Cold idle problem - Xantia 1.9TD following use of BioDiesel

Post by **Rhothgar** » 27 Mar 2011, 12:12

I have uploaded two videos to YouTube for the benefit of everyone once a resolution is found - hopefully!

First one is the initial Cold Start yesterday (around 3 minutes 32 seconds)

Love the comment I made at 56 seconds in retrospect! Looks like a pump and injector rebuild may be in order.

The video below is of the fuel filter as removed. You will laugh with amazement, I'm sure! (1 minute 10 seconds)

Forte Diesel Treatment although the best on the market has not yet resolved this despite being held at 5000rpm.

I am going to clean up the tank sender as DickieG and others have suggested.

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 27 Mar 2011, 12:24

My god that filter looks manky!
Did it just fall apart?
Even when I've left Cassy's in too long that it got to the stage where I couldn't rev above 2000rpm when cold it wasn't that bad!

Post by **Rhothgar** » 27 Mar 2011, 12:33

Hi Xac

Once I had taken the top of the Fuel Filter, I put my finger in the hole, as you do, to take the filter out and just the metal came out.

Post by **Rhothgar** » 27 Mar 2011, 12:36

robert_e_smart wrote:If you're too tight to use white diesel, use Red, and maybe be prepared for the the 1 in a million chance of being caught by VOSA. You'll save more than the fine or the value of your Xantia and not have any running issues!

Not good advice at all. If you are caught with or traces of red having been used in the past in your car, the fine is all the duty for all the fuel they can either prove or estimate you have used since owning the car and probably a £1000 fine on top so you would not be better off especially if you get a jail sentence too and end up in a cell with someone that likes the look of your ass!

mongoose100 · Post by **mongoose100** » 27 Mar 2011, 12:51

Sorry to head off subject here but, can someone please educate a poor New Zealander on what "Red" and "White" Diesel is???

We just have one here, a rather yellow/brown colour...

Cheers guys!

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 27 Mar 2011, 12:52

Rhothgar wrote:Hi Xac

Once I had taken the top of the Fuel Filter, I put my finger in the hole, as you do, to take the filter out and just the metal came out.

Was that while it was in the filter housing or did it come out as one piece?

I would say the bio destroyed the glue holding the filter together.

The worry would be if anything managed to get to the pump side of the filter housing as it disintegrated, however as the hunting clears when the engine warms up it would suggest that isn't the case.

What diesel do you use? When I'm caught low away from sources of veg I use shell v-power, it's more expensive than normal derv, but comes pre-mixed with redex-type cleaner and has more oomph.

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 27 Mar 2011, 12:55

mongoose100 wrote:Sorry to head off subject here but, can someone please educate a poor New Zealander on what "Red" and "White" Diesel is??? We just have one here, a rather yellow/brown colour...

Cheers guys!

Diesel for agricultural use has a lower duty applied to it, but to stop people using it in cars, they add a red dye.
This stains the fuel system, not a problem for tractors, but for road use it is still detectable long after the last tank of red was used.
The dye can be removed illegally, but in doing so it removes some of the lubricating properties which isn't good for the car.

mongoose100 · Post by **mongoose100** » 27 Mar 2011, 13:19

Cheers for that, over here we pay on a per kilometer basis for Diesel - Petrol has the taxes built in.

Have a great one!

Now I'll let you get back on topic

Post by **Rhothgar** » 27 Mar 2011, 14:11

It was in the fuel filter housing like that. Doh!

Post by **Rhothgar** » 27 Mar 2011, 14:19

Here is a video of smoke on startup. I am beginning to doubt that this now has anything to do with the fuel filter being in bits. Wishful thinking perhaps!!!

BTW, I cannot find the fuel tank pick-up under driver's side rear passenger seat. Anyway got a snap shot? Mine's a Series 1 just to clarify.

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 27 Mar 2011, 15:50

Sorry, sedative after having a wisdom tooth out yesterday is making me forgetful, meant to say you'll need new jubilee clips (small ones) to reconnect the fuel pipes on the sender unless you're good at reusing the press clips, and cable ties are handy for stopping the fuel pipes slipping down beside the tank out of reach.

Lift up the rear seat, pull the plastic panel directly up off it's studs, and fold back the carpet.
There's a large rubber circle with a slit by one edge.
Use a large flat bladed screwdriver in the slit to pop the rubber out.
The sender is held in place by a large plastic screw on seal with ridges to help spin it off.
Use a bit of wood/large flat screwdriver to press on a ridge to get it going then you should be able to unscrew by hand.
If it's really tight you may need to apply a hammer to the other end of the wood/screwdriver but go easy as you don't want to crack it!
Put a cable tie around each pipe if you think you need to, or tie a bit of string, and pop them off the sender.
Unscrew the seal and withdraw the sender.
On the bottom there's the removable mesh screen, pop it out and give it a clean.

Post by **Rhothgar** » 27 Mar 2011, 16:30

Cheers for that Xac.

Of course, we all have an extra hour of daylight now so I should still get this done today.

I did see the edge of the plastic disc but was not sure if that was it so your reply has clarified well.

Wisdom tooth, eh? OUCH! I'm lucky not to have had any out so far. What was the drug of choice? Morphine? I detest the stuff. Once had an operation which required large doses of the stuff and when I came round. I sat there in the hospital bed with the curtains drawn around me wondering if I was still alive - it is quite a strange level of consciousness, even after being awake for several hours and having had a conversation - still thought I had died.

Of course, I thought to myself I'm already dead so there's nothing anyone can do so no point making a fuss. Very bizarre indeed!

boeingmech · Post by **boeingmech** » 27 Mar 2011, 17:54

modxl wrote:where do u get ur svo for 1.01 a litre

Tesco and Asda are selling 3ltr bottles of oil for £2.95 = 98p ltr

MikeT · Post by **MikeT** » 27 Mar 2011, 18:16

From a cold start, the idle should be raised to about 1100rpm, that doesn't seem to happen?

Secondly, I suspect you've got one or two duff glow plugs and/or some air ingress as it should have started on first crank. The glow plugs will remain active after starting for a minute or so (unless you raise the rpms as if driving off) to reduce cold idle smoke.

You said you didn't use any throttle which is right, the governor will have it wide open for you until the engine actually starts anyway so there's no point.

I would, as a matter of course, check the air filter while you're at it and a change of oil (plus filter) wouldn't hurt.

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 27 Mar 2011, 18:17

It was a diazepam derivative I believe, I remember telling the sedatition about my phobia of plasters, an eye protector being put on me and saying thank you, saying something hurt, and then coming around in the recovery room to then see CitroJim arrive to take me and Danielle home.