replacement xantia required. Advice please.

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isisalar
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replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by isisalar »

I was first smitten with the Citroen bug by my 1.9d auto BX which was ideal for the London mini-cabbing I was doing at the time. I just loved the soft ride. This was followed by a 1.9d auto Xantia LX. Whilst this was no ball of fire it was even more ideal, with more space, the ride a little firmer than I would have liked but still acceptable.
My circumstances changed and an estate was needed so I bought a manual 1.9TD VSX about 4 years ago. I hate this car for various reasons but the main one is the suspension, far too jiggly at low speeds on poor surfaces. It's put me off hydractive suspension for life!
Said VSX is now on death row and needs to be changed pronto.
So what to get now? Still need an estate, must have a sunroof, diesel only, manual ok NO HYDRACTIVE SUSPENSION.
I would love an HDI but I believe they're all hydractive, with sunroof only on exclusives.
I've reached the tentative conclusion that a 1.9TD SX probably fits the bill but any other suggestions or advice gladly received.
I've also had dark thoughts about an automatic diesel XM estate! Too much of a hobby though. This car will be a working vehicle and needs to earn its keep.
Kind regards
Paul
J reg 1.9d auto BX first Citroen
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Mandrake »

No suggestions on what to get, but if your Hydractive car had a jiggly ride the suspension wasn't working properly. Either duff Hydractive regulator spheres or it was sticking in hard mode all the time.

Hydractive 2 Xantias (working properly) ride MUCH softer than standard Xantias. There is no comparison. Of course there are more things that can go wrong to prevent that softer ride from occurring...
Simon

1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White

2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Old-Guy »

If you were to go for a pre-96 (built before Feb 96) 1.9TD sx estate, you would get a sunroof (instead of A/C), basic 6-sphere hydraulics, no engine ECU (the only ECU is for the ABS) and no EGR. No need for a Lexia (problems with the ABS are usually down to dirty/corroded contacts).

And it would run on veggie, bio-diesel or blend.
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Citroenmad »

Im pretty sure your dislike for hydractive is due to the fact your VSX will have stiffer anti roll bars than a hatchback due to it being an estate. Keep this in mind as your looking for another estate ... you can always fit hatchback ones. Hydractives give a better ride, if they are working as they should.

The sunroof is going to be your downfall, as a HDI estate in LX or SX form would be superb. The HDi 110 is quieter, more economical and more responsive than the 1.9TD.
Chris
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

Hello isisalar,

Just to let you know, the Xantia HDi cars do have the same range of models as the others. This means that you can have the basic suspension setup, or the Hydractive option. My Xantia HDi, Gracie, only has 6 spheres, whereas Hydractive cars need 8 (and the Activa needs 10).

I cannot speak for the optional extras (sunroof, etc). However, if I had the choice I would go for a 110HP HDi Xantia, it has better performance and economy than the 90HP HDi (in my opinion).
Last edited by Hell Razor5543 on 21 Oct 2012, 20:49, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Citroenmad »

Hell Razor5543 wrote:Hello isisalar,

Just to let you know, the Xantia HDi cars do have the same range of models as the others. This means that you can have the basic suspension setup, or the Hydractive option. My Xantia HDi, Gracie, only has 6 spheres, whereas Hydractive cars need 8 (and the Activa needs 10).

I cannot speak for the optional extras (sunroof, etc).
Quite right, only the S1 VSX and S2 Exclusive are hydractives. However, sunroof is only standard on Exclusive in S2, which it would need to be if HDI
Chris
07 Citroen C6 V6 HDi Exclusive - Red
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by citroenxm »

No, DONT get an S2 Exclusive... Get an S2 SX with standard "Normal" citroen suspension, no sunroof and a HDi 110 engine.

I have an exclusive and while it works its still CRAP! I hate hydractive.. Theres no need for it. A citroen should float, and NOT have hard suspension or a system that needs switching to hard.. Why????

Why should you need to be piddleing around with diodes and electro valves to get a soft ride when an SX with comfort spheres is EXACTLEY what you should have..
Sharing a pug 207 1.6 hdi Sw 16v.
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Citroenmad »

No No No, I simply will never agree with you Paul! :lol:

Hydractive should give a better ride than a non hydractive. Its that balance between a floaty ride and a controlled ride. You float over the bumps but in corners and very undualting roads it has the control which is so nice to have, better corning, less roll and a more damped ride. As someone who enjoys pressing on while driving, a hydractive does nothing for me, it floats about, rolls in the bends and is uncontrolled - this makes me travel sick as a passenger and gives an uninvolved drive as a driver.

I love the fact that you can waft along in a hydractive XM or Xantia and when the road gets twisty, hit the sport mode and the suspension becomes more responsive, its a joy to flow from corner to corner at speed without even knowing about it.

I HATE comfort spheres, they purely reduce damping. You do not want to fiddle with damping, you want to raise the gas in the spheres, to give a softer ride but with the same damping. Hydractives do suit comfort spheres better than non-hydractives but only on the corner spheres, if you really must fit them.

If you increase the sphere pressures slightly on a hydractive and have the hydrative working as it should, then the ride will be totally superb and unmatched by anything you can do to a non-hydractive. There can be no arguing with that.

As I said, its the stiff anti roll bars which make the jittery ride on individual bumps.

A non-hydracive Xantia does not interest me, not when there are hydractives which are superior, in my opinion. I only wish more C5s had proper hydractive, I would probably like mine so much more if it had.
Chris
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by citroenxm »

I dont buy a Citroen for a controlled cornering Car... I buy them for Floating rides, like DS and CX..

Its just an unfortunate thing that crap-r-active is fitted to the XM and Top Xantias..

