Lets have some love for the C5 ?

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Post by myglaren »

addo wrote:Steve, is that some Scandinavian treat they serve in IKEA cafés?
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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by Deanxm »

I think the C5 is a great car, Citroen done really well with it but i think the only one to have is the estate, from the back and side they look ok but the others are butt ugly from any angle imo, i would have one though, its a proper citroen.

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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by imperial21 »

I agree Dean the estate looks much better.
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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by waynedance »

Ok here some love for the C5, just spent 4 hours claying, t cutting and polishing.

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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by bxzx16v »

It certainly looks nice 8-)

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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by Deanxm »

I take it back they look rather nice in side profile, those wheels are brilliant too, i rather like them. Very tidy looking car by the way, it shines up a treat 8-) .

The estates are actualy very nice, a break from the Citroen norm as most citroestates look a bit frankenstein whereas the C5 looks like it was supposed to be an estate from the off.

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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by waynedance »

Was looking at the mk 2 but was put of by the controls for heating and radio much prefer the mk1 lay out.

Looks not top of the list for me gadgets and interior come 1st. As said got the C5 due to having xexons and all the toys not may cars of this vintage with so much kit for the low price tag.
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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by Peter.N. »

I must say that before I bought a C5 I didn't like them much either, especially when they first came out and I compared them with the XM, the fact is though that there are no more good cheap XMs but a lot of good cheap C5s, the are the only realistic replacement for the XM and since having one my predudices have diminished considerably. They are quieter and slightly sharper handling than the XM and the fuel consumption particularly of the Hdi engines is amazing - well mostly, the durability is on a par with the XM with a number of cars having in excess of 300,000 miles on them and still going, that says it all fo me.

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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by Citroenmad »

Well, as someone who is onto their 3rd C5, I do like them 8-) We have also had two C5 estate as family cars, we still have one and are currently a three C5 household.

For what people have said about their suspension, its a load of rubbish! Citroen has made the system less complex and you will find very very few C5s with suspension faults. The height correctors are superbly reliable, forever causing problems on Xantias with them being stuck at the wrong height or just causing a very slow reaction time.

In my opinion C5s are no less reliable than Xantias, infact its probably going the other way now as Xantias are aging and needing more maintenance as a result.

There is a place not too far from here who use a fleet of C5s as Taxis. Before getting my first C5 I asked one of the drivers what they thought to the C5. As it happened he owned 6 or 7 C5s which were all used as Taxis. He reported that they find them very reliable and usually retire them at about 350K as the interiors are starting to look a bit tatty by then! He really gave a glowing report and its what set my mind to get one.

The C5 has many advantages over both the Xantia and the XM. At the time the C5 was launched it was brought out to replace both of those cars, though im pretty positive the C6 was already being penciled! If I had to pick one car out of the XM, Xantia and C5 to use as my only driver, it woud be the C5. This is the decision I did make and even though I have one of each at the moment, its the C5 which will remain over the rest. This is more to do with it being a good car, rather than which one I prefer the looks of or which one interest me more. Of course the Activa is the one which I enjoy driving the most, the XM I like the styling and interior but the C5 does everything and it does it well. The Xantia and manily the XM really interest me and they are car I have liked for as long as I can remember, however the C5 is a brilliant daily driver.

The driving position is more spacious and better than the Xantia, though the XMs is superb. Ideally, I would have Activa seats in an XM seating position with a C5 dash arrangement. As a comprimise the C5 has seats which suit me, a very good driving position and a nice dash layout. I do like the position, slightly higher driving position and very airy feel about the C5. There is more boot space and interior space in a C5 than in a Xantia. All C5s have air conditioning, a rare thing to find in an XM. I dont usually look for a high spec in cars, in prefer cloth seats etc. However I always like cars with Air con, a trip fuel computer is always nice to have too. I am very used to the auto wipers and lights on a C5, but I can live without them. Likewise cruise control, however I find that harder to live without and do miss it when im driving the Xantia. The auto wipers and lights function perfectly - that is if the windscreen is cleaned for grease often and the wipers are in good condition, if not then the wipers can develop their own mind. Headlight sensors can have faults and turn the lights on and off to early, though they should work correctly. Not a huge problem if either fails as you can do the lights and wipers yourself.

