Just wondering if anyone else has had this problem;
Late last year I changed the oil and filter on my Xantia 1.9TD using a Champion oil filter from Halfrauds. After changing it, I noticed that the oil pressure warning light now took noticeably longer to go out every time the engine was started – a couple of seconds or so with the Champion filter, whereas before it was always instant.
I think the engine was also slightly more clattery when first starting, as presumably the oil took a little longer to begin circulating properly.
I’ve just changed the oil again, this time using a proper Purflux filter from GSF, and now once again the oil light goes out the instant the engine fires, and it seems quieter. Castrol GTD oil was used on both occasions, so the oil iteslf can be ruled out.
I’ve heard in the past that ‘cheap’ oil filters are best avoided because some don’t contain a valve that helps to prevent some of the oil draining back to the sump when the engine is switched off, but Champion filters are hardly cheap (about double the price of a genuine one from GSF !!).
I suspect that this one was faulty, I’ve used this brand of oil filter on the Xantia in the past with no problems, but I’ll be sticking to Purflux filters from now on.
Fortunately, no obvious harm seems to have been done to the engine.
Nick
1.9TD - dodgy Champion oil filters??
Moderator: RichardW
I too have experienced this problem but on a Halfords branded filter. It's due to the lack of Non Return Valve within the canister which means the filter drains when the engine is switched off and doesn't build up oil pressure quickly enough when the engine is started. I now prime any make of filter by disabling the fuel pump (if petrol) or removing the solenoid feed (if diesel) and letting the engine turn over for a few seconds at least.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Doc</i>
I now prime any make of filter by disabling the fuel pump (if petrol) or removing the solenoid feed (if diesel) and letting the engine turn over for a few seconds at least.
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Keypad immobilisers come in handy here, after refilling with oil don't type in the code, just turn the ignition key and the engine can be made to turn over on the starter without making any attempt to start, whilst the new filter primes.
This problem wasn't just when the engine was first started after changing the oil though, it was every single time it was started, even if the car had only been stood for a few minutes [:(]
I won't be using their filters again.
I now prime any make of filter by disabling the fuel pump (if petrol) or removing the solenoid feed (if diesel) and letting the engine turn over for a few seconds at least.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Keypad immobilisers come in handy here, after refilling with oil don't type in the code, just turn the ignition key and the engine can be made to turn over on the starter without making any attempt to start, whilst the new filter primes.
This problem wasn't just when the engine was first started after changing the oil though, it was every single time it was started, even if the car had only been stood for a few minutes [:(]
I won't be using their filters again.
This is something that came up on another forum a year ago, an updated version of my reply is...
<<Really worrying this. Many times in the past when folks have chuntered on about non-OE filters (missing the valves or being poor quality) I've said keep to a known aftermarket brand and you'll be OK...so no need to worry about a manufacturers one every time.
Also I've supported Halfords quality for two reasons. They are no two bit company and also I have a contact in their buying department who has chatted about their sources which seem mostly top quality.
Personally I would be very interested to hear what Halfords would say if you put these points to their management. I can't think they would knowingly sell oil filters that would damage any engine...the publicity would be too negative.
Interestingly I tried to save a ten mile journey a while ago by buying an oil filter in the local small car shop. The first one he bought out was a name that I'd never heard of so I refused it. He said no problem and offered another well known brand. I didn't really look hard at the second filter until I arrived home. Then I found it was actually a make that just "sounded" like the well known brand...even the packaging was very similar to theirs. Very very crafty indeed. And you've guessed it...no valve in this "copy" filter. Needless to say I didn't fit it and returned it to the shop.>>
Later on in the thread on that forum Halfords gave permission for their reply on the subject to be posted on the web, they said...
<<< Halfords oil and air filters are made by Sogefi Filtration, Europe's largest filter manufacturer
- Sogefi have factories all over Europe and own the top 3 brands sales wise in the UK - Fram,Coopers and Crossland
- They are OE to most vehicle manufacturers in Europe. A Halfords filter in most cases will be identical to the OE. eg A Ford oil filter and a Halfords oil filter are identical apart from the colour.
