xantia hdi clutch

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handyman
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Post by handyman »

If your old clutch friction plate was worn at its outer edges (top)? and you are now experiencing clutch judder, there is a chance that the centre bearing that supports the output shaft is worn or the shaft is bent. The centre bearing is housed in the centre of the flywheel. It is one of those components that gets overlooked in a clutch change.

If the flywheel surface has wear ridges or surface cracks, not unusual in high mileage cars, the new friction plate will need to wear itself in. It may not be getting full surface contact until these wear peaks have bedded in. How many miles have you done since the clutch was fitted?

The make of cluctch fitted, LUK, should be OK, so I am told, but I only ever fit Valeo, as these were OE supplied.

Take the car back to the firm that supplied and fitted it and ask them to put it right, it is their responsiblity to put it right, at no extra cost to you.

Under the terms of the Sale of Goods Act, the parts fitted should be of merchantable quality and do the job they were designed to do. If you still get no joy, get onto Trading Standards and the CAB for legal advice.

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Last edited by handyman on 24 Oct 2010, 12:33, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by imperial21 »

I will upload the pictures tommorrow and you can all see what you think, i cant really take it back to the person who did as it was a cash job on a saturday afternoon, i wonder if it was a bit hurried as he did quick i wish i had seen the clutch he had fitted to be 100% sure he fitted an LUK clutch as somene else who drove the car said he thought it was cheap clutch ! I thought the bloke was honest and has done other jobs for me well.
Another thing i have noticed is that when i am towing the clutch has a better clutch bite espially with heavy loads ? ( i hope its not my immagination ! ).
Will the clutch wear out much faster or could it ever bed in ok ?
1999 Xantia exclusive 110BHP !! Now RIP !!
2002 C5 estate 110 hdi, Happily sold on !!!
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Post by handyman »

Even though you paid cash for the job, there is no reason why you should accept shoddy workmanship or dodgy parts. If he did not give you a receipt for the work, it is still his responsibility to resolve the issues.

You can still complain to Trading Standards and if you want to be really mean, Inland Revenue and if he is VAT registered, Customs & Excise! :twisted: :evil:

It is not you that has transgressed the law, so do not be afraid to confront him. Sometimes a gentle hint about Goverment agencies is enough to get the situation resolved.

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Post by flying clutchman »

Since when does paying cash mean you get a crap job? Cash is the normal method of payment as far as I'm concerned, but you're still entitled to a proper job. This has all the hallmarks of a cheap clutch being fitted. Oil contamination is unlikely, that would normally get worse as it gets hot. Very few transverse gearbox layouts use a pilot bearing (spigot) in the flywheel centre (can't be 100% the xantia hasn't but I'm 99% sure) so you can discount that as well. LUK are also used as O.E on Citroens as well as Valeo so it should work properly.
On the plus side judder often wears of after a few thousand miles. The clutch pedal is normally higher than the brake. The reason for this is that xantia brake pedals are lower than many cars as it does'nt use a conventional brake master cylinder.
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Post by uncle buck »

handyman wrote:If your old clutch friction plate was worn at its outer edges (top)? and you are now experiencing clutch judder, there is a chance that the centre bearing that supports the output shaft is worn or the shaft is bent.....Handyman
Not trying to be funny but the chances of the center bearing causing clutch judder are virtually nil so I would rule that out.

Bent shaft etc, you couldn't bend one of those if you tried,so rule that out.

If the last clutch was fine with no judder you either have a defective LUK clutch, (unlikely) or he has fitted a cheap re-con clutch. (likely)

I put my money on the latter.
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Post by CitroJim »

uncle buck wrote: Bent shaft etc, you couldn't bend one of those if you tried,so rule that out.
I'm not so sure. There are grave warnings about having the (heavy) 'box well supported as you mate it back on the engine. The weight of the thing hanging off the input shaft might well do for it if they were careless.
uncle buck wrote:I put my money on the latter.
I must admit, I tend that way too...
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Post by Chris570 »

CitroJim wrote:
uncle buck wrote: Bent shaft etc, you couldn't bend one of those if you tried,so rule that out.
I'm not so sure. There are grave warnings about having the (heavy) 'box well supported as you mate it back on the engine. The weight of the thing hanging off the input shaft might well do for it if they were careless.
uncle buck wrote:I put my money on the latter.
I must admit, I tend that way too...
You would more likely damage the input shaft bearings though than bend the shaft. would have a similar effect but you'd also see gearbox oil loss throught the fudged bearing.

To me it sounds like a cheap clutch, although it can't be a transmech clutch as its lasted more than 3 minutes :) (nasty things)
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Post by Xaccers »

We fitted a transmech clutch to Cassy over 2 years ago and had no problems. (approx 40,000K)
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Post by handyman »

Had a quick look on the Citroen Service site and cannot see a pilot bearing listed for the input shaft.

As for bending or breaking parts, I have seen supposed bulletproof parts suffer at the hands of the wrong idiot, so it could be possible to bend or break shafts and bearings if the gearbox weight is hanging on the end of the shaft.

It may possibly be that the friction plate is off centre.

However, whatever all us "saw-doctors" say, the only way you will get the clutch problem resolved is to start checking the components fitted and how it was done. :roll:

What did William Morris say: 'He who buys cheap, buys twice.' [-X :bigcry:

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Post by flying clutchman »

Xac wrote:We fitted a transmech clutch to Cassy over 2 years ago and had no problems. (approx 40,000K)
I use Transmech on a regular basis but not for the bigger Citroens and peugeots, due to problems with judder. Of Course a clumsy fitter can damage parts but once an input shaft engages in the clutch spline it normally slides straight in. As previously said, dismantling is the only way to find out.
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Post by uncle buck »

handyman wrote:It may possibly be that the friction plate is off centre.
I don't understand, how could it be off center?
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Post by flying clutchman »

uncle buck wrote:
handyman wrote:It may possibly be that the friction plate is off centre.
I don't understand, how could it be off center?
You're right it can't. The very first time the clutch is operated it will centre itself!
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Post by uncle buck »

flying clutchman wrote:You're right it can't. The very first time the clutch is operated it will centre itself!
Exactly, that's what I didn't understand about the comment, I wondered if he meant something else.
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Post by HDI »

This will almost definitely be a warped or high spotted flywheel.
Now using '00 Xantia LX HDI, pov spec :(
My past Citroens :-
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'99 Xantia HDI 110 Exclusive, RIP :(
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'96 Xantia TD LX
'96 ZX TD
'89 BX TD
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& a couple of Peugeots !
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Post by imperial21 »

Basicly thats what the guy who did my clutch says it is , high spots on the flywheel , i thought the clutch would bed in and the problem go away, i guss wishful thinking ! its a pity as it spoils the lovely drive of my car.
I am keeping an eye out for a spare flywheel anyone help ????
1999 Xantia exclusive 110BHP !! Now RIP !!
2002 C5 estate 110 hdi, Happily sold on !!!
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