I live the electric suspension pump on C5s, its very quick to react to height changes, levels the car in an instant when load is added and on the whole its a reliable system. I like the quirk that when left to stand for long periods, unlocking a C5 by the remote key sees the suspension jump into action and raise the car before you even open the door.

C5s are also, without doubt, the most refined of the three cars. Wind noise is greatly reduced and tyre noise is also less. Strange how Citroen has let the C5III have so much tyre noise, its more noticeable than any other big Citroen.

The obvious benefit of the C5 is its safety. Perhaps a boring thing to think about and its not something which often crosses my mind actually. It took someone to point out that my S1 XM doesn't have an airbag before I even thought anything of it. However cars are getting no smaller, people insist on driving 4x4 tanks and there are more cars than ever. The original C5 is a superbly strong car and scores excellently in the tests, its roof line virtually unruffled. The Facelifted C5 improved things more with a longer front end, adding to the crumple zone and which was more pedestrian friendly. It also got a drivers knee air bag and standard stability and traction control. In fact the C5 facelift scores a point more than the current C5III in the tests. The Xantia is really not a pretty sight in the test pictures, I doubt the driver would be walking away from that! The XM, well who knows, its an old design and so will probably be similar to the Xantia. Of course, most of us go through our driving career without the need to rely on safety features which the C5 has to offer.

Looks, well that is subjective isnt it. Dismiss a car on looks and you might well be missing out. I know people who think XMs are ugly and Xantias too. The styling of those cars really appeals to me and its a big draw for my interests in Citroens. The original C5 I found a bit odd looking at first, the front looks a bit startled and from the side the backend doesn't seem to go with the front styling very well. However, the shape has really grown on me. I quite like what they tried to do, in making the C5 appear more like a saloon car. Giving it a boot lid which extends way beyond the rear window, in saloon car fashion and also not giving earlier C5 hatchbacks a rear wiper, in the hope that it would help aid the saloon car stance. For me any car needs a rear wiper, saloon or not, so that for me is a crazy idea, thankfully sorted on late but early shape C5Is in VTR spec and all UK C5IIs. The C5II (or facelift) really has helped the styling of the C5. Its longer at the front and rear (front only on estate), the plastic sill section covers have been toned down and look much more subtle. The front looks similar to a C4, with big chevrons blending into a trim detail across the bonnet, which flows deep into the bumper, a feature I really like. The headlamps also look great in my opinion, much more modern and it got rid of the shocked appearance of early C5s. The rear end of C5II hatchbacks is one of the best angles I think, the lights which carry over to the boot lid, the number plate repositioned low in the bumper, off the tailgate, a neat looking boot handle and a smoother rear bumper. It also saw the addition of chrome strips along the lower bumpers, sills and tailgate. Along with standard 16" wheels which improved things greatly. Its a very appealing looking car to me and I always spot them on the road. That said, the rear lights on both the C5 estate and C5II hatch really set the car apart, always identifiable in the dark to me.

The C5 estate is one of the better lookin gmodern estates, I think. However, too many estates are too rounded, built for style and not space, the Renault Laguna Tourer (I know, its not really an estate but its the best they do) and C5III spring to mind. The original C5 estate is both reasonable to look at but has a huge load area. A massive, useful but good looking estate car is something which Citroen has offered since the DS Safari was launched. However the current C5 is smaller, the boot is smaller than the original C5s, the rear more sloped and I find the interior too cramped. The opening between the rear seat and middle door post is very small too, I have to turn my feet to get in the back. A real shame in my opinion, Citroen no longer make a massive estate car and I can see that before much longer the hydractive suspension will be a thing of the past too. Therefore, the original C5 really is a true Citroen, its massive, has tones of space, good equipment evels, good ride quality matched with good grip, and that fantastic hydractive suspension which offers so many benefits.

