Are any of the MKII 1.9TD's 'standard' without all this EGR and ECU stuff? ie, identical in every respect to the engine in my 94?
Also, what insurance group is a Facelift TD SX compared to a pre-facelift one?
Facelift Xantia questions
Moderator: RichardW
I've just found out a 98R Facelift 1.9TD SX is Group 12 insurance! Thats 3 groups higher than my 94 1.9TD SX. Why is it such a stupid insurance group? Performance remains unchanged - even a C5 2.2HDi SX is only Group 10! Why is it so expensive to insure a 92bhp family car? It makes no sense that it should cost 2 groups more than a newer, 140bhp version! I could ensure a 106 GTi for only an extra insurance group over a diesel powered Citroen 
Hi Nick. I'm new to this forum. Could you send me the PDF file on the facelift Xantia to "graham.geraghty@ntl.com", please. I would be most appreciative. Thanks a million.
By the way, I drive a silver 1.8 16v Xantia Plus, 1998 model
By the way, I drive a silver 1.8 16v Xantia Plus, 1998 model
EGR does apparently reduce engine life slightly, but I doubt it will make any real difference in the normal lifespan of a car. My 97 Xantia TD with EGR has now done 130000 miles and still runs like new. I don’t think it will have any problems getting to over 200k. It may be just a case that a non egr engine will be in the same condition at, say, 250k as an egr engine would be 225k !
Again, you can always disconnect it and quite a few people do, but strictly speaking this is against the law. But judging by the amount of mechanical knowledge displayed in “Traffic Cops”, they’ll probably be too busy trying to work out where the carburettor and spark plugs are, to notice that the egr has been disconnected [;)]
I don’t think it will make any difference to day-to-day reliability. If it goes wrong (which is rare) the worst that normally happens is the egr doesn’t work, which you may consider preferable anyway.
These later engines (from about 1996 onwards) do have some additional complications though. There is an ECU, which controls fuelling to some extent, egr operation and the immobiliser, but its not really a true engine management system in the way that say a 2.1 TD or HDi would have.
The plus side is that they are much easier to get through the smoke emissions test, and you don’t tend to get a blast of black smoke under hard acceleration, unlike the older XUD Turbo. I think they are very slightly more economical too, perhaps an extra 1 or 2 mpg.
Nick
Again, you can always disconnect it and quite a few people do, but strictly speaking this is against the law. But judging by the amount of mechanical knowledge displayed in “Traffic Cops”, they’ll probably be too busy trying to work out where the carburettor and spark plugs are, to notice that the egr has been disconnected [;)]
I don’t think it will make any difference to day-to-day reliability. If it goes wrong (which is rare) the worst that normally happens is the egr doesn’t work, which you may consider preferable anyway.
These later engines (from about 1996 onwards) do have some additional complications though. There is an ECU, which controls fuelling to some extent, egr operation and the immobiliser, but its not really a true engine management system in the way that say a 2.1 TD or HDi would have.
The plus side is that they are much easier to get through the smoke emissions test, and you don’t tend to get a blast of black smoke under hard acceleration, unlike the older XUD Turbo. I think they are very slightly more economical too, perhaps an extra 1 or 2 mpg.
Nick
To be honest I am only comparing two cars, a '95 1.9 TD which my Dad owned from new, and the '97 1.9 TD I bought at just under 3 years old. The '95 always tended to get 40-41 mpg, the '97 gets 42-43. This was at roughly the same mileage, with similar use, and service history for both cars.
I appreciate that comparing just two cars isn't really a scientific test though.
I appreciate that comparing just two cars isn't really a scientific test though.
Personally, if I was going to the trouble of changing my car I think I would go for an HDi, rather than another TD. However there is quite a lot more to go wrong with them, not that it necessarily will of course, but they do have a lot more engine-related electronics.
I'm not sure about auction prices, but I've just had quick look at the Autotrader site and the cheapest retail price is a W reg HDi SX at £3995, but most HDi SXs seem to be around the £5k mark.
I'm not sure about auction prices, but I've just had quick look at the Autotrader site and the cheapest retail price is a W reg HDi SX at £3995, but most HDi SXs seem to be around the £5k mark.
Hello Fox
When I was considering buying a Xantia diesel I consulted the Independent Citroen specialist that I use as to which would be the best buy. His view was that an HDI for 1.9 TD money would be a poor choice and that very deep pockets would be required as all faults are more expensive to rectify. Unfortunately I can not remember all the potential pit-falls [I bought a 1.9 TD by the way]but the one that sticks in my mind is the clutch. Apparently there are 2 known faults with the clutch that occur at approximately 30k and 70k and both are extremely expensive. Sorry its not better news [as 110 BHP is very tempting] but its best you are forwarned.
mark_sp
When I was considering buying a Xantia diesel I consulted the Independent Citroen specialist that I use as to which would be the best buy. His view was that an HDI for 1.9 TD money would be a poor choice and that very deep pockets would be required as all faults are more expensive to rectify. Unfortunately I can not remember all the potential pit-falls [I bought a 1.9 TD by the way]but the one that sticks in my mind is the clutch. Apparently there are 2 known faults with the clutch that occur at approximately 30k and 70k and both are extremely expensive. Sorry its not better news [as 110 BHP is very tempting] but its best you are forwarned.
mark_sp
I've heard of possible clutch problems with this engine too, I think it was a fault with the release bearing. Also the fuel lift pump in the tank can give trouble.
These faults don't just affect Xantias by the way, all Peugeot/Citroen HDi's are potentially prone to this.
The 1.9 certainly does have the advantage of being a well proven engine. With regular oil changes, cambelt replacement, and the cooling system kept in good condition, they are pretty bombproof.
These faults don't just affect Xantias by the way, all Peugeot/Citroen HDi's are potentially prone to this.
The 1.9 certainly does have the advantage of being a well proven engine. With regular oil changes, cambelt replacement, and the cooling system kept in good condition, they are pretty bombproof.