AL4 Problems

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rookie
Posts: 51
Joined: 20 Aug 2010, 22:42
Location: cornwall
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AL4 Problems

Post by rookie »

Hello Ladies and Gentlemen

First post, so be gentle with me please.

Long story but will try and make it brief.
51 plate Pug 806 2.0ltr auto.
Bought 12 months ago but recently gearbox acting up and temp gauge on dash travelling up and down.
Gearbox got so bad that it was refusing to drive on any sort of gradient but would pull away on the flat.
Change gearbox oil? - got it into the garage and opened the level plug, dirty RED oil poured out, 2 litres over the fill level.

Assumed gearbox was gone so bought a cheap car off ebay (exactly same year and model), seller stated no heating or gearbox issues, drove car seemed fine.
Opened gearbox level plug on this car, 1 litre of RED ATF over the full level which had turned black.

The ebay vehicle is still driving but have noticed that the gearchange is somewhat bumpy so I will assume that that too is on it's way out.

So back to the original vehicle (told you it was a bit complictaed)
I noticed a water leak from the water pump housing to block joint, fixed that and found that cured the heating problem. Put the car into "D" and tried to pull away with the handbrake on and the car was actually trying to pull away with greater effort than when I first parked it up.

The ebay vehicle is not in good condition cosmetically, it has also done 168.000 miles, my original vehicle has done 60,000 and has recently had a LPG system fitted.

Now for the questions

1) I have a warning light on the dash which is orange, it is a depiction of an engine which has, what looks like an large white asterix inside it, any idea what it is?

2) If i was to replace the RED ATF in my original gearbox with Esso Lt, would it make a difference or is it completely trashed?

3) same as question "2" regarding the Ebay vehicle.

4) Would the overheating problem have caused the ECU to limit the drive of the gearbox?

Once again, sorry for the longwinded explanation but thought it better that you had as much info as possible.

Regards
rookie
Posts: 51
Joined: 20 Aug 2010, 22:42
Location: cornwall
My Cars:

Update

Post by rookie »

Today I drained the auto box and refilled with Esso/Mobil LT.

I wont say the car drives perfect, but it is 1000% better than it was, it even managed to reverse up a steep hill with no problems.

When I went to the local Peugeot dealers to get the oil, I managed to have a chat with one of their mechanics. He told me that the overheating problem had sent a message to the ECU that the gearbox could not function normally in those parameters (hence the orange light that I could not recognise).
He said that if I filled it up with the correct oil, he would reset the ECU for £39.74 incl vat, and hopefully the gearbox should be somehwere near normal, though damage may already have been done by the RED ATF which was in the box.

The LT 71141 I bought was as follows - 1 x 2ltr bottle marked as "Esso" which was the last of their stock priced at £12.15 for the 2 ltr bottle.
Plus 2 x 1ltr bottles marked as "Mobil" (the new stock) at £10.35/ltr.

All bottles marked exactly the same except one said "Esso" and the other said "Mobil" (different item code)

Thats a vast mark up for a change of name.


cheers
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CitroJim
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Post by CitroJim »

Hi rookie and welcome :D

You've just nicely demonstrated how much harm filling an AL4 with DEXRON can do.

I've had a 4HP20 apart (the V6 gearbox which also uses LT71141) that had been filled with DEXRON and found little damage as a direct result so you may well be lucky. The box in question had other damage which a hopeful garage tried to cure with an oil change.

The problem is that you cannot drain the whole lot as a lot remains in the torque convertor. You'll need to do several partial changes.

You'd have been better off buying 20L of LT. It's an outlay initially but cheaper than buying it in small quantities.

The garage is right. The box can raise an overheat fault in the ECU and it also has an oil wear counter that now must be reset as the old DEX may well have triggered it past its threshold.

They're charging a lot for a few minutes work in clearing stored faults, resetting the counter and reinitialising the auto adaptive paramaters. If you can find someone locally with a DIAG2000 or Citroen Lexia diagnostic then you can cut a cost here. There is a thread of those of us who have the diagnostics equipment for forum member use but I'm not sure there are any in Cornwall.

Have you followed the precise method needed to ensure the oil level, which is critical, is right. Ideally you need diagnostics to ensure you check the oil level when the oil is at 60 degrees. It must also be done with the box in Park and the engine idling. Cole and engine stopped, the level will appear to be artificially high.

Here's a link to the official procedure.

Hope that helps and as I say, do a couple or three more changes and I reckon all will be well.
Jim

Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
rookie
Posts: 51
Joined: 20 Aug 2010, 22:42
Location: cornwall
My Cars:

Post by rookie »

Hi Jim, thanks.

I did follow the procedure religiously, even taking a sample of oil out of the box a stuck a thermometer into it to get the temp spot on.

I intend to run the cat for a wek or so and then carry out another oil change. Yes I do believe it is cheaper to buy a larger quantity and would have done so, but to be honest, when I was quoted £12 for 2 litres by the dealer on the phone. I intended to buy at least half a dozen bottles. When i got there, he then decided that they only had 1 bottle left and I was not prepared to pay the extra for the Mobil brand name.

So I will look round for a better deal over the next week and then hopefully start to sort out the other 806 autobox.

I have to admit, I would have been lost without the back history of Q & A's by you good people on this forum and really appreciate the input.

Once again, thanks Jim
rookie
Posts: 51
Joined: 20 Aug 2010, 22:42
Location: cornwall
My Cars:

Post by rookie »

OOps! sorry about the spelling, the light over my PC has blown and I am typing in the dark. Course the age of my eyes is not helping either

cheers
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