Engines, well, there is more than enough choice. Earlier C5s are available with the superb and very hardy 2.0HDi 110 8v. A simple and economical engine which has been well proven. The 2.2 136hp is not near as much hassle as some reports would have you believe and the two most hated things (EGR and DPF) can be removed/blocked to create a pretty good engine. The C5II got the 1.6 and 2.0 HDi 16vs, both very refined and economical engines. Watch for turbo problems due to too infrequent servicing on the 1.6 but the 2.0 is very robust, full of torque and drives very nicely.

Driving, its been a while since I drove a normal, non Activated, Xantia. However they do drive well, ride very well and cling on in the usual Citroen way. Xm the same if a little more cruiser like, to be expected with a big car. The C5 drives well, I find has more grip than either and it can be thrown around quite well. The C5 does not ride as well as a Xantia or XM though. That said, C5s differ greatly in my opinion. If its an early C5 with 15" wheels it will ride better than the C5IIs with 16" wheels but it wont be as direct to drive nor feel as nimble. The C5 or XM are not hugely nimble cars but they are better than their size would have you believe. I think the C5 rolls less, initially, than an XM. Push an XM into sport and it does make things more accurate. I find all three very enjoyable cars to drive but for very different reasons. All three are superb motorway cruisers, the XM just eats miles and the C5 the same, both cars seem to get more impressive as speeds rise.

Reliability, on the whole they are very reliable. The main electrical gremslins will be linked to the comms2000 unit - not the end of the world, its easily replaced and not that expensive. Rear brake calipers can wedge due to corrosion, DPF filters can need some maintenence, DMFs seem to have a varying lifetime. Compare a C5 to many of its rivals and you wonder why anyone bought anything else. I have looked at many other rivals and found too many reliability issues to worth bothering with the car. C5s are holding up very well to age (the eldest being 11 now) and mileage. Interiors are hardy and wear miles very well. The bodywork was galvanised from new and the only rusty bodywork I have seen on a C5 was due to bodywork repairs. There does not appear to be any common rust problems at this stage. Strut tops, a concern for XMs and Xantias (also reports on C6s too!) but the C5 is just about perfect. I have not heard of one failing (might well have happened?) which is an excellent breakthrough.

To get onto our own C5s:
I bought the 2002 C5 2.0HDi 110 SX in Jan 2008 from a FCF forum and CCC member. It had 108K and had been owned by its previous owner since just about new. It was not my ideal spec or colour (its Misty Lilac) but it was unbelievably tidy and had proven to be a very reliable car which had a fantastic service record. I passed that one onto my sister who still has it, its now approaching 145K and has been brilliant. Its had the odd problem, the intercooler developed a leak, the stepper motor in the speedo went (can be bought from ebay for a few £), it had a suspension leak from the rear cylinder (cost about £7 for the part and 20-30 mins to fit), front caliper replaced due to sticking handbrake mech. Nothing serious, nothing which stopped use of the car and nothing too costly. For its age and mileage and the use it gets I think that is excellent. I hope to keep it in our household for a lot longer yet. It averages about 42-46MPG.

The estate we have is a 2005 2.0HDi 138 16v VTR in Hurricane Grey, bought 3 years ago with 45K miles. Its now done almost 90K miles, in those 45K miles with us all it has needed is 4 pairs of tyres, two front drop links and a few front sidelight bulbs. That is all! Its going in tomorrow for a cambelt kit and water pump and new front discs and pads. You can not say fairer than that. It has a hard life too, as its always laden with heavy boxes as it works for its living. It averages between 44-48MPG.

My C5 is a 2006 2.0HDi 138 16v VTR hatchback. I bought it last January with just 11K miles, in new condition. Its now done 37K miles, got through a few pairs of tyres and a drop link. I have had to replace the clutch as the DMF failed, this was found to be a faulty part rather than the usual wear and tear. Other than that its been faultless and its a joy to drive. Its still unmarked and feels and smells like a new car. I get about 50MPG on average and drive it spiritedly but mostly motorway miles.