- No filter manufacturer makes every single filter they sell. Much intertrading is done as it is just not economical to tool up for everything.
- In common with all filter manufacturers there will be the odd difference in size etc but to no noticable detriment to the
filters performance. This is called rationalisation eg one manufacture may have say 4 part numbers for a Golf and another covers it with 2 . For a Fiesta it will be the other way round depending on who was OE when the vehicle was in production.
- As Halfords have chosen Europes largest filter manufacturer as a supplier we should be an exact match more times than we are not, no-one will be 100%
- Champion are are relatively small UK player with just one Italian factory. The success of the spark plugs making Champion a well known brand to the general public is the only reason we stock the filters. They are not widely stocked in motor factors supplying the garage trade.>>>
To be honest I think the problem is more likely a mistake in the fitment choice rather than a basic problem with this or that make filter.
I buy a huge amount of oil filters, many for XUD engines, and have never had any problems with Purflux, Fram, Champion, Halfords, Motaquip, Coopers, Crossland, Unipart, makers OE and others.
David
<<Really worrying this. Many times in the past when folks have chuntered on about non-OE filters (missing the valves or being poor quality) I've said keep to a known aftermarket brand and you'll be OK...so no need to worry about a manufacturers one every time.
Also I've supported Halfords quality for two reasons. They are no two bit company and also I have a contact in their buying department who has chatted about their sources which seem mostly top quality.
Personally I would be very interested to hear what Halfords would say if you put these points to their management. I can't think they would knowingly sell oil filters that would damage any engine...the publicity would be too negative.
Interestingly I tried to save a ten mile journey a while ago by buying an oil filter in the local small car shop. The first one he bought out was a name that I'd never heard of so I refused it. He said no problem and offered another well known brand. I didn't really look hard at the second filter until I arrived home. Then I found it was actually a make that just "sounded" like the well known brand...even the packaging was very similar to theirs. Very very crafty indeed. And you've guessed it...no valve in this "copy" filter. Needless to say I didn't fit it and returned it to the shop.>>
Later on in the thread on that forum Halfords gave permission for their reply on the subject to be posted on the web, they said...
<<< Halfords oil and air filters are made by Sogefi Filtration, Europe's largest filter manufacturer
- Sogefi have factories all over Europe and own the top 3 brands sales wise in the UK - Fram,Coopers and Crossland
- They are OE to most vehicle manufacturers in Europe. A Halfords filter in most cases will be identical to the OE. eg A Ford oil filter and a Halfords oil filter are identical apart from the colour.
- No filter manufacturer makes every single filter they sell. Much intertrading is done as it is just not economical to tool up for everything.
- In common with all filter manufacturers there will be the odd difference in size etc but to no noticable detriment to the
filters performance. This is called rationalisation eg one manufacture may have say 4 part numbers for a Golf and another covers it with 2 . For a Fiesta it will be the other way round depending on who was OE when the vehicle was in production.
- As Halfords have chosen Europes largest filter manufacturer as a supplier we should be an exact match more times than we are not, no-one will be 100%
- Champion are are relatively small UK player with just one Italian factory. The success of the spark plugs making Champion a well known brand to the general public is the only reason we stock the filters. They are not widely stocked in motor factors supplying the garage trade.>>>
To be honest I think the problem is more likely a mistake in the fitment choice rather than a basic problem with this or that make filter.
I buy a huge amount of oil filters, many for XUD engines, and have never had any problems with Purflux, Fram, Champion, Halfords, Motaquip, Coopers, Crossland, Unipart, makers OE and others.
David
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by D J Woollard</i>
Personally I would be very interested to hear what Halfords would say if you put these points to their management. I can't think they would knowingly sell oil filters that would damage any engine...the publicity would be too negative.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I've thought about this & decided to write to Halfords about it. The old filter should still be in the bin, so if its easily retrievable I'll clean it up with some petrol and have a look to see if there's obviously anything wrong with it.
