Sump rusted through on ZX
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Sump rusted through on ZX
The sump on my ZX 1.9D is leaking oil. The leak is at the front on the vertical part (rather than from the bottom). It looks like it's finally rusted all the way through. It's been rusting away for years and I've always been a bit concerned about it.
It looks like I'm going to have to replace it. The job seems easy enough. Just unbolt the old one and fit the new one. Are there any catches to be aware of? Is there anything else like a crankshaft seal or something which always needs replacing at the same time? I'm planning on re-using the original bolts.
My car is a Citroen ZX Reflex 1.9D, 1993, no aircon, no ABS, no turbo. The RP number for my car is 6176. It looks like they stopped using sump gaskets at RP 6140 so I'm supposed to use a "Sealing Product ZC9875744U" which is 16.58 pounds from Citroen. What is this stuff? Is there something else which people normally use instead or should I buy the Citroen stuff? The sump is 91 pounds from Citroen. Are there any cheaper sources? Are aftermarket sumps any good?
Paul
It looks like I'm going to have to replace it. The job seems easy enough. Just unbolt the old one and fit the new one. Are there any catches to be aware of? Is there anything else like a crankshaft seal or something which always needs replacing at the same time? I'm planning on re-using the original bolts.
My car is a Citroen ZX Reflex 1.9D, 1993, no aircon, no ABS, no turbo. The RP number for my car is 6176. It looks like they stopped using sump gaskets at RP 6140 so I'm supposed to use a "Sealing Product ZC9875744U" which is 16.58 pounds from Citroen. What is this stuff? Is there something else which people normally use instead or should I buy the Citroen stuff? The sump is 91 pounds from Citroen. Are there any cheaper sources? Are aftermarket sumps any good?
Paul
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I notice that gsfcarparts are selling sump gaskets for six pounds. It's cheaper than sixteen pounds for the Citroen sealant. Is it possible to just fit a gasket to the newer sumps rather than use the sealant? Is there some sump sealant that everybody uses that's cheap and available from motor factors?
Paul
Paul
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I've heard about something called "hockey stick seals". Are these likely to be leaking and should I attempt to replace them, or should I leave them well alone? There is oil leaking somewhere in the area of the gearbox end of the sump (a different problem to the main leak at the front of the sump). It doesn't drip to the floor but the area is always covered in oil.
Paul
Paul
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The hockey sticks refer to the rear main oil seal (behind the flywheel) if I remember correctly.
There usually is a small mist leak from nearly all XUD's around that area. Its reasonably normal from what I have seen.
Sump gasket is straightforward, remove / clean up / refit (carefully tighten bolts in correct sequence, if in doubt do extreme opposites) , someone will be able to clarify.
I've never had to take one off, thinking about it. Although mine is not far off the condition of yours too, so I'll probably have to do it soon.
There usually is a small mist leak from nearly all XUD's around that area. Its reasonably normal from what I have seen.
Sump gasket is straightforward, remove / clean up / refit (carefully tighten bolts in correct sequence, if in doubt do extreme opposites) , someone will be able to clarify.
I've never had to take one off, thinking about it. Although mine is not far off the condition of yours too, so I'll probably have to do it soon.
Andy.
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
- Old-Guy
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Given a previous thread on the necessity (or otherwise) of undershields, I'd be interested to know if ZXs were originally fitted with them.
2011 Grand C4 Picasso VTR+ 1.6HDi in Kyanos Blue
1995 Xantia Estate SX 1.9TD in Vert Vega "The Green Lady" - after 11 years now owned by XanTom
1998 Xantia 2.1 VXD Estate in Mauritius Blue - R.I.P. (terminal tin-worm)
1995 Xantia Estate SX 1.9TD in Vert Vega "The Green Lady" - after 11 years now owned by XanTom
1998 Xantia 2.1 VXD Estate in Mauritius Blue - R.I.P. (terminal tin-worm)
- spider
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I think not as 306's did not either. They did (the 306) have a tiny one at the front (from radiator back, about 3 inches in length if my memory serves), but no complete shield as such.Old-Guy wrote:Given a previous thread on the necessity (or otherwise) of undershields, I'd be interested to know if ZXs were originally fitted with them.
Andy.
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
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My 1.9TD 306 has no undertray at all, not even the 3" one you mention. Lack of an undertray does explain why the AC pipes at the bottom of the radiator rust and break in 99% of 306's.spider wrote:I think not as 306's did not either. They did (the 306) have a tiny one at the front (from radiator back, about 3 inches in length if my memory serves), but no complete shield as such.
Stupid idea...
