Anders and other experts
1996 1.9TD
I replaced the spheres with amtex ones recently. Mileage 144000.
Bought the car recently from colleague at work who had a full service history and certainly looked after the car well with a reasonably completed FSH from main dealer.
I have had numerous BX's prior to this over an 8 yr period.
I had previously owned a 1998 diesel with 66000 miles. I changed the spheres on that car at 70000 miles and experienced a huge improvement in handling and comfort.
Have to confess my boss made me sell this car to buy a Volvo bouncing 940 Estate with 7 seats. Must say the build quality of the engine and electrical gear plus the seats is light years ahead of Citroen. They dont seem to have managed to sort out suspension/roadholding yet though.
On this car the improvement has certainly not been as pronounced. I intent putting in Hydraclean shortly as it looks as if this never was done before. I will also grease the front struts as they are groaning a little when risen to full height or when at rest for a period.
Is there anything else I should do to service/overhaul the system.
What I am finding is that the suspension is not floating over poor roads but rippling for want of a better word. Definitely the earlier Xantia was incredible after the sphere change. They were Original Citroen ones on that occasion.
rgds
Tony
Citroen Suspension overhaul
Moderator: RichardW
Hi Tony -
It really is disappointing when the effortss & expenses invested in sphere change does not improve the ride.
No doubt the front suspension is responsible for this.
I suspect the problem is the front struts being dry in the cylinder slide bearing. As we know, Tom's idea from lubing the BX front struts does not apply to Xantia & XM struts, the option left is greasing the strut cylinder manually.
It's known to work wonders on the front suspension.
It's important you know for sure there is no other problems in the suspension components, like worn fluidblocks (bushings) for the lower control arm, and the droplinks.
I doubt the hydracleanse may improve the ride, but it will defo remove lots of dirt from the system, which by itself may clear some other strange symptoms.
Do you get a sensible click time from the PR (accu sphere) ?
How is the standard corner manual jerking test feeling ?
It really is disappointing when the effortss & expenses invested in sphere change does not improve the ride.
No doubt the front suspension is responsible for this.
I suspect the problem is the front struts being dry in the cylinder slide bearing. As we know, Tom's idea from lubing the BX front struts does not apply to Xantia & XM struts, the option left is greasing the strut cylinder manually.
It's known to work wonders on the front suspension.
It's important you know for sure there is no other problems in the suspension components, like worn fluidblocks (bushings) for the lower control arm, and the droplinks.
I doubt the hydracleanse may improve the ride, but it will defo remove lots of dirt from the system, which by itself may clear some other strange symptoms.
Do you get a sensible click time from the PR (accu sphere) ?
How is the standard corner manual jerking test feeling ?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by AndersDK</i>
I suspect the problem is the front struts being dry in the cylinder slide bearing. As we know, Tom's idea from lubing the BX front struts does not apply to Xantia & XM struts, the option left is greasing the strut cylinder manually.
It's known to work wonders on the front suspension.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
How do you grease the strut cylinder manually ?
rgds
deelite
I suspect the problem is the front struts being dry in the cylinder slide bearing. As we know, Tom's idea from lubing the BX front struts does not apply to Xantia & XM struts, the option left is greasing the strut cylinder manually.
It's known to work wonders on the front suspension.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
How do you grease the strut cylinder manually ?
rgds
deelite
deelite -
It's one of those simple jobs, you always wants to postpone, as you get really dirty hands [8D]
Simply have the suspension on highest setting, then unclip the gaiters from top of the strut inside front wheel arch, lift up the gaiter to reveal the protruding shiny cylinder. This you clean, then smear with any standard grease.
Best tool is your bare hands !
It's a 15 min's job max pr side. Cleaning your hands may take a bit longer [:D]
TIP : Prepare your hands with a coating hand lotion, known from industrial use. Or you may use a pair of disposible engineering latex gloves.
It's one of those simple jobs, you always wants to postpone, as you get really dirty hands [8D]
Simply have the suspension on highest setting, then unclip the gaiters from top of the strut inside front wheel arch, lift up the gaiter to reveal the protruding shiny cylinder. This you clean, then smear with any standard grease.
Best tool is your bare hands !
It's a 15 min's job max pr side. Cleaning your hands may take a bit longer [:D]
TIP : Prepare your hands with a coating hand lotion, known from industrial use. Or you may use a pair of disposible engineering latex gloves.
