Ill be honest, despite using andyspares a number of times for my various peugeots and citroens, ive never noticed a forum before. So here i am[8)]
I own what i consider to be a good handling car, with what can only be classed as imho one fo the best 2l and below 16v engines ever. Of course, the trusty BX 16 Valve. Ive never driven a car like it (thats owning previously a 309 gti and 205 gti (1.6)) Superb engine, as you all obviously know:)
Here is the sad (and no doubt costly part). Despite being on only 72k, with a head rebuild at 60k, the Big end bearings seem to have given way (posibly due to either a high stress day at Santa Pod Raceway, or an oil leak). Tell tale clattering audible above 1500rpm, although strangly no noticable drop in oil pressure??
What im wondering is what are the costs of replacing the big end bearings, and more than likely a crank regrind with larger journels?
Any help would be appriciated.
Mat
My First Post, and a question.
Moderator: RichardW
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Jon
Our 16V racer has only killed its big end bearings once, and only because it over heated and blew its entire water and oil content at a track day. The car had been out for a good half hour without any fans. You'll have to forgive my niaeve ness but are the big end the ones right at the very bottom? (can you tell i havent played inside engines too much?) If its the ones im thinking of then they are VERY easy to do if you work from the bottom of the engine up, but the sump was a little difficult to get off on ours.
We have a very much dead 16v engine in the workshop we use for reference, and it doesnt seem too hard to strip the entire thing down so im guessing its not a major problem.
Is the ECU light anything to do with the Knock sensor kicking in?
We have a very much dead 16v engine in the workshop we use for reference, and it doesnt seem too hard to strip the entire thing down so im guessing its not a major problem.
Is the ECU light anything to do with the Knock sensor kicking in?
from memory, i think the code was 55. im sure it said ecu fault/knock sensor something like that. Im pretty sure that it has lost oil, as i reckon its just below minimum at the mo. To be hoenst vanny, im thinking the big end bearing shells or whatever...something like take the oil pump out of the way, then slide the shells along? someone technical could put us right?
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Jon
As i understand it the knock sensor detects just that, knocks in the engine. Its to detect Pinking and should automatically lower the revs until it goes away (and turn the ECU light on), its a basic strain guage from what im told. So if the shells are vibrating/rattling enough its probably triggering the knock sensor. In my nievety it was the shells i was thinking of, which if you can stand being dripped in oil, can be done without taking the engine out of the car. We did this to an engine that was on its way into the racer so had it 5 foot high chained up, it seemed like a real easy job to do once the sump was off, but i was playing with the hydraulics at the time.
If you have the time you could whap the sump off and have a look at the shells. The ones taken out of the race engine where obviously scored, but the bits they go into where perfectly machined!
If you have the time you could whap the sump off and have a look at the shells. The ones taken out of the race engine where obviously scored, but the bits they go into where perfectly machined!
There is already a post in there or id have suggested it, but for every one else the 'quick link' is;
http://pub38.bravenet.com/forum/show.ph ... 4234&cpv=1
http://pub38.bravenet.com/forum/show.ph ... 4234&cpv=1
We've got the motors presently out of a series one & a two BX 16Vs.
The series one had a motor problem due to it being raced with about 120K miles on the speedo.
The only difficult parts to whipping a motor out on one of these is the exhaust...enough to turn you to drink so if the motor has to come out, use an angle grinder with a cutting blade & save yourself the aggro; the gear linkages which can be a bit hard to access, the hydraulic lines to the F/D & regulator that are easy to forget about & the plastic pipes to the heater matrix. Apart from those little annoyances (which are no big deal once you're aware of them) they are very simple & straightforward.
The noise seems to indicate possibly big ends which I think you could almost do by lifting the motor on a hoist without actually removing from the car if that part of the operation is causing you some concern; personally, I'd drop it out & have a clean up, fit new octopus, clean & free up H/C and sort the plumbing out whilst I was on the job if it were me. That's the way we've approached it.
The noise doesn't HAVE to be the big ends though. I haven't spoken to my son who knows ECUs inside out, but from memory, the knock sensor effectively advances & retards the spark. As soon as any knocking (pinging) is felt it retards the spark accordingly. If the engine had a bad knock & the knock sensor was operating OK, the fuel consumption & performance should be terrible as it would retard the spark to compensate for this as the sensor thinks it is pinging.
I've heard it said that to do a component test on a knock sensor, set up a strobe type timing light & with it checking a mark on the flywheel, get someone to hit the intake manifold or the block somewhere near the sensor with a steel object (not TOO hard naturally) & watch the timing light. It should retard the spark momentarily when it detects the knock or vibration. If it doesn't, then chances are the knock sensor is stuffed & needs replacing. There is also a possibility that the oil pressure could be down for any of a number of reasons & that can't be discounted either although low oil pressure is also a sign of duff big ends. I recently had a weird knocking sound in my 16V that I wouldn't accept was a mettalic knock & it now appears from something we learned last night, that I could have air in one of my hydraulic tappets. The series one engine has just had the lot on it bled which is a bugger of a job but in my case should rid me of this strange intermittent tapping when I get around to doing it; thought I'd just throw that one in on the off chance that you strip you motor, so you'd be aware of it.
Alan S
The series one had a motor problem due to it being raced with about 120K miles on the speedo.
The only difficult parts to whipping a motor out on one of these is the exhaust...enough to turn you to drink so if the motor has to come out, use an angle grinder with a cutting blade & save yourself the aggro; the gear linkages which can be a bit hard to access, the hydraulic lines to the F/D & regulator that are easy to forget about & the plastic pipes to the heater matrix. Apart from those little annoyances (which are no big deal once you're aware of them) they are very simple & straightforward.
The noise seems to indicate possibly big ends which I think you could almost do by lifting the motor on a hoist without actually removing from the car if that part of the operation is causing you some concern; personally, I'd drop it out & have a clean up, fit new octopus, clean & free up H/C and sort the plumbing out whilst I was on the job if it were me. That's the way we've approached it.
The noise doesn't HAVE to be the big ends though. I haven't spoken to my son who knows ECUs inside out, but from memory, the knock sensor effectively advances & retards the spark. As soon as any knocking (pinging) is felt it retards the spark accordingly. If the engine had a bad knock & the knock sensor was operating OK, the fuel consumption & performance should be terrible as it would retard the spark to compensate for this as the sensor thinks it is pinging.
I've heard it said that to do a component test on a knock sensor, set up a strobe type timing light & with it checking a mark on the flywheel, get someone to hit the intake manifold or the block somewhere near the sensor with a steel object (not TOO hard naturally) & watch the timing light. It should retard the spark momentarily when it detects the knock or vibration. If it doesn't, then chances are the knock sensor is stuffed & needs replacing. There is also a possibility that the oil pressure could be down for any of a number of reasons & that can't be discounted either although low oil pressure is also a sign of duff big ends. I recently had a weird knocking sound in my 16V that I wouldn't accept was a mettalic knock & it now appears from something we learned last night, that I could have air in one of my hydraulic tappets. The series one engine has just had the lot on it bled which is a bugger of a job but in my case should rid me of this strange intermittent tapping when I get around to doing it; thought I'd just throw that one in on the off chance that you strip you motor, so you'd be aware of it.
Alan S