C5 X7 steering rack - the final reckoning!!

[Stickyfinger]

C5 1 and 2.....scrap the car if the rear bearing go ?

The cars are not really comparable, as different as a CX is to a XM I would think.

[GiveMeABreak]

C5 1 and 2.....scrap the car if the rear bearing go ?
The cars are not really comparable, as different as a CX is to a XM I would think.

I would say bearings are in a different category really, like discs and pads - as with anything generating friction they'll wear out sooner or later. They were thinking about keeping tabs on the X7 rack issue on the CCC IIRC a while back.

[Stickyfinger]

They were thinking about keeping tabs on the X7 rack issue on the CCC IIRC a while back.

yeh.....does that sort of thing ever happen.

[white exec]

I wonder whether cars are now being built absolutely not to last for double-digit years, but to get through warranty without hassle for either owner, dealer or manufacturer. Thereafter, a few more years of not-to-troublesome running (dealers also get involved in "Used"), but, after 8 or so years, the quicker it all falls apart the better. This feeds both Used and New markets. Spares, certainly as far as PSA goes, also evaporate after 10 years.

Because of the general reliability during warranty and for a small number of years afterwards, owners tend not to give any thought to underbody and cavity protection, believing the manufacturers' claims to have given their latest cars the last word in treatment.

And so it goes. Eventually, some of the more interesting cars end up in the hands of enthusiasts - like us - who enjoy our new (and previously unaffordable) toys and run them for a few more years. Finally, it is realised there is something nasty going on underneath, and talk moves on to thoughts of welding and patching up. I always find it depressing seeing pictures in our forums of crumbling sills and lacework corners. Who let this happen, for heaven's sake?

Old cars were, in general, never meant to be, any more than old washing machines or refrigerators. Just now and then, a manufacturer gets it 'wrong', with companies like Bosch, and sometimes Sony, often making goods that just go on and on. Which is why I buy Bosch, and Sony.

It's also the reason why our cars were wax-treated almost from new. The XM is twenty years old this year, with 105k miles on the clock, and totally rust-free.

[Sloppysod]

Help - Now I am worried

How do we know a rack is on its way out? The problem centurus2400 had originally was a leak, mine is dry.
However, my 2011, X7 hasn't reached 50,000 miles yet, which is good for the engine but not so good for the rest as it has probably been standing around for a while. Anyway, when driving I feel a little stiffness when turning from the straight ahead position - have I got problems brewing?

What is the best way to protect against failure?

Have I read somewhere on the FCF that the face-lifted cars (post 2010) had a different rack or am I just dreaming again?

[GiveMeABreak]

Old cars were, in general, never meant to be, any more than old washing machines or refrigerators. Just now and then, a manufacturer gets it 'wrong', with companies like Bosch, and sometimes Sony, often making goods that just go on and on. Which is why I buy Bosch, and Sony.

I used to think that Chris - but now on the 4th replacement Bosch Iron due to leaking under replacement warranty(£80 a pop) and as far as Sony go their BluRay hardware is good, but let down by sub-standard software, with few updates, rendering the system almost unusable

It's also the reason why our cars were wax-treated almost from new. The XM is twenty years old this year, with 105k miles on the clock, and totally rust-free.
100% agree with that, I remember my father buying a brand spanking new Ford Cortina 2.0 GL in Germany when they were just out in the 70s and the first thing he did was get it Ziebart treated.

[GiveMeABreak]

Help - Now I am worried

How do we know a rack is on its way out? The problem centurus2400 had originally was a leak, mine is dry.
However, my 2011, X7 hasn't reached 50,000 miles yet, which is good for the engine but not so good for the rest as it has probably been standing around for a while. Anyway, when driving I feel a little stiffness when turning from the straight ahead position - have I got problems brewing?

What is the best way to protect against failure?

Have I read somewhere on the FCF that the face-lifted cars (post 2010) had a different rack or am I just dreaming again?

I'll have a check on the rack numbers Stu, I'm sure I did for somebody else and they were the same as mine..
I'll be looking at seeing the best way to get at the pinion without getting the undershield off and all that - may be through removing the steering column floor panel. Will be checking they greased it up when I get round to it. The warning sign for me was ultimately a Suspension Warning Error on the Dash. By this time fluid must of been leaking slowly for some time. Hadn't noticed it because the area where I park is full of chippings and previous various oil / fluid spells - so I never noticed - and of course I forgot to put on the list the crankshaft oil leak too - so that had probably added to the mix!

[GiveMeABreak]

Have I read somewhere on the FCF that the face-lifted cars (post 2010) had a different rack or am I just dreaming again?