To be fair, I've never had this problem with any other oil filter of any make (including Champion), so I think its this particular one that's faulty. I've used this same part number Champion filter on the Xantia before with no problems.
Nick
P.S. Are you the same David Woollard who writes the BX column in the Citroen Car Club magazine? If so, thanks for printing my letter again about the BX losing power on left hand bends problem - glad it helped[:)]
Personally I would be very interested to hear what Halfords would say if you put these points to their management. I can't think they would knowingly sell oil filters that would damage any engine...the publicity would be too negative.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I've thought about this & decided to write to Halfords about it. The old filter should still be in the bin, so if its easily retrievable I'll clean it up with some petrol and have a look to see if there's obviously anything wrong with it.
To be fair, I've never had this problem with any other oil filter of any make (including Champion), so I think its this particular one that's faulty. I've used this same part number Champion filter on the Xantia before with no problems.
Nick
P.S. Are you the same David Woollard who writes the BX column in the Citroen Car Club magazine? If so, thanks for printing my letter again about the BX losing power on left hand bends problem - glad it helped[:)]
Hello Nick,
Yes one and the same.
Sometimes have to tread with care on the forums in case of any conflicts!!
My point about the "Halfords/Champion" filter is that it is possible a customer has made the wrong choice, a member of staff has advised the wrong fitment, the one in the box is wrong (customer, staff or factory packing fault) or even their listing is wrong. In my opinion all these are more likely than a deliberate cost cutting exercise from Halfords.
As confirmation of this "single factory-several brands" idea I've bought an aftermarket make filter for a ZX TD and opened the box to find a genuine Purflux inside!
I must admit I do lean towards the OE types but have no qualms if they are not available and any of the makes I mentioned have to be used.
First step for your filter is to see what the part number is when you recover it from the bin.
David
Yes one and the same.
Sometimes have to tread with care on the forums in case of any conflicts!!
My point about the "Halfords/Champion" filter is that it is possible a customer has made the wrong choice, a member of staff has advised the wrong fitment, the one in the box is wrong (customer, staff or factory packing fault) or even their listing is wrong. In my opinion all these are more likely than a deliberate cost cutting exercise from Halfords.
As confirmation of this "single factory-several brands" idea I've bought an aftermarket make filter for a ZX TD and opened the box to find a genuine Purflux inside!
I must admit I do lean towards the OE types but have no qualms if they are not available and any of the makes I mentioned have to be used.
First step for your filter is to see what the part number is when you recover it from the bin.
David
Hello David,
I've retrieved it from the wheelie bin and washed it in a bowl of turps outside the back door, my neighbours were watching from their bedroom window, I think their opinion of me has sunk even lower
[:D][:o)][:D]
Its Champion part number F 118, if that rings any bells?
I'm pretty sure its the same one I've used before on the XUD, but I'll check in the book next time I'm passing Halfords.
Regards,
Nick
I've retrieved it from the wheelie bin and washed it in a bowl of turps outside the back door, my neighbours were watching from their bedroom window, I think their opinion of me has sunk even lower
[:D][:o)][:D]
Its Champion part number F 118, if that rings any bells?
I'm pretty sure its the same one I've used before on the XUD, but I'll check in the book next time I'm passing Halfords.
Regards,
Nick
This is a blast from the past.
I thought I was imagining things when this sort of thing happened with an old sierra I had 5-6 years ago, that to was a champion filter although in fairness I have used champion many times with no problems.
Had to change oil after 1000miles due to sump plug dripping and put on halfords own filter without anymore problems.
The symptoms were on start-up the light would go out straight away then a second or to later would flicker a couple of times in quick succsession, whilst the cam went clack clack a couple of times,which any who has had pinto engine will know what I mean.
