berlingo 1.9d van loss of power

wright · Post by **wright** » 12 Feb 2011, 20:30

is there an air flow meter on it?

dave28 · Post by **dave28** » 12 Feb 2011, 20:46

not as far as i know

dave28 · Post by **dave28** » 13 Feb 2011, 14:35

right i have been having another poke around and the only thing i did notice is that when i rev up there is a bit of white smoke coming from the EGR valve around the metal pipe joint is this normal

dave28 · Post by **dave28** » 16 Feb 2011, 20:04

Latest update i have just fitted a new EGR valve and guess what still the same i think its time to put it in the garage

spider · Post by **spider** » 16 Feb 2011, 20:50

I would take a guess then (assuming the timing belt has not slipped which is unlikely as you'd notice) and as the 'K' light is not on (which means that the inj calculations are correct usually) then it must be a fault with the pump itself or less likely a valve.

pottsy189 · Post by **pottsy189** » 18 Feb 2011, 10:35

On my 1.9 Berlingo diesel which I bought from new , when I lost power from the engin tick over ok except for the noise [rattle] it was the advance solinoid that was faulty, the Citroen garage where I bought it from could not find the problem, and to be honest the other citroen garage in this area is just as usless, luckly my tenpin bowling friend was a diesel wissard cost me about £75 to replace ,like changing a spark plug on a petrol engin took a few seconds to do
Hope this info helps
D

skertonman · Post by **skertonman** » 18 Feb 2011, 14:35

Pottsy,

am following this tgread as my Peugeot 206 (same engine I think) has the same problem, my thread open in the Pug section.

Where is the solonoid located on the engine.

Post by **CitroJim** » 18 Feb 2011, 17:20

Although I'm not familair with the engine, I'll guess it uses the "electronic" Lucas DPC pump.

The timing solenoid will be a cylinder about 3CM long and similar in diamater located on the front side of the pump.

There will be an ECU to control it and if the set-up is similar to the Bosch AS3 then there will be a needle lift sensor on one of the injectors. Look for an injector with a wire running from it.

The ECU will use a combination of this needle lift signal coupled with a signal from the TDC sensor and a signal from the load pot on top of the throttle spindle to set the timing. Certainly if the timing is out because the system is not working then performance will be very poor because the pump will be running retarded. Does the engine seem to be running quietly under the fault condition with no discernible diesel knock?

A Lexia diagnostic session should quickly determine if the pump is timing up properly.

A test with the Bosch system is to disconnect the needle lift sensor. If the engine note changed appreciably then the sensor was good.

If your vehicle has a tacho, is it working?

pottsy189 · Post by **pottsy189** » 18 Feb 2011, 17:24

I will have to get back to you tomorrow as it is getting dark and casn't see , if i remember rightly it is on the right hand side standing in front of the motor { over the radiator] but I will phone my friend whe he get home from work tonight
When the fault appears not only is it noisy at tick over but has no pulling power one tends to stall when moveing off, you can hear it ticking when you first turn on the ignition [not turning it over] this ticking is the advance solinoid reseting itself ready for the off, it is a common fault that NO one has told Citroen garages well not in 2003 anyway

spider · Post by **spider** » 18 Feb 2011, 17:54

The DW8's do have the needle lift sensor, most of them anyway (but read on)

The early ones have a mechanical advance pump. Conventional. Obviously has amour over its unusual stop solenoid arrangement. No 'K' light (nothing to really wire it to!)

The later ones have the electronic advance pump with the small ECU mounted usually to the OSF wing, usual setup with it reading the TDC sensor / injector needle / throttle potentiometer (on the pump) / coolant temp / atmospheric pressure sensor (in ECU) etc. Some of these control the EGR system too.

I do have the codes for each engine type of DW8 but am not sure of the change over year. I would guess late 2000.

WJZ = Early one. Mechanical pump. Pump is Lucas DWLP11
WJY = Later one. Electronic advance pump. Pump is Lucas DWLP12

If you have a lot of wiring (not just a microswitch) , specifically a large black or grey block on the pump's accelerator lever you almost certainly have a WJY electronic one. Further confirmed by an ECU on the wing, although it may have one anyway.

Note those pump codes are for a 206 but the engine designation should be the same for all PSA as far as I am aware. The pump codes may well be correct for other models too.

For intents and purposes, the later electronic ones function the same as the 406 / Xantia 1.9DT in that they have electronic advance and read from the sensors etc. Obviously the pump is different but its principles are not.

pottsy189 · Post by **pottsy189** » 18 Feb 2011, 19:48

skertonman re 1.9 citroen diesel engin year2001
It is on the fuel pump so just follow the feed pipe from the fuel filter back and you will come across it , you will need to give engin /serial number to garage so they can order the correct part
I see mentioned about a needle , that is what the Citroen garage replaced when UG, but did not rectify the fault, they did not have a clue ! and I told them what to replace !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by **CitroJim** » 18 Feb 2011, 20:05

pottsy189 wrote: I see mentioned about a needle , that is what the Citroën garage replaced when UG, but did not rectify the fault, they did not have a clue ! and I told them what to replace !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's bad

The timing solenoid is easily enough tested with an ohmmeter. I have a similar pump here, although not an electronic one, and the solenoid has a resistance of 8 ohms. Disconnect it before testing.

Here's a picture showing teh timing solenoid on a similar pump:

An oscilloscope across it with the engine running will show if the ECU is supplying a signal to it...

spider · Post by **spider** » 18 Feb 2011, 20:14

Here is a pic I found of the DWLP12 (I think!) pump:

Not ideal pic though, sorry.

spider · Post by **spider** » 18 Feb 2011, 20:16

CitroJim wrote:

Jim that looks just like the cold start advance unit on the earlier Lucas ones (such as mine) just a pin. Perhaps I'm confusing myself

Post by **CitroJim** » 18 Feb 2011, 20:22

On the older pump it is indeed Andy. I believe, and you have me seriously wondering now, that I thought I'd seen similar on a late electronic pump but your picture above does not show it so maybe the solenoid is in a different place and my memory/brain is letting me down. LHM poisoning setting in maybe

Mind you, the one I last saw was on a Ford Mundaneo...

Is the solenoid the device low down with the cable-tie around it in your picture? In roughly the same place as the boost overfuelling device in my picture?

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berlingo 1.9d van loss of power

berlingo loss of power