Guess What - Xantia Suspension stuff

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Ben Hancy
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Postby Ben Hancy » 22 Jul 2002, 23:42

I think they have given me the wheel bearing, although the invoice (from GSF I hasten to add !) does say rear suspension arm bearing.
Problem is I don't think they were worn !!
Surely they would sell these as a pair - you wouldn't do one without the other ???
Cheers
Ben
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alan s
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Postby alan s » 23 Jul 2002, 03:36

"Normal Citroen set up is 2 tapered bearings, a spacer and thrust washers to set pre-load."
Ben,
The description above is the normal contents for a kit - per side.
Current price (from memory) is about 21 pounds each set, or 42 to buy enough to do both arms.
Alan S
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Ben Hancy
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Postby Ben Hancy » 30 Jul 2002, 07:38

All,
Thought I'd give you all an update, it's a bit of an epic but I enjoyed writing it ....
This Job has been hell:
Total Elapsed Time = 10 Days ( Car was on Axle Stands for 6 Days)
Total Man Hours Spent = Est 45 Hours
Total Distance Traveled = 200 Miles
Total Money Spent = £ 195.00
So anyone reading who has not tackled this job before might have half a chance I'd like to explain this story.
I Posted this Question a couple of days before I started the Job, thought Id got the general Idea, booked a Monday off work, up bright and early.
Following the comments about possible swing arm bearing issues I managed to convince myself that the rear left wheel was towing in.
I called local GSF asked for 6 spheres ( 2 X Front, 2 X Rear, 1 Main accumalator + 1 for the rear in the centre on the 1.8 16V) + Swing arm Bearing Kit. GSF told me had everything but the 2 Rears which they could get by lunch.
Started to prepare for the Job, tried to depresurise the system, ballsed up a bit and lost the thread on the Hyrdralic Pressure Unit (seperate thread avaialble for my rantings on that). Spent all morning removing Pressure unit from Car.
Drove to GSF (20 Mile Round Trip) was in there 1 Hour wilst they frantically typed different numbers in to find the right bits. After 40 Minutes a chap walked in and asked for a Main Accumulator sphere which he had ordered - guess what they were trying to sell it to me !
I also asked for a sphere removal tool, but that's not something they stock.
As I left the shop and placed the bits (£ 120.00) (Minus the acumulator sphere) in the Car I noticed on the invoice that the Front and rears he had given me were for a Diesel.
When't back into the shop and queried it, they frantically typed more numbers made some telephone calls and then swapped the units.
By the time I got home it was 3:00pm and I needed to sort the Hydraulic Pressure regulator Unit, found a scrapy near Luton (70 Mile round trip) that sold me a replacement unit for £ 35 + VAT.
Spent the rest of the day refitting the Hydraulic Pressure regulator Unit.
Let the car run for the rest of the week, until the following weekend came round tried everywhere to get a sphere removal tool - told by Citeron use a Chain Wrench, Scrappy who supplied HPR Unit Big hammer & Chisel.
Saturday came had severl jobs to do so didn't start till lunch - depresurised system no probs (very f'ing cautious about it !) The best tool I could find (After busting 2 Chain wrenches) was a Halfords high strength oil filter wrench which consisted of a big strap and a waking great bolt to tighten £ 15 busted with second swipe of the Hammer.
Eventualy went for an adaptation of option 2, drilled a 1/2 inch hole through the middle of the sphere top to bottom inserted 1/2 inch steel bar and hit it with a big hammer, messy but very satisfying.
Struggled for about an hour to remove the swing arm, another 10 Minutes or so I was holding the old and new bearings in each hand and looking puzzled, it looks as though they have given me the wheel bearing.
I go back to the drawing board and check the bearing, cant seem to find any play, looking at the tyre although it has worn excessively in such a short ammount of time the wear is fairly even. ( I Think I let myself be convinced I needed to do the Job) repacked Bearing with grease + refitted swing arm bearing.
Having had to refit a new sphere to the rear left, I decided now I had a method I was going to do the lot. drilled hole in the other rear popped of in seconds.
Fixed chain wrench and did the two fronts - Good tip wrap them in a carrier bag before you undo them !
Feeling Brave I did the last sphere which I had, using the big hole & hammer method, as I started to disconnect it I discovered this was connected slightly differently (no metion of this in the Haynes book) this has a Union nut in the back of it.
The replacement unit I had looked nothing like the one I had just drilled a big hole in (Despite being told at GSF there was only one type of sphere used at the rear in the centre on a Xantia !) It was now 6PM GSF was shut till Monday, time to stop for a Beer and a Shower.
Sunday up @ 10:00 calling round all known motor factors, several people tried to sell me a standard rear sphear, most tried to sell me what I had got.
A glimmer of hope from one guy, didn't have one in but could get one for 12:00 (for a Sunday this sounded good). Arrived at 12:00 to discover he had the same sphere as I already had, bit more research on this site and discovered the correct name for the Unit (Anit Sink sphere).
Phoned Motor factor in Milton Keynes and the bloke told me he had one on the shelf I asked him to confirm it was an Anti Sink and he did drove all the way there (30 Mile Round Trip) - He had Standard rear spheres.
Gave up watched the French GP got Drunk.
Was working late for the next couppe of days so the thing sat on axle stands for a few d
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reffro
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Postby reffro » 30 Jul 2002, 16:11