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tony42
- (Donor 2020)
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Citroen C4 1.6HDI VTR 2013 - x 3
Anders
Thanks for the reply. I will grease them over the next week and report back. I agree with the strut idea as they are stiff after 144000 miles. Hopefully greasing will work,I was curious about the lifespan of struts? Is it just a case of greasing or do they eventually give up the ghost?.The 98 xantia had noisy struts as well but spheres worked ok. Drop links were done on this car but where are the bushings for the control arm and how do i check same?
rgds
Tony
Thanks for the reply. I will grease them over the next week and report back. I agree with the strut idea as they are stiff after 144000 miles. Hopefully greasing will work,I was curious about the lifespan of struts? Is it just a case of greasing or do they eventually give up the ghost?.The 98 xantia had noisy struts as well but spheres worked ok. Drop links were done on this car but where are the bushings for the control arm and how do i check same?
rgds
Tony
The Xantia (& XM) front struts are very long lasting, because of a much better design than the first versions on BX'es.
I donno why they go dry in the slide bearing, as the construction should in fact keep them greased, by the normal internal leak off.
You <font color="red"><i>may</i></font id="red"> try if you can get some LHM into the strut using Tom's method. If you have success with this, it will no doubt work like a miracle on the struts :
Simply unplug the return leak-off hose from strut, at the chassis pipe connection, then immerse and hold the hose in a jar with LHM, and do repeated Citaerobics. Chances are that the strut may seep in a few mL of LHM, which is what is needed.
An alternative method is simply holding the hose upright, then try fill in a few mL of LHM, while you have a thin gauge steel wire inserted in the hose, to try disturb any air lock down the hose. The gravity would then simply make the small amount of LHM seep down. When you have filled up the hose with LHM, block it with your thumb and refit on to the chassis pipe. Then do the repeated Citaerobics.
Even considered this fiddly work, you'll never, ever regret, if you have success getting some LHM into the strut internals. I promise you - from own experience with my BX.
The rubber bushings are the pivot "bearings" locating the arm on to the subframe.
I donno why they go dry in the slide bearing, as the construction should in fact keep them greased, by the normal internal leak off.
You <font color="red"><i>may</i></font id="red"> try if you can get some LHM into the strut using Tom's method. If you have success with this, it will no doubt work like a miracle on the struts :
Simply unplug the return leak-off hose from strut, at the chassis pipe connection, then immerse and hold the hose in a jar with LHM, and do repeated Citaerobics. Chances are that the strut may seep in a few mL of LHM, which is what is needed.
An alternative method is simply holding the hose upright, then try fill in a few mL of LHM, while you have a thin gauge steel wire inserted in the hose, to try disturb any air lock down the hose. The gravity would then simply make the small amount of LHM seep down. When you have filled up the hose with LHM, block it with your thumb and refit on to the chassis pipe. Then do the repeated Citaerobics.
Even considered this fiddly work, you'll never, ever regret, if you have success getting some LHM into the strut internals. I promise you - from own experience with my BX.
The rubber bushings are the pivot "bearings" locating the arm on to the subframe.
No - the rubber bushings are supposed to be dry.
Over the years the rubber detoriates, just like engine mounts, allowing for too much play, thus possibly causing noise.
It's a MOT test point, where the tester tries if there is too much play using a crowbar.
As all BX'es are quite old on the roads now, it's a common problem on BX'es, and I suspect it's beginning to become a standard issue on earlier Xantia's too.
Over the years the rubber detoriates, just like engine mounts, allowing for too much play, thus possibly causing noise.
It's a MOT test point, where the tester tries if there is too much play using a crowbar.
As all BX'es are quite old on the roads now, it's a common problem on BX'es, and I suspect it's beginning to become a standard issue on earlier Xantia's too.
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tony42
- (Donor 2020)
- Posts: 60
- Joined: 19 May 2004, 16:58
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Citroen C4 1.6HDI VTR 2013 - x 3
Anders
Did the greasing of the front struts. There was no clips on the rubber gaiters. Just seemed to pull down easily. Unfortunately for me anyway replacing/fitting the gaiter was fiddly. Just seem to have to keep pushing it over the metal lip at the top of the strut .Eventually got them both on. Is that all that holds the rubber gaiters on?
I considered checking the lhm filters at this stage. As per usual the Haynes mentions everything but explains nothing. Reminds me of the old adage about Paddy Hopkirk accessories. "Guaranteed to fit nothing". Do i have to depressurise the system to remove the filters.
I took off the metal clip but it seems to me that all the hoses connecting to the lid need to be removed from their locating clips on the reservoir. Anyway to cut a short story long the filter housing only moved about 2 inches(5 cm) up. no more. What am i doing wrong I was afraid to force anything just in case.