My previous C5, a 2004 (pre-facelift) 2.0HDi 110 VTR hatch did need a good few things doing. I perhaps bought a neglected model without knowing and so found I had to do quite a bit to it. The comms2000 unit had failed, which would not allow the right indicator to work. Though that was the only C5 specific thing it needed.
Our previous estate was a 2002 2.0HDi 110 SX, bought with 105K and sold a few months later with 108K. Recently I bumped into the guy who bought it from us three years ago. Its now done more than 160K and he reports its been very reliable. He has only had to fit tyres and replace the boot release handle. Not bad!

If ever anyone can not pull a reason from the above findings in order to seriously consider a C5, just think how stupidly good value they are to buy and it will all make even more sense!

To sum up, I'd like a C5 which drives like a Xantia Activa and has some of the XM quirks 8-) However, I am more than happy with mine and have no idea what will replace it. There are too many things about the C5III which I dont like, though that is the obvious choice. Im not worried about that, as my C5 will be staying for a good few years yet.

waynedance: Your C5 looks excellent, claying really makes a difference to the paintwork finish. 8-) Those Monza wheels are quite different to any other wheels, I do like those.
Last edited by Citroenmad on 05 Aug 2012, 18:54, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by waynedance »

That's a superb post with so much information, claying does make a difference paintwork is like glass to touch. Took bloody ages to remove all marks but now all done will keep on top of it.
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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by StevieOMG »

My twopenneth worth. Having had a bx and two xantias both diesels one sinker one not, i bought an 03 c5 diesel estate with 20k on it in 05. I've now had it 7 years putting 110k miles on it. In terms of reliabity it has had a washer pump, drop links and track rod ends. Thats it. Don't think you can get more reliable than that. No electric gremlins and everything works as it should. Had a small issue early on with the back sinking when parked but this righted itself and has been fine since. Last week did a 500 mile round trip without an issue - and my rear window works. A fantastic car which hopefully will do me for some time to come. Not the best looking car but keeps going. Far more important than looks.
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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by Citroenmad »

waynedance wrote:That's a superb post with so much information, claying does make a difference paintwork is like glass to touch. Took bloody ages to remove all marks but now all done will keep on top of it.
:lol: I do tend to go on a bit don't I! Actually, that took me no longer to type it than it does to read it :lol:

Claying is an odd thing for someone who has not tired it before, however it does make all the difference. Yours is clearly one well kept C5 8-)
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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by waynedance »

My cars better kept than the kisses ha.
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Re:

Post by xantia_v6 »

addo wrote:Steve, is that some Scandinavian treat they serve in IKEA cafés?
Think of them as low-cal tomato-flavour wichetty grubs :roll:
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Re: Lets have some love for the C5 ?

Post by Peter.N. »

Thanks citroenmad, a very exhaustive account of your motors (not exhausting) in my brief (6 months) period of ownership I have not found anything that contradicts that. I have the 8 valve Hdi in my 406 and its been brilliant for 20,000 miles, now reading 208,000, until tonight, we have just returned from a meal with some friends and its making a noise like a woodpecker, I lifted the bonnet when we got to the pub to find that the crankshaft pulley appeared to be moving around, I think the nut has come loose, doesn't look as though its breaking up, although I did have that happen on an XM at about 250k, so that will be the first job tommorrow.

I think the early C5s are brilliant, I have heard things about the new one I'm not sure about, springs for instance and I think the poor ride is down the the painted on tyres but I shall likely have stopped driving by the time I need one of those if the early ones last as long as the XMs did.

The best hydropnumatic to my mind was undoubtedly the CX it was a huge car but handled like a Mini and rode like a Rolls Royce thanks to central steering knuckles and diravi steering - if only they hade made it with a decent heater and handbrake.

Peter
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