Bosch diesel pump

Post by **KennyW** » 14 Jan 2010, 10:07

Morning all,

I'm thinking ahead just in case i can't resolve my original pump problem

Would a second hand pump which i know is working, require to be recoded when fitted to my car.

What other pieces would be required.

Kenny

wheeler · Post by **wheeler** » 14 Jan 2010, 11:05

Not too sure that you can re code a second hand pump with the transponder imobiliser, I think they can only be matched to the CPH once.
May be better off bypassing it while the pump is off anyway.

Xaccers · Post by **Xaccers** » 14 Jan 2010, 11:06

If you source a second hand pump with an imobiliser, you'll need the code, or to have had the car started by it's owner and while running, had them remove the keypad.
Then don't ever fit a keypad to it without knowing the code.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 14 Jan 2010, 11:57

You would be better of with an earlier pump without keypad operation

wheeler · Post by **wheeler** » 15 Jan 2010, 18:31

If were talking about the car in kenny w signature it's a mk2 therefore it will have a transponder not a keypad. If its another mk2 pump you get i dont think it will re-code.

Post by **Peter.N.** » 15 Jan 2010, 19:15

I don't see why you cant fit a Mk1 pump, no electrics except the fuel solonoid.

Post by **CitroJim** » 15 Jan 2010, 20:48

Peter.N. wrote:I don't see why you cant fit a Mk1 pump, no electrics except the fuel solonoid.

No reason at all

Very straightforward job to fit a fully mechanical VP20 from a pre-96 XUD9T. I have done it.

Leave the ECU in place though as it controls the glowplugs and drives the tacho. You'll need to remove the engine management light though as it'll be constantly on.

Wire the cold advance solenoid to the glowplugs and find a switched 12v feed for the stop solenoid and the job's a good 'un...

I've also fitted on on a 306 1.9TD in place of a Lucas...

Post by **KennyW** » 17 Jan 2010, 10:35

Thanks for all the replies,

I think I have bypassed the immobiliser by returning the wiring on the black plug and run a sepearate wire for the solenoid from the live wire used on pre 97 for the solenoid.

The weather took a turn for the worst so unable to complete the rebuild of the old gal. It is looking good for Mon and Tues.

Has anyone bypassed the keypad on a mk1.

Sorry I'll improve my signiture so everyone knows what model mine is.

It is MK2 approx manufacture/bulit date of May 98, but to confuse things there are parts fitted from MK1's

Kenny

Post by **KennyW** » 17 Jan 2010, 21:52

Sorry but i have another question re the pump.

When the keypad was replaced for the transponder, i presume the operation is the same ie the key chip signal is sent by the transponder to the ecu which recognises the key code and then the ecudeactivtes the immobiliser which in turn allows the current to flow to the stop solenoid allowing the pump to send fuel to the injectors.

If this is the case you should be able to change the pump and immobiliser without any problems otherwise it's mind boggling the problems

kenny

Post by **KennyW** » 19 Jan 2010, 22:18

Hi all,

Here is the result of my work, nothing

Rebuilt the car and turned her over nothing. It would appear to be the same problem. No fuel coming from the pump to the injectors.
Solenoid definitely working.

It would appear my pump is knackered.

I have 2 options 2nd hand pump or have my pump checked and refurbished by specialist cost will be about the same.

Any thoughts from anybody re this.

Kenny

Post by **Peter.N.** » 19 Jan 2010, 22:43

These pumps are usually very reliable, I would go for a secondhand one there must be loads about for not to much money. Go for a Bosch mechanical if you can find one, with no keypad I have never had one fail.

Peter

Post by **KennyW** » 25 Jan 2010, 20:40

Thanks for the reply Peter,

I would like to replace like for like but the immobiliser and the ECU maybe a problem will seek advise from people I know in Auld Reekie, if it is possible.

Sorry about the delay in replying but I have also been trying to collect the toys i threw out of the pram (Just like the server)

.

Kenny

Post by **KennyW** » 28 Jan 2010, 21:04

Hi all,

A quick update, i have spoken to the owner of Lawson diesel here in auld reekie and he confirmed to do a check of my pump would cost around £120 notes and strip down, repair, rebuild and a check would cost £180 - £200.

He thinks it maybe a 2 or 3 different problems which i have maybe missed during my strip down.

So it looks like a 2nd hand pump with immob removed or an earlier mechanical pump, depends whats available.

Kenny

Post by **CitroJim** » 29 Jan 2010, 19:10

Yes, he's right there Kenny, there are three potential problems that could cause this:

1. Failure of the lift pump to generate transfer pressure, most likely the pressure regulator valve stuck open, damage to the pump vanes or a blockage.

2. Excessive wear on the HP pump piston causing excessive leakage and low delivery pressure, a blockage in the distributor head preventing the HP pump from filling or a broken HP pump piston.

3. A governor problem whereby the delivery regulator sleeve is held right over and not allowing the HP pump to fill. This can be caused by a mechanical problem with the various levers, stiffness in the mechanism or a jammed governor.

You can bench test a pump by arranging a small tankful of LHM (or Hydraflush or veg.oil but NEVER diesel) that will supply the pump. Apply voltage to the stop solenoid and spin the pump over by hand using a spanner on the sprocket nut.

I use a big funnel on the end of a length of clear hose as my test fuel supply tank.

Spin it until "fuel" starts to flow out of the return line (thus showing the lift pump is working and delivering transfer pressure) and keep turning it. You should see jets of fuel spit from the four delivery valves in turn as you keep rotating the pump. A good pump will "fire" fuel about four feet

Aim the delivery valves at a wall!

NEVER use diesel for this sort of test

As you've had it all apart once, there is nothing to loose, but everything to gain, in going over it again until you find the basic fault and it works on the bench.

My test is crude but it does basically show if the pump is fundamentally functional.

Post by **KennyW** » 31 Jan 2010, 10:35

Thanks for the reply Jim,

I was intending to have another look at my pump and will do your interesting bench test

I have obtained a 2nd hand pump from a scrappie for £70 notes including delivery.

Very hard to get a pump around Edinburgh area. No citroen specialists.

I am going to strip the pump again and check I have aligned up the various delivery holes etc.

Do you have anything in data which shows the correct alignments within.

Kenny