Dispatch/Expert/Scudo

[sparksie]

Hi guys

Despite looking after a couple of Dispatch/Expert vans for people over the years, I've never got my hands on their Fiat badged sister.
After a long search for a wheelchair vehicle, getting turned down for grant aid along the way, one has cropped up in the classifieds at last.
It's a Fiat Scudo, from 2002.
Being a 2.0 turbo diesel, I'm hoping that means it's a HDI, not some obscure Italian thing like the old 1.7 Ritmo/Strada.
Anybody know?
Also, I'm familiar with the build quality issues on the French vans, having fitted several driver and rear door handles and a number of bonnet release levers and I expect those to be equally prevalent on the Fiat.
Is there anything else I need to watch out for on the passenger variant, or unique to the Fiat?
It's over 2 hours away and I don't want to do it too often!
Cheers guys
Sorry, I know its not strictly a Citroen...

[RPWC]

As far as Im aware, the Peugeot engine is in all versions , regardless of badge. Fiat call their version the JTD.

[sparksie]

Thanks Rich

I needn't have worried, as it turns out.
This one's had a complete drivetrain transplant, from a C5.
The gear change cables wouldn't work with the C5 gearbox, so the linkage was used too and the lever is right beside the seats, actually in a much nicer position than the usual dash mounted one.
I do, naturally, have door lock/handle and bonnet release lever issues, not to mention all the heater controls have fallen off and got lost.
The hunt is on for cheap replacements...

[sparksie]

Well, most unusually for me, I have yet to properly look at the Scudo in daylight, but I know I need a lock set, possibly a rear door handle, definitely a bonnet release lever, all the heater control sliders, probably some stuff from the console to retain them and probably a steering wheel.
Anybody have them?
The steering wheel rim is dissolving into a soft sticky black jelly.
Every time I touch it I come away black and tacky. No amount of scrubbing with wet wipes makes the slightest difference, even though they are remarkably effective at removing oil residue from control surfaces before SWMBO drives my cars.
I suspect the previous owner may have used some sort of solvent on it and it's reacting poorly.
None of the vans I've played with over the years has had this problem, so I don't think it's typical, unless you know different..?

[sparksie]

Hi Guys

OK, I got burned, no two ways about it!
The wheelchair accessible Scudo I told you about, had new sills professionally fitted about a year ago, declared by the previous owner and I paid close attention to them before parting with my cash.
They looked the business and my magnet stuck firmly to them, so I took the guy's word and I've spent time and money putting various other maladies right, before finally putting it in for a test, expecting a short list of things to finish it off and put it into service as a Granny transport.
Imagine my horror when I was told the drivers sills had collapsed on the lift and the car needed extensive welding.
So now I'm back in the market for a wheelchair accessible car, all over again.
Can anyone tell me how the additional floor for the wheelchair straps attaches to the rest of the car?
If I can get it out, I'll look specifically for a Dispatch/Expert, which I know were galvanised, so are unlikely to dissolve from the ground up, so I can fit my existing kit and all the new parts I bought for the Fiat.
I'm starting to lose the plot, now!
Thanks guys

[GiveMeABreak]

Wouldn't that be a question better aimed at the conversion company who do the mods? I can't see any reference to anything other than the standard floor and anchor points in the docs.

[Gibbo2286]

Had I seen your original post I'd have told you to walk away from any FIAT in the UK/Ireland, in my experience they're all dreadful, especially in the rust department.

[Michel]

Had I seen your original post I'd have told you to walk away from any FIAT in the UK/Ireland, in my experience they're all dreadful, especially in the rust department.

Why? The Scudo is simply a rebadged Citroen Jumpy and it's made in France.

[Gibbo2286]

Had I seen your original post I'd have told you to walk away from any FIAT in the UK/Ireland, in my experience they're all dreadful, especially in the rust department.

Why? The Scudo is simply a rebadged Citroen Jumpy and it's made in France.

I guess it's just down to years of experience Mike, I've handled an awful lot over the years and the FIATs have always been a pain, no experience of the current stuff admittedly.

[Michel]

Had I seen your original post I'd have told you to walk away from any FIAT in the UK/Ireland, in my experience they're all dreadful, especially in the rust department.

Why? The Scudo is simply a rebadged Citroen Jumpy and it's made in France.

I guess it's just down to years of experience Mike, I've handled an awful lot over the years and the FIATs have always been a pain, no experience of the current stuff admittedly.

