. It will be mounted under the car.
Toby


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Post by pugsick »

Many thans Toby,

I am not expecting a quick fix so do bear with me and i will keep you all posted.

Kind of scratching my head a bit to day as the more i read the codes the more confused im getting. Maybe im having a brain overload like the pug!!
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---from MikeT

Post by pugsick »

Hi Jamie,

Please don't think of yourself as a pest for asking for help on a car forum - that's what it's for, especially FCF if you read about the late founder Alan Smith.

You could do the de-coke before replacing filters or after, makes little difference. The air filter will be upstream anyway (I would spray into the inlet I removed that was after the filter housing) and the fuel filter seems capable of flowing enough fuel for a fast idle.

But that breather hose could prove more crucial so I would probably have that replaced before the de-coke as the MAF may be reading way less air than the engine is actually breathing.

Sorry, I just realised this should be posted in the public area - feel free to copy it to your thread if you'd like others to comment on my input - I'm just guessing after all and the more get engaged, the better IMO.
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Re: ---from MikeT

Post by MikeT »

pugsick wrote:Hi Jamie,

Please don't think of yourself as a pest for asking for help on a car forum - that's what it's for, especially FCF if you read about the late founder Alan Smith.

You could do the de-coke before replacing filters or after, makes little difference. The air filter will be upstream anyway (I would spray into the inlet I removed that was after the filter housing) and the fuel filter seems capable of flowing enough fuel for a fast idle.

But that breather hose could prove more crucial so I would probably have that replaced before the de-coke as the MAF may be reading way less air than the engine is actually breathing.

Sorry, I just realised this should be posted in the public area - feel free to copy it to your thread if you'd like others to comment on my input - I'm just guessing after all and the more get engaged, the better IMO.
Just to clarify, the above is from a PM I sent following discussion of this thread.

Before it, I suggested a simple attempt at de-coking as it's possible both the EGR and Turbo (and/or it's vanes) are suffering seizure from soot.

When we had a poke around the car I noticed a completely broken cam breather hose (dripping with oil), dirty air/fuel filters and air ingress in the fuel line before the fuel filter.
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Post by pugsick »

Sorry, thank you. should have mentioned that...
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Re: any thoughts appreciated

Post by MikeT »

pugsick wrote:In addition top this John kindly checked the FAP as i am on permanent 'limp' mode (no smutty gags please).

33% loaded filter, Quantity 0.00/
Last regen 1705km.
Can anyone shed any light on the above?

What are the % tolerances for filter obstruction? I'd imagine 30% is quite severe?

Is "Quantity" a reference to the additive (Eolys I believe)? Doe it need topping up or something else?

I thought I'd read somewhere that regens should happen between 400 and 800 Km so at 1700km would be well overdue?
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Re: any thoughts appreciated

Post by cachaciero »

MikeT wrote:
pugsick wrote:In addition top this John kindly checked the FAP as i am on permanent 'limp' mode (no smutty gags please).

33% loaded filter, Quantity 0.00/
Last regen 1705km.
Can anyone shed any light on the above?

What are the % tolerances for filter obstruction? I'd imagine 30% is quite severe?

Is "Quantity" a reference to the additive (Eolys I believe)? Doe it need topping up or something else?

I thought I'd read somewhere that regens should happen between 400 and 800 Km so at 1700km would be well overdue?
Well if it's anything similar to a 2.2 Cit.
Theres seems to be an impression that a regen takes place every so many miles, that's not my understanding based upon the Bosch Manual.
However the ECU does record the mileage at which a regen takes place and based upon numbers I get out of my 2.2 which is driven on routes and conditions which are not ideal from a filter point of view I normaly see numbers between 250 to 500km every time I plug the Lexia in, BUT I don't think I would be surprised to see numbers much higher than this if the car had been used mainly on long distance fast M/way work where conditions would be such that carbon would burn off without any requirement for a Regen cycle. Having said that for normal work I feel that 1700Km is well overdue. Not sure about filter load I only recall seeing pressure drop across the filter will need to revisit that.

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pugsick
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Post by pugsick »

cachaciero

Many thanks for your input.

I am still at the 'gathering information' stage but i know i need to act fairly fast as i do believe the car is getting worse.

I feel a 'forced' regen combined with a visual filter check may help but the fear of 4000rpm for 5 minutes does scare me somewhat as the engine is effectively new (although i have covered nearly 2000 miles since).

I will colate the info and post back my plan of action and result.

Very much appreciate your thoughts..
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Post by MikeT »

I've been reading more about these FAP systems and note Peugeot say the life of the FAP is equivalent to the life of the Eolys (appx 80Km). ie, once the Eolys tank has been comsumed, the FAP should be renewed. I've heard they can be washed out which may extend their life a bit further but it's got me thinking Jamie, your exhaust is probably well and truly blocked if it's the original filter. That alone would cause a very sluggish engine and adversely affect economy.
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Post by pugsick »

Thanks Mike

Apparantly my filter is reading 33% loaded. It was replaced and Eolys fluid topped up at the same time about 18 months ago.

With that in mind and the amount of 'gunk' that gone through my car what with the engine etc, i guess at least it needs a regen/ clean out.

I have been advised that a regen can be forced through Planet but it has to be reved at 4000 revs for 5 minutes. Sounds a bit scarey. It is possible (i hear) to re set the Eolys metre and that in its self could induce the required regen.

All in all a bit of a head spin at the moment. I will do the filters and pipe next week and then look at fetting the filter looked at and a regen????
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Post by MikeT »

pugsick wrote:Apparantly my filter is reading 33% loaded. It was replaced and Eolys fluid topped up at the same time about 18 months ago...


....It is possible (i hear) to re set the Eolys metre and that in its self could induce the required regen.
That seems a fair assumption but at the same time the FAP and Eolys were replaced, the ECU should have been programmed with this updated info. I'd be inclined to contact the garage that replaced them and ask pertinent questions or at least check there is actually Eolys in the tank.

There are two other faults that might prevent regeneration. One is the fuel temperature and the other being the effect of unmetered airflow from the broken breather.

I know you'll be fixing the latter with a replacement pipe so that leaves the fuel temperature sender. I suspect it can be tested with a simple multimeter reading resistance from a stone cold engine. If it shows nothing out of the ordinary (ie progressively reducing in value as the fuel heats up), I'd be looking at the connector/wiring.
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Post by pugsick »

Thanks for the pointers Mike.

I am going to be seeing my old mechanic next week and will explain (again)the situation. If it is as simple as resetting the 'counter' on Eolys to enduce the regen i will kick myself (and the mechanic).

To be fair i have had this issue since day1 of getting the car but hoped it would be sorted changing the FAP filter and Eolys fluid. Since then I kind of learnt to live with it but since having to invest on all the other work it needs sorting. Im getting good MPG (56) but miss the drivability and fun that i know the car can offer!!
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