Xantia bouncy front suspension

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romie
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Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

Hey-up,

I wondered if I could pick a few brains.

The front suspension in my old 1996 Xantia 1.9TD Estate has just become all bouncy as if there is no dampening.
And it's just failed it's MOT due to below points:
- Centre front Fluid suspension unit leaking.
- Front lower Braking system leaking.

I've not had to look at the suspension side of this vehicle yet and so I'm a bit in the dark regarding the way it works. (Green ball things?).

This will be due to general wear and tear as I doubt anything has been touched on this aspect for at least 100k miles and she's behaved very well up till now. (bar having to replace o-rings in the hydraulic pump due to a leak).
Normally when I've had a leak, the big ol STOP light comes on and I just had to repair leak and re-fill reservoir. No effect on suspension.
This time, the fluid is not even low enough for the STOP light to light up.

Could anyone suggest the first, most obvious reason and cure? :/

Cheers most helpful and knowledgeable guys! :p

Romie
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by Xaccers »

The Centre front fluid suspension unit is most probably the pressure regulator which the accumulator sphere screws into.
Get the car up on high, with axle stands under the front jacking points, then set it on low, switch off and have a look under the front of the engine for where it is leaking.

Front lower braking system leaking could be your doseur valve on the bulkhead, in front of the driver behind the engine, quite often the return pipes pop off.

As for bouncy front, if it feel like it's on high and juddery, then the spheres have finally given up the ghost and need replacing.
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romie
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

Hey, thanks very much Xac! Such a fast response!!

Fantastic, I'll get under her and give her a good clean in these places to locate leaks..

Regarding Bouncy front, it's not like when it's on high and juddery.
It's all very soft and bouncy. When you push hard on front wing the car doesn't stop bouncing for a while. That sort of lack of dampening bouncy.
Rear suspension is ok when pushed down it just rises back up - correctly dampened.

hmm, I might be putting two and two together to make a dozen here.... Possibly the hydraulic leaks are not connected with the bouncy front end and they just happened to have both occurred together.
I think what I need to be asking is: Is the hydraulic system linked to the suspension dampening in anyway? Or does it just rise/lower the ground clearance?
And so is there a sealed dampening rod that I can service/replace or is it using a special French Citroen blood method of dampening?

There we go, I got there in the end eh? :)
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

... bit more info, the Xantia has done 240Kmiles
Cheers, romie
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by Xaccers »

Dampening is provided in the spheres themselves by the hole and discs.
While it is rare for them to go wrong, Jim has come across an old sphere that had been regassed over and over which was under dampened.
I would expect it is more likely to relate to the leak. It might be worth giving Martin at Pleiades a call today.
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

Aha, I just gave him a quick call. Nice guy!
Thanks, romie
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
Suzuki Bandit GSF400 1992 x 2
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

So the sphere does the spring and dampening side of the suspension.
Therefore lack of dampening would be either not enough hydraulic fluid or the hole/discs are warn inside front left and right spheres and so I just need to replace/service the two spheres either by myself or by someone like Pleiades who seemed very reasonable.

I do like doing the job myself though (hence chatting to the great guys on this forum!), So I'll probably look into where to get spheres next... I suppose new ones come pre-charged with gas yes?

Cheers, romie
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by CitroJim »

Oh yes, they do all come charged with gas! Thank goodness as it's not easy to pump them up to 50 odd bars...

I'd concur on weak damping elements in the old spheres and new ones should fix it a treat.

Both leak locations are very vague. Clean up, try to identify better the leaky items and if you can't then take pictures of them and we will :wink: And offer suggestion s on how to resolve the issues :)
Jim

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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

haha, Cheers CitroJim! :)

I was thinking some sort of steam cleaner to remove all the crud under there. (Is pretty nasty and baked on).
Does that sound like the right move, or should I just cover the whole area in Jizer degreaser?
Anyone found a great way of cleaning under and around the engine for the purposes of leak checking?

Cheers, romie
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
Suzuki Bandit GSF400 1992 x 2
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by CitroJim »

To be honest, as long as you're not allergic to it (as I am) then ordinary white spirit is a great degreaser and does not need to be washed away with water as the likes of Gunk and Jizer does. Also, white spirit is stupidly cheap from DIY shops.

Just paint it on with an old paint brush and if you can, blow it dry with an airline. For heavy accumulations of crud it may take two or three applications or until it comes clean...
Jim

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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

right'o, good plan. I'll do that! Many thanks :D

romie
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
Suzuki Bandit GSF400 1992 x 2
Mountain bike, skateboards, snowboards, surfboard, longboard and feet!
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

One thing to listen for is the regulator tick. All being well, it should be every minute or so. If it is less than 30 seconds the accumulator sphere probably needs changing.

If you need to replace any spheres look for Xac on the forum. He has, in his signature, a link to a DIY Sphere removal tool that I have made and used.
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

Hell Razor5543 wrote:One thing to listen for is the regulator tick. All being well, it should be every minute or so. If it is less than 30 seconds the accumulator sphere probably needs changing.

If you need to replace any spheres look for Xac on the forum. He has, in his signature, a link to a DIY Sphere removal tool that I have made and used.
Thanks Hell Razor5543,
That's good to know and I've checked out the Sphere removal tool on Xac's sig :)
So, I'm all set I suppose.

Would the two front left and right suspension spheres go at once?
I don't feel the car twisting and so wondered if one sphere lost it's dampening ability then the other would break due to the increased load quite quickly?

Cheers, romie
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
Suzuki Bandit GSF400 1992 x 2
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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by CitroJim »

You'd not really notice it that much on a different each side way Romie as the two sides are hydraulically interconnected. You'd just note an overall deterioration...

Xac's sphere tool works well but I managed to bend his on some biblically tight Activa spheres once but that thankfully is not a problem for you....

Don't forget to have a look at this guide on Sphere Changing and allied subjects...

Take particular note of the precautions and how to remove the rear corner spheres and anti-sink sphere... Their removal is not intuitive...
Jim

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Re: Xantia bouncy front suspension

Post by romie »

Sphere Changing Guide! nice!!

With the damping 'gone' in the front suspension, I'm bouncing around like I'm on one of em space hoppers.. Just a thought, is the rubber diaphragm in the spheres likely to break and cause me to have rock hard front suspension at some point?

..And so is this something I need to address sooner rather than later? :/

Cheers, romie
Citroen Xantia 1.9TD 1996 estate 100% veg 323k
Ford Transit Tourneo 2.5L Di 1999 165k
Yamaha R1 1999 26k
Kawasaki ZXR750 L1 1993 66k (to LPG?)
Suzuki Bandit GSF400 1992 x 2
Mountain bike, skateboards, snowboards, surfboard, longboard and feet!
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