On XM's I also fit soft comfort spheres.. I dont care for body roll, its fun. I drove Renault 9's and Visa's when I first passed my test and they rolled and its brilliant! They also STICK in the corners too...

So no, chris, Agree to disagree, crap-r-active is a BIG NO NO for me...
Last edited by citroenxm on 21 Oct 2012, 21:40, edited 2 times in total.
Sharing a pug 207 1.6 hdi Sw 16v.
M reg Xm 2.1 td auto exclusive S2 269k and rising
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A very sad...
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Northern_Mike

Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Northern_Mike »

citroenxm wrote:No, DONT get an S2 Exclusive... Get an S2 SX with standard "Normal" citroen suspension, no sunroof and a HDi 110 engine.

I have an exclusive and while it works its still CRAP!
I'm sorry, this is nonsense. I counted up the other day, and I worked out I've had every model of Xantia apart from a 90 HDi or a Petrol Estate.

The HDI Exclusive rides the best out of all of them, and they've all been in fine working order. Yours mustn't have been working properly..
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by citroenxm »

I just Dont need extra electronics and valves to encourage more leaks, and things to go wrong..

Theres NOTHING wrong with the original incarnation of the suspension system.

My electro valve DO work properly, they click in and hummm for the correct set times... They ARE working.. I just dont like it, and its not as soft as my original SX Xantia I had..

But if you want leather as standard, you have to have it... Or rip it out of an exclusive and fit it to an SX..
Sharing a pug 207 1.6 hdi Sw 16v.
M reg Xm 2.1 td auto exclusive S2 269k and rising
L reg XM V6 12v SEi auto .. Light project

A very sad...
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Northern_Mike »

Citroenmad wrote:No No No, I simply will never agree with you Paul! :lol:

Hydractive should give a better ride than a non hydractive. Its that balance between a floaty ride and a controlled ride. You float over the bumps but in corners and very undualting roads it has the control which is so nice to have, better corning, less roll and a more damped ride. As someone who enjoys pressing on while driving, a hydractive does nothing for me, it floats about, rolls in the bends and is uncontrolled - this makes me travel sick as a passenger and gives an uninvolved drive as a driver.
The travel sickness also occurs to me when I'm a passenger in a non-Hydractive cars. Citroenitis I believe it's called. I know a few people who suffer from it. I've had to stop twice with different passengers to allow them to vomit at the side of the road when I had my M-reg sinker TD 10 years ago.
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Mandrake »

I'm with you Chris, between me and my parents we've had 4 Xantias, and previous GS's and CX's, two of the Xantias were non Hydractive, one was a sinker and one was an anti-sink, and the ride was "OK" by normal car standards but it did not live up to the reputation set by older models like the GS and CX, despite new spheres and everything being in order.

There was no sense of smooth wafting over bumps and yet when cornering hard there is significant body roll with the handling getting noticably twitchy... I never did feel comfortable pushing those two Xantias to their handling limits, and had a couple of scares with both of them when they behaved a bit unpredictable on the limit.

On the other hand the two Hydractive models - both mine, my 2 litre VSX and now my V6 Exclusive, when working properly the soft mode ride is nice and wafty and far better than the other two. The V6 doesn't ride quite as well as the VSX did but its not too far behind. Push either of them hard around the corners and the handling is tight and well controlled with hardly any body roll. I pushed the VSX to its handling limits frequently and it's stability and handling balance was immaculate, I never once had the rear come loose or any handling scares, it was rock solid.

I haven't pushed the V6 really hard around the corners but it seems to have even more grip at the front, although it could be my imagination. (Does more weight at the front give more grip or less grip when the tyre size is the same ?)

Note above when I said "when working properly", I've had intermittent harsh ride symptoms with both Hydractive cars that I havn't fully got to the bottom of, so there is definitely more to go wrong, but just today I went for a long drive and was marvelling at just how good the ride is and how stable it feels when it is working properly.

Hydractive 2 definitely rides better, however I suspect that there are a lot of Hydractive 2 cars out there with obscure intermittent faults that are causing the ride to be harsher than it should be...
Simon

1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White

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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

Now look what you've done isisalar!! You've inadvertently re-started off the old argument between non-Hydractive and Hydractive!! :lol: :lol:

Seconds out, Round 71895. Ding, Ding!

Me, I can't say, as I've only ever had non-Hydractive Citroens, so I do not have a valid opinion between the two options (if you don't include the Activa (oh no, I've just added another brawl to the queue!! #-o #-o )). Anybody know where there is a nuclear bunker with vacancies!! :arrow: :arrow:
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2008 Peugeot 207 Sw 1.6 16v hdi. 217k and rising
2010 Peugeot 207 SW 1.6 8v HDi 161k and rising
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Re: replacement xantia required. Advice please.

Post by citroenxm »

Rattiva_Mike wrote:
citroenxm wrote:No, DONT get an S2 Exclusive... Get an S2 SX with standard "Normal" citroen suspension, no sunroof and a HDi 110 engine.

I have an exclusive and while it works its still CRAP!
I'm sorry, this is nonsense. I counted up the other day, and I worked out I've had every model of Xantia apart from a 90 HDi or a Petrol Estate.

The HDI Exclusive rides the best out of all of them, and they've all been in fine working order. Yours mustn't have been working properly..

OK.. Im the ONLY ONE then.. Ill keep my mouth shut from now ......... :dunno:
Sharing a pug 207 1.6 hdi Sw 16v.
M reg Xm 2.1 td auto exclusive S2 269k and rising
L reg XM V6 12v SEi auto .. Light project

A very sad...
1994 XM 2.1 d auto
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