I thought I was imagining things when this sort of thing happened with an old sierra I had 5-6 years ago, that to was a champion filter although in fairness I have used champion many times with no problems.
Had to change oil after 1000miles due to sump plug dripping and put on halfords own filter without anymore problems.
The symptoms were on start-up the light would go out straight away then a second or to later would flicker a couple of times in quick succsession, whilst the cam went clack clack a couple of times,which any who has had pinto engine will know what I mean.
-
Kowalski
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<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by nick</i>
Its Champion part number F 118,
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
The Haynes BOL recommends a Champion F104 for most of the engines in the Xantia
Its Champion part number F 118,
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
The Haynes BOL recommends a Champion F104 for most of the engines in the Xantia
-
Jon
When you can buy the proper Purflux or Mann one for £2.94 INC VAT, why pay more for something thats not original and genuine?
If I'm buying a Citroen and open the bonnet and its got a white or orange oil filter I generally walk away.But I am quite fanatical.[:I]
I am very pleased to say that my ZX has only ever had a Purlux oil filter, changed every 6000 miles since brand new. Now at 134,000 miles its still a lovely quiet engine that uses no oil. [:)]
I quite agree that much consolidation has taken place in the Filters market recently, with various takeovers and mergers. Its very possible that the majority of oil filters are one and the same and produced in the same factory, then just painted and branded accordingly.
If I'm buying a Citroen and open the bonnet and its got a white or orange oil filter I generally walk away.But I am quite fanatical.[:I]
I am very pleased to say that my ZX has only ever had a Purlux oil filter, changed every 6000 miles since brand new. Now at 134,000 miles its still a lovely quiet engine that uses no oil. [:)]
I quite agree that much consolidation has taken place in the Filters market recently, with various takeovers and mergers. Its very possible that the majority of oil filters are one and the same and produced in the same factory, then just painted and branded accordingly.
On the subject of oil filters, this site is well worth a visit.. http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilters.html
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jon</i>
When you can buy the proper Purflux or Mann one for £2.94 INC VAT, why pay more for something thats not original and genuine?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
...because my nearest GSF branch is 45 miles away over the other side of the Humber Bridge, £2.60 toll each way, plus the cost of 2 gallons of diesel !
What I usually do is buy a large number of filters from GSF at a time when I'm either visiting a branch or ordering something else & paying postage anyway. Unfortunately it was a while since I'd done this & my stock of filters had completely run out, so I just bought one from Halfords.
However, if GSF could be persuaded to open a branch in Hull.......[;)]
Nick
When you can buy the proper Purflux or Mann one for £2.94 INC VAT, why pay more for something thats not original and genuine?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
...because my nearest GSF branch is 45 miles away over the other side of the Humber Bridge, £2.60 toll each way, plus the cost of 2 gallons of diesel !
What I usually do is buy a large number of filters from GSF at a time when I'm either visiting a branch or ordering something else & paying postage anyway. Unfortunately it was a while since I'd done this & my stock of filters had completely run out, so I just bought one from Halfords.
However, if GSF could be persuaded to open a branch in Hull.......[;)]
Nick
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Kowalski</i>
The Haynes BOL recommends a Champion F104 for most of the engines in the Xantia
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
That's interesting, I'll certainly check again what the book in Halfords says.
Nick
The Haynes BOL recommends a Champion F104 for most of the engines in the Xantia
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
That's interesting, I'll certainly check again what the book in Halfords says.
Nick
Just had a look in Halfords today, and Champion F 118 is definitely the one they recommend for the Xantia TD (and almost all other Citroens/Peugeots).
F 104 doesn’t appear to exist anymore, or if it does, Halfords don’t sell it. Their stock jumps straight from part number F103 to F105.
Looks as though I got a duff filter then.
Nick
F 104 doesn’t appear to exist anymore, or if it does, Halfords don’t sell it. Their stock jumps straight from part number F103 to F105.
Looks as though I got a duff filter then.
Nick