I have to vaguely agree to be honest Eric. I believe Italian FIATs stopped rusting in the mid 90s when they started galvanizing. None of the FIATs I've had have been older than that and none rusted.

They were mechanically absolute sh1te. I splashed out on a Punto, at the time the newest car I had owned. It didn't rust, had only 35k on it and just about everything else broke on it. Head gasket, clutch, crank oil seal, brake master cylinder and more. Hated it before too long.

[sparksie]

Yes, I've had some horrific Fiats pass through the workshop over the years, but I've always had a soft spot for them.
My own 127, with the 903cc engine from the 850 it replaced, never once let me down and the rust that killed most of it's siblings was easy to deal with, as long as it wasn't left to fester for long.
This is quite a different matter, though.
The fact that it's been done badly is bad enough, but having collapsed and changed the shape of the door aperture puts it beyond my capabilities, with the facilities I have now.
I could possibly do it in the open, without a jig, but I'd always wonder about whether I'd got the critical dimensions right and would it behave correctly in an accident.
I think, all things considered, it's better to weigh it in and get one that hasn't been bent.
Marc, yes, it would certainly be a question for the modifiers, but sadly they are reluctant to assist unless its converting a brand new vehicle and getting handsomely paid with taxpayers money.
They flatly refused to help with the search for a used one, insisting I would qualify for the grant aid I've already been turned down for and wanting to discuss the new model they would supply me instead!

[RichardW]

Sorry to hear it's turned sour....

Can you not 'just' strip out the wheelchair adaptations on the one you've got, this will give you all the bits you need, and with a few careful measurements you should be able to transfer it over to a another one?

[sparksie]

Hi Richard

Yes, that's the plan.
However, the harness for the wheelchair clips into dedicated brackets in the floor that has been somehow fitted on top of the original,
Try as I might, I can't figure out how, or even if, that comes out.
I can't cut the car away from around it, in the hope that all will be revealed, because due to my current circumstances, I have no workshop, nor any sort of secure yard and I think the authorities, not to mention my neighbors, might object to me doing it in a public place outside the house!
I was rather hoping someone on here might have broken one and know how they do it, but the closely guarded secret seems safe!
Seems to be still my turn to get kicked!

[BX]

A 2002 Scudo wheelchair accessible vehicle probably started life as a combinato. It was factory fitted with windows and clip out rear seats. The floor was covered with thick dense foam with a rubber mat type top covering. The most common method at that time was to use aircraft seat tracking to anchor the wheelchair and the seatbelts for the wheelchair user. This tracking was bolted to the floor using countersunk bolts with reinforcing plates or large body washers underneath the floor. This tracking system is what's actually used to mount the seats in commercial passenger jet aircraft.
Other systems such as q-straint were also used which had individual fixings to the floor. The van probably also has the original seat fixings still in place. The only differences between the escudo, dispatch and expert were the logo and minor trim differences. For some reason the scudo was easier to get in passenger format at the time.
There was also a number of UK converted lowered floor examples. The quality of these conversions was very variable. To be honest I wouldn't expect them to have lasted this long and would expect to find serious corrosion problems where the bodywork was cut and the lowered floor was welded in.
More modern vehicles are converted using a Crash tested floor. These can be fitted with a combination of adhesive, screws and bolts. Removal can be difficult

[sparksie]

Thanks, BX
Mine doesn't have the lowered floor, but neither does it have the original seat mountings, nor any visible trace of them.
It has slots specifically made for the wheelchair harness, sunk into the floor. two in front of the rear seat and two about a foot behind the front seats.
The rear seat has been moved back as far as it could go without opening the doors and bolted down securely. It doesn't fold forward or clip out, as suggested in the owners handbook. The middle row has been removed entirely and replaced by a folding, rear facing, 3 seat thing that sits flush with the back of the front seats when not in use, leaving room for the wheelchair to enter through the side doors and manoeuvre into position where the middle row should be.
I think all of this is on a secondary floor panel, on top of the original floor, but I can find no fixings, other than the bolts holding the seats down.
I'll try and get it up on a lift, or over a pit, before I weigh it in, and see can I figure it out.
I've seen some lowered floor "conversions" that relied on self tapping screws to hold structural parts together, so I can't imagine quality of workmanship is a high priority for these guys. If it's glued and screwed, I'll see the screws sticking through the floor, probably with a big brown halo around each one.
I'll abandon hope, if that turns out to be the case!