CV joint (MKII ABS) input stub - strange one

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 11 Aug 2010, 19:00

Any Ideas on this strange parts (CV joint) problem:

For my xantia II estate, year 2000, I ordered an ABS CV joint. They're meant to be the same , reagrdless of estate or saloon. Citroen tech list the driveshaft as per my VIN, as No. as 3273 9W

The CV joint for '93 to 2001 models, I received is 135 mm long, but the one I've taken off is 143mm approx: (SEE PHOTOS BELOW). Basically the the input stub is too short, indicating that the hub for my car is different form the usual standard large caliper/disc hubs that are fitted to V6/Estate models.

The supplier (J&R TRading - a fairly old firm) says he's supplied thousands aover a good number of years, and they are all the same. He wouldn't give me the part number it's meant to replace, possibly because Citroen don't list it - only the entire driveshaft; he says he gets his technical info from Citroen, but possibly his parts are chinese manufactured. He cannot think why mine is different, he's never before had such a query, and wonders of anything has been changed. I don't think so, the hub carrier and all that is factory fitted - I can see it's original CItroen fittings, down to the gaitor clips. But his statement about them being all the same (in his experience) sounds convincing.

So to get my car going again I need to solve this awkward problem, and find the part.

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 11 Aug 2010, 19:36

More info:

There is a CV joint with a longer stub that J & R Trading know of, for HDI vehicles with larger brakes, but they have 39 internal splines - 39/25 spline CV instead of the usual 34/25: in other words the one they supplied shouldn't go onto my driveshaft, but it does, so my driveshaft has 34 splines to fit the CV joint.

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 11 Aug 2010, 19:44

It seems that the 1.9 TD driveshaft is the same as the 16V fro 1995 onward, (with 48 ABS ring teeth). THis too is supposed to have the 135 mm length CV joint with 34/25 spline stub. I think I'll have to go to the citroen dealer to get an answer for this. It must be something to do with the hub carrier being odd too. I might have to change hubs and driveshafts together one day in the future if spares are a problem for this particular car.

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 11 Aug 2010, 22:37

What I'm going to do is use the old CV stub, rebuild the cage and bearings from the new as donor, and shrink fit an rust resistant ABS reluctor ring from www.ukpartsdirect.com (£14.99 + @2 pp)

Still would like to get the low down on this oddity...

Post by **Peter.N.** » 11 Aug 2010, 23:00

What is the actual problem? Is it to short to get the split pin in?

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 11 Aug 2010, 23:32

Hi Pete:

Yes that's it - the stub is too short, by about 10mm.

addo · Post by **addo** » 11 Aug 2010, 23:53

I went through these questions in my "Wanted - Caliper Carrier" thread.

Your findings interest me as they challenge my assumption about the different driveshafts. Can't beat actual measurements like you have taken! Thank you for posting your findings.

Diesel models of the Series II did have the wider track, as did anti-roll petrol cars. Larger diesels and V6 cars had bigger CV joints and boots - easily compared to the four-pot sizes.

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 12 Aug 2010, 00:34

Hi Addo:

From your thread,

Handy man said: all the Xantias fitted with the ML5T or AL4 gearboxes, Activa, 110HDi, V6, etc have a wider track and longer driveshafts. I believe the extra length is about 10mm per side. You can normally tell as these cars also have wider front wings!

And, you asked where the length was, and were told it is on the driveshaft, as cv stub length wouldn't give wheelbase extra length, which is true. However, my stub is also 10 mm longer! - and fits the larger carriers I have on my car, an estate. (I'll get some comparative photos tomorrow) ...

You said you wanted "Series II Activa (turbo, not V6) drive shafts" - I'm not sure why? (the V6 turbo driveshafts are listed as the same from exchange parts comanies that I've seen...) Bear in mind, J&R trading stated that they've sold thoudands , and never had this query come back - the estate and saloon ABS CV joints are all the same - V6 and Turbo.

You ask 'how rare are XUD9's on the UK with AL4 boxes', and think it must be very rare. That's what I've got - an estate version with the large 288mm disks, carriers and pads:
I suspect that on the AL4 TD Estate I've got may have NORMAL length driveshafts and it is the hubcarrier and CV joint together which are giving the extra 10mm length.

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 12 Aug 2010, 10:36

Here are the comparative images:

The one on the left, my original factory fitted, is longer. In the Second photo you can clearly see the extra 10mm space between spline and thread.

The overall lengths are 145mm (left pictured CV housing) and 135 mm (right pictured CV housing)

Post by **Peter.N.** » 12 Aug 2010, 11:24

The first one is non ABS, is that the difference?

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 12 Aug 2010, 11:35

Pete Write: The first one is non ABS, is that the difference?

No, the abs ring was removed, ready to refit a new one. It's the CV housing off my car, which was fitted with ABS.

I think what I've found is that, for xantias with wider front wheel base (AL4 cars), the norm is longer drive shafts, extended by 10mm (supposedly). BUt for my car, AL4 estate with wider and with large discs, it is the hub that extends the wheel base, not the driveshaft. I don't know how rare that is, or whether it is the norm for those cars (which I doubt as according to J&R trading). I haven't measured the driveshafts on my car - no need to at this time, and I don't see why on earth they can be longer if the hub carrier sends the wheels out by 10mm. .....
.... which means caution when ordering/swapping over replacement driveshafts, CV joints and hub carriers with this kind of spec xantia.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 12 Aug 2010, 12:50

Ah, right. One of the things I have always liked about Citroens is that they don't usually do this sort of thing, I don't think I have ever found anything different on my seven XMs in about 15 years!

I hope you get it sorted OK

Peter

addo · Post by **addo** » 12 Aug 2010, 13:50

Really appreciate that photo - ta. It's exactly what I'd have liked some weeks back. Not to worry; I have suitable driveshafts to pillage occupying the floor at chez jgra1.

I believe your car is 100% original. The part you've shown to be different, surprises me as you'd think that it would be cheaper to machine less versions of that piece as it's threaded and splined, and simply make different lengths of the centre section which only has CV couplings welded on. Can't argue with the evidence - I must owe you a beer.

John Plum · Post by **John Plum** » 12 Aug 2010, 13:54

ADDO: If you mean you've got a part for me, Ineed it! Im well and truly ***ed. I odered a ring, but I can't rebuild the CV joint as the internal dimensions are different from the (new) donor I had bought. The old cage is cracked.

addo · Post by **addo** » 12 Aug 2010, 14:02

Should have proofread my post - it scans with two meanings. I haven't so much got a "spare" set - just the pair jgra1 hasn't posted over yet. KP located them for me through a car being broken on Fleabay - they'd have the wrong inner stub unless going into a manual box.

French Car Forum

CV joint (MKII ABS) input stub - strange one

CV joint (MKII ABS) input stub - strange one

Solution