Havent driven it yet but struts are moving up and down more smoothly with very little noise. Looks hopeful
Tony
Did the greasing of the front struts. There was no clips on the rubber gaiters. Just seemed to pull down easily. Unfortunately for me anyway replacing/fitting the gaiter was fiddly. Just seem to have to keep pushing it over the metal lip at the top of the strut .Eventually got them both on. Is that all that holds the rubber gaiters on?
I considered checking the lhm filters at this stage. As per usual the Haynes mentions everything but explains nothing. Reminds me of the old adage about Paddy Hopkirk accessories. "Guaranteed to fit nothing". Do i have to depressurise the system to remove the filters.
I took off the metal clip but it seems to me that all the hoses connecting to the lid need to be removed from their locating clips on the reservoir. Anyway to cut a short story long the filter housing only moved about 2 inches(5 cm) up. no more. What am i doing wrong I was afraid to force anything just in case.
Havent driven it yet but struts are moving up and down more smoothly with very little noise. Looks hopeful
Tony
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Dave Burns
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I would only recomend cleaning the filters during a complete fluid change, I've allways thought the hoses too difficult to remove and risking damage without doing it this way:
Syphon or pump the LHM out, remove rubber air ducting between filter and engine, unplug the wiring and unclip the LHM pipe block, remove the two nuts holding the tank in place, tip the tank on its side and remove the pipe block, lift the tank out and place a suitable container in its place to catch the dripping LHM, no mess, no pulling and tugging or disturbing of pipes, and you shouldn't need to be doing the filters unless changing fluid and cleaning the tank anyway.
Dave
Syphon or pump the LHM out, remove rubber air ducting between filter and engine, unplug the wiring and unclip the LHM pipe block, remove the two nuts holding the tank in place, tip the tank on its side and remove the pipe block, lift the tank out and place a suitable container in its place to catch the dripping LHM, no mess, no pulling and tugging or disturbing of pipes, and you shouldn't need to be doing the filters unless changing fluid and cleaning the tank anyway.
Dave
OOps......I didn't mean take the pipes off, just away from the side of the tank , I should have made myself clearer.
Thats a good idea about tipping the tank with the pipe section in, just tried it and it works a treat.
Got to replace the hydraflush next month anyway will have a proper go then...[:)]
Thats a good idea about tipping the tank with the pipe section in, just tried it and it works a treat.
Got to replace the hydraflush next month anyway will have a proper go then...[:)]
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tony42
- (Donor 2020)
- Posts: 60
- Joined: 19 May 2004, 16:58
- Location: Dublin
- My Cars: Citroen C5 2.0HDI VTR+ Technopack 150 Blue Tourer 2016
Citroen C4 1.6HDI VTR 2013 - x 3
Dave
I intended putting in hydraflush but was curious to see how bad the filters are. I reckoned I would need to do some of the stuff you are suggesting I was just hoping to avoid having to depressurize the system when checking the condition of filters. I take it I have to depressurise the system before doing any of this work.
Thanks for the info
What is the story with the rubber gaiters. Is that all thats needed to hold the gaiters over the strut?
Tony
I intended putting in hydraflush but was curious to see how bad the filters are. I reckoned I would need to do some of the stuff you are suggesting I was just hoping to avoid having to depressurize the system when checking the condition of filters. I take it I have to depressurise the system before doing any of this work.
Thanks for the info
What is the story with the rubber gaiters. Is that all thats needed to hold the gaiters over the strut?
Tony
Gaitors fit over a lip at the top, I always give it a little squirt of wd40 with the straw to help slide on and off properly.
Changed fluid for fresh LHM about 3-4 months ago,after a couple of months checked fluid and the colour was as bad as before so on Anders advice refilled with hydraflush, after a couple of weeks checked filters and fluid and a lot of sediment was being left in the tank so its obviously doing good, Suspension definately has more fluidness about it, the height correcting also has a smoothness about it that wasn't there before. (when I bought the car October 03 the fluid had never been changed in 6 years)
I will replacing with LHM next month, I would recommend flush for peace of mind alone.
I think Anders has a link to a site where he explains how to do this in detail or try a search for hydraflush[8D]
Changed fluid for fresh LHM about 3-4 months ago,after a couple of months checked fluid and the colour was as bad as before so on Anders advice refilled with hydraflush, after a couple of weeks checked filters and fluid and a lot of sediment was being left in the tank so its obviously doing good, Suspension definately has more fluidness about it, the height correcting also has a smoothness about it that wasn't there before. (when I bought the car October 03 the fluid had never been changed in 6 years)
I will replacing with LHM next month, I would recommend flush for peace of mind alone.
I think Anders has a link to a site where he explains how to do this in detail or try a search for hydraflush[8D]
LHM fluid service [:)]