Hard ride, corners feel ok though?

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Bangermash
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Hard ride, corners feel ok though?

Post by Bangermash »

Hi all!

I have a Xantia with something of an ongoing problem. It's ridden hard a few times since I got it, a sphere change always fixed that though. Diagnosed by feeling which corner was "hard". Then the pressure regulator sprouted a leak and ticked a lot, at the same time as riding quite badly and handling that "just doesn't feel right". Dad's a mechanic, so he quickly found where the leak was coming from and dismantled the pressure regulator and fitted a new seal in it. It's stopped the leaking, but it still drives and rides quite badly. A push down on each corner makes it feel like all the corner spheres are OK. I was thinking it could maybe be the accumulator sphere? It doesn't tick like a machinegun though, just sometimes it ticks "a bit"...?
Basically, I'm stuck, dad's OK, but I want to get the opinions of some REALLY knowledgeable types, so came on here! :)
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Post by Xaccers »

How level is it riding?
Also, when did you last do a good session of citrobics?
Can you turn the large rubber feed pipe to the pump at all or is it nice and tight?
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Post by Bangermash »

Citrobics? Not heard of that, I'm guessing it's playing with the height lever? If so, been about a week since I moved it, but levelling is pretty good, it responds quite quickly to the height lever, it sags just a BIT when it's switched off (and makes an embarassing noise with it), but goes back up again pretty quickly after that, although it hardly has to move far. Occassionally it does seem to have to fix its height at other times too, but it's nothing too major. Brakes need a hard shove when starting from cold though, had a few brown trouser moments with that when manouvering in a small area when it's been sat there overnight!

Will have to check that pipe to the pump out though, one thing learned already! :)
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Post by Peter.N. »

Is it hydractive?
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Post by rmunns »

Be aware that when starting from cold the sysytem might need 10 or 15 seconds before the pressures are up. So you need to wait a little (until the STOP sign has extinguished) before you can expect brakes.
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Post by vince »

As has been said a few times on posts, the accumulator spheres are your ride quality, the corner spheres may very well be ok but usual symptoms are regulator "ticks" or groans at less than 30 second intervals....ie like mine at every 8 seconds :wink:

Time your intervals between ticks and post up the time
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Post by xantia_v6 »

Assuming it is not Hydroactive, if the corners are soft to press by hand, but the ride harsh, then check that the front and rear height are about correct.

If the height is correct, then the next suspect is air in the system. Bleed the system: Drop the height to minimum and back to maximum at least 3 times, waiting at least a minute at top and bottom (for the spheres to completely fill and empty).

It could also be that you have an air leak in the pipe from the LHM tank to the pump, which will just put more air in the suspension.
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Post by Bangermash »

Peter.N., not sure what evolution of hydropnuematics it is, it's an LX model, has 6 spheres altogether, the corner ones, the accumulator and the central one at the back.

Vince, pretty sure it's less than 30 sec, it varies, usually it's about every 7-8 secs I'd guess, but it can be like every second sometimes.

Xantia_v6, I'll try playing with the heights and checking for breaks in the LHM header to pump pipe at the same time as checking how loose the pipe at the pump end is, as recommended by Xac. Hadn't thought of air in the system, but it does remind me of mention on another site of a bleed screw when I was searching about for this kinda stuff online. Take it if that exists on my car, it's something best left well alone by an amateur like me?

I'm just praying it's not the pump itself, looked at the prices of those online, and :shock: .
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Post by Xaccers »

Also check the other end of the feed pipe to make sure it's tight.

Where the metal pipes come out of the pump (one is for suspension/brakes, t'other is for power steering) they go into a larger union that often leaks around it.
The seal for the large union is about 87p and there are two of them.

The bleed screw is a 12mm bolt on the regulator by the accumulator sphere, it's used mostly in depressurising the system.

If your regulator is ticking every 8 seconds, then your accumulator needs replacing.
It's easy to do, a new one is about £22 from GSF.

Make yourself a sphere removal tool or buy one.
Set the car on high, put axle stands under the front jacking points, set the car on low, the back will sink, the front will rise.
Turn the engine off and undo the bleed screw by 1/2 turn so that it whistles, then do it up once it stops.
Use the tool to free the accumulator sphere, then spin it off by hand, wiping up any LHM that drizzles out (or sprays out depending on just how flat the sphere is!).
Moisten the new o-ring with fresh LHM and fit it to the socket then screw in the new sphere finger tight.
Top up the LHM with the car on high, remove the axle stand and perform a good session of citrobics.
Job done.
If the accumulator needs replacing, chances are the anti-sink sphere (rear accumulator) needs replacing too.
That's just as easy, but you'll need a 9mm flare spanner, and a replacement pipe seal which GSF do, but I can never remember if it's a 3.5mm or 4.5mm that's needed.
Fit the spanner to the pipe nut behind the sphere, then unscrew the sphere and it screws the pipe nut out of the sphere. Replace the pipe seal (the old one often gets stuck in the old sphere), fit the o-ring to stop the new sphere rusting to the bracket it screws into, screw the sphere home again with the flare spanner holding the pipe nut so it screws back into the sphere, not forgetting to fit the seal on the end of the pipe.
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Post by Bangermash »

Cheers. :D Yeah I'm really hoping it is the sphere, just 'cos it's easy to replace and by far the cheapest fix! :)

FWIW my dad uses a tool for removing oil filters when it comes to spheres, I think it's some kinda agricultural one 'cos it's quite big and is a sturdy old thing, didn't even bend when one of the front spheres seemed to have been glued on and the tool needed a pipe over its handle for more leverage...
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Post by CitroJim »

If you do change spheres, this guide may be useful, especially for the rears as they can be very tight and need a procedure to be followed.

Sounds like your tool is well up to the job :D Sometimes they can be so tight a big hammer and cold chisel is the only way :twisted:
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Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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