Makes me glad I let a garage tackle the job for me. Ok it cost a bit more, but it was done in a day, and let me avoid screwing the job up myself being a hamfisted sod at the best of times. £270 to get seven spheres replaced is looking better value as each day goes by.
Ben, well done for persevering, I don't think I would have had the same patience, but it is fun to play around with your motor, just I haven't progressed much past basic servicing and brake changes. The difference in my Xantia's ride after the sphere change is amazing, my usual 80mph cruise up the A1 has never been so comfortable, in this or any other car.
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JohnD
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Postby JohnD » 31 Jul 2002, 02:24

Hi Ben - Congratulations on the completion of the marathon. You should find replacing the accumulator a doddle. If, as you say the rear arm bearings are OK and serviceable, how do you account for the uneven wear on the tyres?
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Ben Hancy
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Postby Ben Hancy » 31 Jul 2002, 03:39

John,
As I said in my last posting (Bit long to read all of it I know) upon closer inspection although heavily worn the tyre was worn evenly all across the tyre i.e not just on the inside.
I think I just convinced myself the Job needed doing.
Ben.
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Dave Burns
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Postby Dave Burns » 31 Jul 2002, 04:48

Well they say you learn best by your mistakes, you sound a bit like me, no matter how difficult or daunting the task may seem, the satisfaction of having done it yourself and at (usualy) the lowest cost is worth all the agro, plus you know where the pitfall's will be the next time so the job become's even easier and you save even more dosh.
I enjoyed the read and admire your perseverance, thank's.
Let this be a lesson to all those who take the easey route and fork out all those conker's because they don't think they can do it.
Dave
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shaunthesheep
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Postby shaunthesheep » 02 Aug 2002, 21:57

ben,
its looks like you had lots of fun <img src=icon_smile_angry.gif border=0 align=middle>, is it worth me changing my rear trailing arm bearings myself or paying a garage to do the work.
dom
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Ben Hancy
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Postby Ben Hancy » 04 Aug 2002, 06:07

Dom,
Before I start please re-read my comments on diagnosis, are you sure this jobs needs doing ? If the tyre has been eaten on the inside it probably a fair bet, if it's just badly worn as in my case it's probably jsut the spheres.
If you have the kit to do the Job i.e
1) T-55 Torx Screw
2) Decent Sphere removal tool (or a replacment sphere and the drill a
big hole method)
3) The right Bearing Kit.
And your not scared to get your hands dirty.
There is no good reason why you should pay somebody to do the Job, If you have read my report on what went wrong, I don't expect there are to many other pitfalls you could find, there was a comment made on here about welding something onto the inner bearing to remove it, that should not be neccessary, I found a Citroen wheel stud was the closest thing to a best fit drift, tap gently with the palm of your hand (Haynes speak for belt with big hammer !) and it was away.
If you don't hit any of the problems I did, you should be able to do it in 3 to 4 Hours no problem.
If you do tackle this job, one thing I didn't mention in my original post was refitting the gaiter on the suspension leg, one of those jobs that requires six arms, I found a naty little tool in the back of my Dads garage that stretched the gaiter and pushed the rod through.
With Hind sight I would have tried to fit this before I had fitted the leg in place.
Come on Dom be brave, look on the bright side I couldn't be much worse than my efforts, and when you have finished you will know 1 - you saved yourself a couple of quid, 2 - the job was done properly, 3 - bits aren't gonna fall off next time you give it some stick and finally you will have gained a bit more of an understanding into how your car works ( Something worth knowing when you trust it with your life in a corner at 60+mph !)
Keep us informed as to how you get on - any problems post and we will try and help !
Cheers
Ben
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shaunthesheep
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Postby shaunthesheep » 05 Aug 2002, 00:09