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Very very few still have this small thing at the front anyway, most got thrown away (or fell off) by the first service from what I can recall.Dommo wrote:My 1.9TD 306 has no undertray at all, not even the 3" one you mention. Lack of an undertray does explain why the AC pipes at the bottom of the radiator rust and break in 99% of 306's.spider wrote:I think not as 306's did not either. They did (the 306) have a tiny one at the front (from radiator back, about 3 inches in length if my memory serves), but no complete shield as such.
Stupid idea...
If I had to put a number to it, I would say 1 / 100 306 that I saw still had said 'tray' , if that.
I also think they did not fit them to the later (97 onwards) shape anyway.
I do know what you mean about the A/C pipes too, they always go there.
Andy.
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
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My ZX is a 1993 one and it never had an undertray. All it's got is two small vertical plastic covers on either side. One is to cover the alternator belt and there's a similar one on the other side near the gearbox filler plug.
The cover under the radiator sounds like a good idea. My ZX is rusting on the metal mounting frame under the radiator.
Paul
The cover under the radiator sounds like a good idea. My ZX is rusting on the metal mounting frame under the radiator.
Paul
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I just received my new sump from the main dealer. Here's a picture:-
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This sump has got two threaded holes for drain plugs. The old sump only had one hole. Does anybody know what the second drain hole is for? It's half-way up on the vertical rear sump wall, which is a strange place to put a drain plug, so I'm wondering if it's for something else.
The new sump has a shiny metal finish. It looks like it's galvanised. My old sump was painted black. Were ZX sumps galvanised under the paint in 1993? Do I need to paint the sump or is it ok to leave the bare galvanised finish. On new Citroen cars, are the sumps painted these days, or are they just galvanised? What sort of paint would be best for a sump?
Paul
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This sump has got two threaded holes for drain plugs. The old sump only had one hole. Does anybody know what the second drain hole is for? It's half-way up on the vertical rear sump wall, which is a strange place to put a drain plug, so I'm wondering if it's for something else.
The new sump has a shiny metal finish. It looks like it's galvanised. My old sump was painted black. Were ZX sumps galvanised under the paint in 1993? Do I need to paint the sump or is it ok to leave the bare galvanised finish. On new Citroen cars, are the sumps painted these days, or are they just galvanised? What sort of paint would be best for a sump?
Paul
- spider
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Either but usually level (higher spec models and suchlike have a level gauge fitted to the instrument panel)
Ensure the blanking plug for this unused one is tight. (check the other one while you are there too)
Ensure the blanking plug for this unused one is tight. (check the other one while you are there too)
Andy.
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
- Old-Guy
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1995 Xantia Estate SX 1.9TD in Vert Vega "The Green Lady" - now owned by XanTom
1998 Xantia 2.1 VXD Estate in Mauritius Blue - R.I.P. (terminal tin-worm) - x 17
It won't be galvanised (hot-dipped in molten zinc). It might be zinc electro-plated (the same process that often used to keep fasteners bright, but you know how quickly they rust!), but from the photo it looks like bare steel.
Personally, I would fit a short full-thread bolt with copper washer as a blanking plug in the sender hole, degrease the outside with something like white spirit and then paint with two coats of black hammerite smooth (1 small tin should be plenty). Two coats to give some thickness against stone chips etc. Then you can can be reasonably sure the sump will outlast the car.
Personally, I would fit a short full-thread bolt with copper washer as a blanking plug in the sender hole, degrease the outside with something like white spirit and then paint with two coats of black hammerite smooth (1 small tin should be plenty). Two coats to give some thickness against stone chips etc. Then you can can be reasonably sure the sump will outlast the car.
2011 Grand C4 Picasso VTR+ 1.6HDi in Kyanos Blue
1995 Xantia Estate SX 1.9TD in Vert Vega "The Green Lady" - after 11 years now owned by XanTom
1998 Xantia 2.1 VXD Estate in Mauritius Blue - R.I.P. (terminal tin-worm)
1995 Xantia Estate SX 1.9TD in Vert Vega "The Green Lady" - after 11 years now owned by XanTom
1998 Xantia 2.1 VXD Estate in Mauritius Blue - R.I.P. (terminal tin-worm)
- spider
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The oil level sensor hole (should!) usually be the same size as the drain plug + washer.
Thing to watch here, I've only just remembered: Pre 94 models can have either 'size' washer / plug combination (some early models have a square recess in the plug) , but your new sump may have the later (smaller) design.
Its really obvious by the plugs / washers what you need though.
Thing to watch here, I've only just remembered: Pre 94 models can have either 'size' washer / plug combination (some early models have a square recess in the plug) , but your new sump may have the later (smaller) design.
Its really obvious by the plugs / washers what you need though.
Andy.
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG
91 205D-Turbo, gone but still missed
02 106D, TUD5B, gone but not really missed apart from the MPG