These are some of the PSa part Nos and the replacement Part Numbers, with the year and engine of the models I checked. The last 2, although having different PSA part Nos but have the same replacement Part. The earlier 2008 2.2 does have a different replacement though - that's all I have to check on at present.

4001 60 Now RP 98 013 814 80 (2008 2.2)
4001 W3 Now RP 98 014 154 80 Jan 2011 (2.0 163)
4001 65 Now RP 98 014 154 80 Mar 2008 (2.0 138)

[Sloppysod]

I'll have a check on the rack numbers Stu, I'm sure I did for somebody else and they were the same as mine.

Thanks Marc,
Car details are "C5 (X7) 4 DOOR SALOON 2.0 HDi 163 PEF (DW10CTED4) 6-SPEED AUTOMATIC GEARBOX" RPO 12489 Build date 18/01/2011

According to my VIN number my rack part number is RP 98 014 154 80 which is a later rack and does not match the PRO Number range - see below Confused!!

if I take the VIN filter off we get this, so............I may not have been dreaming!!

RP 98 014 332 80 - TRAVEL MECHANISM STEERING 184 UNTIL RPO 13082
RP 98 014 154 80 - 180 STEERING MECHANISM TRAVEL UNTIL RPO 13096
RP 98 014 154 80 - 180 STEERING MECHANISM TRAVEL SINCE RPO 13097

[centurus2400]

Steering rack issues aside the X7 is , in my opinion, a fantastic car.
I've driven Citroens of one flavour or another for the last 30 years and I think the X7 is the best of them.
That is why I decided to spend the money and get it fixed properly as I want to enjoy it for a good few years yet.

All cars have their weak spots, the perfect motor has not yet been built.
The servicing bills for my brothers Jaguar would bring tears to a glass eye!!

[GiveMeABreak]

I do love X7 as a car, and I do intend to keep her, I just haven't as many things go since the days of my GS and the constant CV joint replacements. I would certainly recommend a Citroen extended warranty for anyone looking for one from Citroen Approved (if they can be found) with under 70k on the clock, for some peace of mind.

[Filberton]

Just to put another side, the steering rack on my '08 C5 X7 started to weep from the column connection. My local non-Citroen guy offered me a new rack for £1,000 or reconditioned rack at £600 and fitted this together with doing an MOT and a couple of minor service bits for £950 all in. I can't really complain with over 140,000 on the clock.
I'm told the problem is on the original rack the pinion bearing is recessed so that at an angle of entry both water and grit can build up destroying the seal. The later racks were modified to either raise or add a seal so the water and grit could not build up. This explains the easy pre-emptive fix of packing with grease to stop water and grit sitting on the seal.

p.s. I'm happy my guy knows his stuff as not only is he out of the way so no passing trade but in their spare time they build Formula X race cars, restore classics from minis to Alvis and Astons. They use computers not let computers use them.

[GiveMeABreak]

Well you seem to have had better mileage out of your X7 before the rack went. Mine went in less than half that mileage, but alas there are probably X7 owners out there who are not aware (and why would they be) of the issue until it goes wrong. By the time they notice the leak it's usually too late. Thanks for the update though, interesting regarding the mod.

[Homer]

Well you seem to have had better mileage out of your X7 before the rack went. Mine went in less than half that mileage, but alas there are probably X7 owners out there who are not aware (and why would they be) of the issue until it goes wrong. By the time they notice the leak it's usually too late.

Reading various Citroen forums when mine first went I did come across one who ended up needing a new pump as well due to it running dry.

My car was delivered back to me on Friday, along with a rather large bill
The work was done by my local indy, but I'd decided that, as I want to keep the car for some time, I'd go with genuine replacement parts.

My local indy flatly refused to order one from Citroen on the grounds that the reconditioning came with a 2 year warranty, and a good job it did although it may be that the 2nd leak was in fact the seals which went completely a few months later.

I will not be rushing to buy an X7. If this Forum has taught me nothing else, it is that is most certainly a car to avoid. Oh yes.
Discuss.

If it's a later version or the rack has been done I don't see a problem. At least topping up the DPF additive didn't cost me £800 like it did for the 807.

[demag]

Just as an aside, the Kia Owners Club played up merry hell and applied incredible pressure on Kia when the Venga had a serious software problem. On a warm day the 1.4 crdi version would lose so much power it became dangerous to drive. Kia really struggled to sort this apparently simple problem (after finally admitting there was a problem). So much so that they stopped producing the car! They reintroduced it using the 1.6 crdi Cee'd engine. So yes people power does work.

Sent from my Wileyfox Swift using Tapatalk