Berlingo drive shaft oil seal replacement advice please.

[van ordinaire]

Yup, because, bizarely, that's what was listed for one side - it's also about £10 cheaper! It WAS fine, but just noticed on getting C15 back from having clutch done, that it's leaking BUT recommended practise is to replace them when changing driveshafts.

[jgra1]

I was reading a haynes manual at weekend and there was a top tip!!

involved a block of wood (with a hole in) and a shaft, and a chain from it / to it to the lower arm.. it's a way of pulling the arm down to help with refitting the hub.. a good idea and as some of us have found- working alone with bottom joints is very annoying.

[cancunia]

Thanks for all the replies. I'm going to try take the old seal out today and see what it looks like, then order another. I'm in no major rush to get it done as I'd planned to have the Berlingo off the road in May for other work so a couple of days won't matter too much. I think it was rushing to get the strut back in place that caused this problem so I'll take my time. From what I've read here and elsewhere, it seems that the seals are a 'one time' fit and don't like to be re-used.

[van ordinaire]

Replacement every time IS best pracise - but they say the same about front diff oil seals on Cherokees, something I've never done in all the 1/2-shafts I've refitted.

If, like me, you have the misfortune to shred a boot on a recent driveshaft, you'll probably get away with it, especially if it's not one of the simple rubber ones AND a great deal of care is used. So, up to a point, it will depend on circumstances.

b-t-w, anyone shed light on the huge price disparity, side-to-side, supplier-to-supplier? Are the £12 ones really 6 times better than the £2 ones?

[cancunia]

After ages getting the wishbone off the hub, I got the shaft and oil seal out and have ordered a new seal from CP4L. The one I ordered has a nylon cage to help guide the shaft in and is 40x58x11.3 like the original as opposed to the usual replacements that are 40x58x10. It was a bit more expensive that a normal oils seal, about £6 as opposed to £3 but as it's the first time I've done this I thought I'd go for some extra help. The shaft had very sharp edges, even though there's a 45 deg chamfer on the end, so I've smoothed it with a bit of emery.
When the shaft first came out by accidentally tilting the hub outwards while trying to get the strut back in place I pushed it back in quickly to stop the oil leaking out, it must have come out far enough to catch the seal edge on the way back in. Hopefully with the wishbone off and the driveshaft hub nut loose I can avoid that on the way back.

[RichardW]

10mm thick is the size listed on service.citroen - I can't find them at all on C4PL - you did better than me! Normally only the OS seal comes with a nylon protector - this is because the hole in the seal is the same size as the splines on the end, whereas the NS the sealing surface is much larger, so much less likely to knick it with the end of the shaft. With a new seal, it will take quite a bit of push to get the shaft past the seal - make sure you hold it square. It should then hold itself in whilst you reconnect the hub.

[cancunia]

10mm thick is the size listed on service.citroen - I can't find them at all on C4PL

Yep, that size is listed in a few places for example on catcar.info so I'm sure you're correct on that score. If I had a bit more confidence and experience on driveshafts I'd have taken the 10mm but as this is my first and hopefully last for a while, I'm being extra cautious.
The search on CP4L is not 100% effective, so I tend to use the ECP website then copy / paste the part number into CP4L. At the moment there are regular weekend discounts on both CP4L & GSF so for a while at least it's to the customer's advantage.

[van ordinaire]

All v. odd. I have, literally, just abandoned my order from CP4L because (a) I couldn't find an oil seal (thought I'd throw it in for good measure with the filters I want - see elswhere) & (b) despite keep being told there's a 12% discount this weekend - I was never given an opportunity to enter the code!

Might go back to it later - try a different route OR might just go somewhere else, really am getting sick to death of suppliers making it as difficult as possible to buy anything from them. e.g. I did go back to where I got the clutch - carpartking, or somesuch BUT when I enter registration No: they will only list clutch kits! So they've joined GSF on my boycot list!

All right, I give up! Since posting the above, I've done some more research (not shopping, as I'd hoped):ECP only list a n/s seal - which looks like an o/s.

Mister Auto list 4, 2 with cages, but don't specify application + 2 without, one for each side.

GSF do list the correct one (although the n/s one looks the same!), but (1) it's an eye watering £11-odd, (2) I won't deal with them & (3) absent any eqivalents listing, their part No: is useless.

How/why is this so difficult???

[cancunia]

I've ordered from cp4l using the ecp part number which shows the correct size for the ns seal. Hopefully that's what I'll get. Strange you couldn't see the place to enter the code, it's on the shopping trolley page iirc. Gsf have a 52% off code this weekend, but the normal prices do seem high so I hardly ever buy there during the week.

A quick update re GSF, they do indeed show the seal and as noted above there's no knowing where it's made. I have asked them before for manufacturers reference numbers which they've declined to reveal but they did agree to confirm / deny the part number was correct when I was buying a strut bearing, I seem to recall that they did confirm the manufacturer name in similar circumstances when no maker was shown. The secrecy makes no real sense to me.
With their 52% discount, they are the cheapest supplier of gearbox oil that I could find though.

[van ordinaire]

I thought I'd follow your advice BUT, as I mentioned, ECP don't list an o/s oil seal - so couldn't get the part No:

It seems like I might not need an oil seal now, because it's stopped leaking AND discovered the gearbox had been overfilled; how, I can't imagine!

Ordered the other stuff from CP4L (except the engine mount, which they don't list) without the discount, of course. I imediately e-mailed them threatening them with Advertising AND Trading Standards if they don't do something.

B-t-w, later last night, I ventured onto the Norauto site &, as far as I could work out, the left seal is more expensive, & bigger than the right but you have to go to a store to be sure of getting the right one.

Cheapest place for oil is Smith & Allan, in Darlington who, if you buy on ebay, do it for a little under £20 for 5 litres (curiously if you go to their website, it's a couple of quid more.) If you want a brand (I think it's Total) I was put onto a place I didn't know by someone on the forum - the details of which I can't now recall, but can, probably, find - but they were out-of-stock when I wanted it & didn't think I could wait a week.

[cancunia]

The oilseal from CP4L & oil from GSF both arrived in today's post, just waiting for some dry weather to get things back together.
In case anyone is curious, the ECP / CP4L (left side) seal is Elring part 128.250

GSF confirmed via webchat the following brands for their seals:
Left - 311PC0020 AUTOMOTOR
Right - 311PC0030 ELRING

The Elring seal for the right side is probably part 505.090 which is a PTFE based seal according to GSF and Elring (depending on how you search for it). If so, it needs a fair amount of care to install.
https://www.elring.de/fileadmin/Dateiab ... E_RWDR.pdf

[van ordinaire]

Good luck, when the weather improves. At least you've got the easier side to do.

Seems like I've got away with it - but I'll have a closer look when I do an oil change, when I get home.

[Peter.N.]

I don't know if it has a similar set up to the XM but I had that happen once and it was because the shaft hadn't gone right into the diff, I think there is a snap ring there and mine hadn't 'snapped'.

Peter

[cancunia]

I don't know if it has a similar set up to the XM but I had that happen once and it was because the shaft hadn't gone right into the diff, I think there is a snap ring there and mine hadn't 'snapped'.

Peter

I got mine back together this morning, there was a distinct click when I put the shaft into the diff. It happened both times, the first time being a test to see how it went together before putting the new oilseal in, there's a groove at the end of the spline so am guessing that's where it gets held.