Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

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euan
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Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by euan »

Hi all,

I've just joined after spending the last week trawling through all the info here. As usual, you only appreciate forums like this when something goes wrong.

So I bought my 2006 Citroen Dispatch 1.9 (50k miles) a couple of weeks ago. To give it a good drive, I took it to Wales (from London) last weekend. It drove well all the way, but when I was there I noticed that it would judder or stutter at specific revs, as if the diesel was cutting out. This would happen intermittently and only at specified revs, but varying speeds. Once I went past that rpm it would be fine again. Throughout the weekend this started becoming more common. On the way back I felt that the power in the van went significantly lower and it was smoking more than before, so I decided to call the AA and be towed back. The AA guy suggested it was the turbo (I've since found out there is no turbo on this). So I decided to take it to the Citroen Garage, which is close to where I live.

I've just come off the phone with the technician there he said he checked the EGR valve and it was fine, it wasn't the fuel pump as it idles ok, that it wouldn't be the clutch flywheel either. So he is going to check the timing.

Obviously all this labour is costing me, but I'm worried the problem will be something else as this doesn't fit with what i've read elsewhere in this forum.

Does anyone have any suggestions of what this could be? And is it bad?

Thanks!
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by CitroJim »

Welcome to the forum Euan :)

I'm assuming your Dispatch has the DW8 engine with a semi-electronic Lucas injection pump. If this is the case then timing is the most likely and I'd be inclined to suspect either the Needle Lift Sensor (located in one of the injectors) and/or the TDC sensor. Both these sensors are critical in setting the correct the pump timing.

If your technician has Lexia diagnostics then it'll be straightforward for him to diagnose the problem.
Jim

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euan
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by euan »

Hi CitroJim,

Thanks for the quick answer. I've been trying to figure out if it is a DW8, but i'm not sure. I saw another thread here about the Lucas Injection pump issues and it resonated with my symptoms, but the technician is insisting on looking at the timing belt, claiming that the engine might be damaged. Is the Lucas Pump the fuel pump? If so could this cause damage to the engine? I'll tell him your suggestions about the Needle Lift Sensor, and ask if he has Lexia diagnostics.
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by CitroJim »

He's seen the vehicle and I haven't Euan but on the face of it I would believe he would be looking in the wrong place if he's considering looking at the timing belt. A problem here would be permanent and not intermittent. If the timing had slipped then the pistons would invariably kiss the valves and you'd surely know about that. If the engine is due a timing belt change anyway then now is a good a time as any to do it.

Yes the Lucas pump is the injection pump (if it's a DW8) and if a sensor has failed then the pump would 'fail-safe' to a retarded timing setting which would account for the smoke and poor power output. A diesel running retarded tends to run quite quietly and is harder than normal to start from cold.

There'll be no damage caused par-se but running retarded will cause the engine to run hotter than normal and for this reason it is best not to.
Jim

Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
euan
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by euan »

Yeah, thats what i gathered from reading other posts here. If the engine idles ok and doesn't have any issues when accelerating in neutral, could there still be a problem with the timing of the pump?

Thanks again.
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by euan »

Juts got off the phone with the technician. Apparently the problem in a blocked catalytic converter and 'top'part of the exhaust system, both will need replaced as they cannot be cleaned. He said he checked the Lucas pump and it was fine.

The cost:
Labour - 3hrs @ £80.00 = 240.00 plus vat
Parts - free fit £426.31 plus vat
Total cost £799.57 Ouch!

I don't mind paying this if its fixing the problem rather than just a symptom. Do you all think this makes sense in reflection of the original post?

Cheers
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by artdjones »

This does happen to these vans-we had one at work that wouldn't do more than 40 mph because of this problem.We cured it by knocking the insides out of the cat and taking the rest of the exhaust of and shaking the debris out.Result was a total cure.£500 for the cat is very expensive-they can be got for between £100 and £150 on ebay.
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by myglaren »

Don't they have to fit type-approved cats now, pattern parts not acceptable for MOT?

My mate scraped the cat off his Camaro on a high manhole cover - replacement was £2,000.
artdjones
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by artdjones »

Fuel Parts UK sell typeapproved cats for this van for around £100 -see link below.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Premium-Type- ... 2569c0cd39
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myglaren
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Re: Dispatch intermittent loss of power - timing?

Post by myglaren »

artdjones wrote:Fuel Parts UK sell typeapproved cats for this van for around £100 -see link below.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Premium-Type- ... 2569c0cd39

That's very useful to know!
Can you post that in the "useful links forum"
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