ben, mine's not wasting the rear tyres, but it has got a nasty squeak, which leads me to suspect that the rear tralling bearing are shot<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>. car has done 135k, sphears were replaced easter this year as well as the rear height correcter, have looked on most cit forums, most people say that it doees sound like the rear trailing arm bearings.
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NiSk
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Postby NiSk » 05 Aug 2002, 13:55

There is a quite simple way of checking the condition of your rear suspension arm bearings, which works 90% of the time.
1) Jack up the rear of the car so that both rear wheels are free and then put it securly on axel stands.
2) Depressurise the hydraulic system.
3) Get hold of each rear hub in turn and check:
a) that you can move it up and down freely - if not you've probably got a worn bearing which is sticking.
b) if it moves up and down freely, check for sideways play - if it moves laterally, you've got bearing wear.
This may not show all levels of wear, but in my experience (on BX's and XM's) its enough to show if you've got trouble.
//NiSk
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shaunthesheep
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Postby shaunthesheep » 05 Aug 2002, 21:55

cheers nisk,
will check that before i start doing any work, thats if we will ever get at dry couple of hours over here in good old britain <img src=icon_smile.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile.gif border=0 align=middle>
dom
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Cannonball
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Postby Cannonball » 06 Aug 2002, 00:34

Why does my 1993 Xantia 1.9D (108K) back end squeek squeek squeek? (on the car that is..) Suspension is level, no movement from trying to rock the wheels, rises and falls level. I am considering buying new spheres for the back end and a large drill bit and carrier bag...
Seriously, the back end is starting to get rather bumpy. Citroen dealer says "They just squeek!"
Darren
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shaunthesheep
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Postby shaunthesheep » 07 Aug 2002, 05:51

darren, looks like you've got the same problem that i've got. i should be doing mine in the next couple of weeks or so. will keep you all informed of progress.
dom <img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>
Edited by - shaunthesheep on 27 Aug 2002 00:47:35
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darthvader
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Postby darthvader » 20 Aug 2002, 17:42

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
All, I have had a search round this forum and think I already know the worst, but I would be gratefull if you can confirm for me.
I have a 1996 N Reg 1.8i 16V Xantia Dimension. (114K Miles)
The Rear suspension is suspect it's wasted a brand new set of rear tyres in 4 Months.
When the car starts in the morning, the front raises within a couple of seconds however the back can take up to a couple of minutes.
It Clicks a bit 1st thing but not whilst I'm driving.
Once it's up, the ride from the rear is still fairly rough.
The Questions .....
Is this definatley a case for replacing the spheres ? (I Don't think they have ever been done before)
Is there an argument for doing them all at the same time ?, Or do I just need to do the rear ?
Should I think about replacing the Height Adjuster, the Haynes manual suggest that you can't make any repairs to them - is this true ?
Is there anyhthing else I need to consider ?
Are the reconditioned spheres worth touching considering I hope to keep the car for a good few years yet ?
What can I expext to pay for the Job if I do it myself ?
Is this Job out of a semi-techie mechanics league ? ( can manage to swap out engines and change clutches any rocket science in these spheres !)
Be grateful for any responses to this - I've got a new baby on the way in a couple of months and don't wanna splash out on bit's I don't really need.
Cheers
Ben

<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>
mik
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