Help with smokink DW8 Xsara after Head Gasket change

[citroenxm]

If its continued smokeing then no it wont be.. but a plug can cause smoke on startup but should clear after a moment.. so most unlikely..

[oscar]

How about a slightly bent valve? that sticks from time to time and would wear valve stem. as if it's had a belt before or messed about with and someones ham fisted it and tagged valve with piston when moving pulleys and not locked them.
We had one on a rover before it would run ok but every so often would run rough as erm someone never bothered to find out valve timings/settings for K series (twin cam) where you time off the mark then bring back onto it like he should have so bent valves.The BOL does have some uses if not much?
Did you use engineers blue when you ground them in the valve seats?.
Or could it be a pump problem with sticking internals we had that on a lorry before you'd run with pedal down (was ok on part throttle)and it would suddenly start to petter out like running on 3(6 cylinder)like when your puling stop cord then it would pick up sim to like got air in system.A bit worrying when on M'way took me ages to get back to london from yorks but road was quiet Xmas eve night.even for M1.Had a blow out on front left tyre on way up on top of manchester shipping canal bridge on M6 boy thats high!
Or a duff injector not spraying correctly(take out and test them on jig)
Anyway on way back stopped at farm My uncle whose good mech said to me it's pump it's in the rack inside where it's metered was wonky! anyway got back to yard said about it but they said no changed lift pump anyway other driver whose it was said it was still doing it when i asked him next time i saw him said they'd changed pump and it was flying now.

[Stewart(oily)]

I would move on to a compression test now. and stop carrying that engine around

[jgra1]

[Gibbo2286]

I did the head on one of these and it smoked terribly after, I could see no reason for it so took it down a quiet lane and drove it up and down fast in low gear for half an hour, the smoke cleared and the car has been fine ever since. Must have been spillings in the exhaust system burning off.

However white smoke smelling of unburned diesel suggests to me that the pump timing is out.

[Jaf]

I did some engine reconditioning at work, years ago. Not the best garage ever (never heard of engineers blue for lapping in the valves!). Anyway the engines would often be smokey for a while, bits of gunge get where they shouldn't, but would clear after a good run. The worst were engines where the valve stem oil seals were changed in situ, the exhaust could take a few hundred miles to clear, big clouds of smoke.

[oscar]

Hi the other thing thought about could it have a crack in head between pre and combustion chamber on one cylinder as once running for while would be heated up by then so then don't need heat then as remember Fraud tranny york diesels suffered that problem.
Like when you have a heater plug dead and take it they all work correctly.
Had one go it looked ok but had atiny slit by tip like pin hole.
And you have tried injectors so don't look like dripping/leaking ones or poor spray patterns.
One other thing is fuel has he put veg oil init neat? or non de script? or heating oil even as that causes problems as i knew someone that had a Fraud Festa van that ran on something? but it stank like a old cargo ship phew if behind kept windows up.

[xsaras4ever]

Hello all ,

did valve clearances (thanks Stewart) and got them as good as is humanely possible.

Smoked still.

Did a compressions test

1 - 400 kg
2 - 400 kg
3 - 400 kg
4 - 420 kg

Not a major difference - is that roughly the correct amount of compression for a DW8 ?

Its so much like a timing problem , but have checked the flywheel, cam and pump 3 times now and its perfect.

A previous post says you cant play with the sprocket on the injection pump - any ideas folks ?

Dont know if its worth a mention - probably confuse the issue - but 2 heater plugs were quite oily - yet the car starts easily even though it doesn't run evenly.

Help !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Its that horrible feeling when you know you are within touching distance of solving a problem but in desperation you get another engine and fit it so that you can move on - and then you always wonder if the engine you removed was damn near perfect.

[citroenxm]

It has to be residue in the exhaust after gasket failure.. nothng else for it. It can take a while to clear. If she starts on the button after heater light goes out its not timing.. it has to be exhasut residue..

[lexi]

If the cr figures are within 10per cent of each other I would leave it at that. If it was down on power and worn rings or bore was suspected then a wet test with oil down bores would confirm. If a valve was slightly bent that could cause sticking and oil control issues but it should show on CR test.........and it hasn't.
You could try a leak down test.

[oscar]

The only thing i can think of is valve seals/guides as common sign is smoking on start then clearing one sign we used to get esp on ford pinto's was when off throttle for while then boot it you'd get a burst of smoke from where it run down guides where it was pulling it in as throttle closed so a vacuum in chambers

[xsaras4ever]

Morning all from here in France and thanks for all the help.

We got cross with it .

We have taken on board the advice and fully re-assembled and driven the guts out of it.

Smoked terrible , then cleared.

Ran unevenly.

We ran it up to temperature until the fan cut in 5 times , it ran evenly.

Took it for a 20km burn , ran well , pulled well , a little bit faster than it used to be. Did not smoke under acceleration , even when going up hills.

Left it for an hour, started it , smoked for 5 seconds , then perfect.

Left it overnight, smoked terrible on startup, stank of diesel (rather like parafin actually), then cleared.

To recap - it has new head-gasket, new valve-stem oil seals, valves clearances have been set , shows good compression test.

Small crazy theory here .....
It always started on 3 and smoked, previous owner said it was like it for 2 years. We changed the injectors, no difference.

However, we did the compression test through the glowplug holes and number 4 was a pig to get off - in fact it was almost rounded. What if the previous owner had this problem so changed 3 glowplugs, not 4.
If number 4 plug was dead, it would start on three , push unburnt diesel out the exhaust and finally catch on 4.
Is that possible or just clutching at straws ?

[citroenxm]

Very very possibly indeed.. get a good quality set of four plugs in.

[xsaras4ever]

Hello again - this car is driving us mad.

It smokes on startup every morning - or if left unused for a few hours.

Normal suggestion would be valve stem oil seals , but they are new.

We have done 200km in it since doing gasket.

Not happy about glow plug theory because if it is not revved hard after startup it will misfire and smoke forever, never clears. A dodgy glowplug wouldn't matter after a very short time of running.


It sounds like a petrol engine that is hunting.

However , 1km up the road and it is perfect - only the sound of dead birds dropping of the telephone wires .


When warm, its a great car, drives really nicely.

Could it be a problem with the coldstart mechanism ?

It starts really easily - barely turns over before catching.

Getting really tired of it - tempted to buy a cheap xsara and swap engines.

Help !!!!!!!!!!

[citroenxm]

If you want a good engine that DOESN'T smoke, Ive got a HDi 90 engine in from a currently front ended Xantia...

If the engine is not wanted, Ill be stripping the fuel system and head off the car. However, if someone wants the engine Ill keep the fuel system but leave the head and block together..

It WILL be cheap too..